Pinnacle / Swanson Site (10th and Capitol)

Downtown, Midtown, and all parts east of 72nd.

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Out of the 3 proposals on Page 15, Which one is your favorite

Proposal 1: Shamrock
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77%
Proposal 2: Buckingham
2
9%
Proposal 3: Nexus
3
14%
 
Total votes: 22

almighty_tuna
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Pinnacle / Swanson Site (10th and Capitol)

Postby almighty_tuna » Wed Nov 03, 2004 11:11 am

Wow, this is really getting exciting with the considered possibilities.  Seems as though thoughts center around mixed use (I can almost hear a mantra) and the possibilities sound endless!  I got goosebumps!

http://www.omaha.com/index.php?u_pg=46&u_sid=1247771

The Pinnacle Foods property in downtown Omaha is being offered to a select group of developers known nationally for their successful downtown projects combining office, retail and residential space.


Grubb & Ellis/Pacific Realty is taking this approach to marketing the property at 1116 Capitol Ave. because of its key location, said Scott Heider, Grubb and Ellis' executive vice president.

"We call it the hub of the wheel," he said, describing a wheel with spokes leading to more than a dozen projects that are part of downtown's construction boom. They include the Qwest Center Omaha and other riverfront developments, several hotels, the First National and Union Pacific office towers and the Holland Performing Arts Center.

Pinnacle Foods' 3.24 acres is being offered for $6,332,580.

The land includes the frozen food plant stretching nearly two blocks west of 10th Street on the north side of Capitol as well as two small parking lots south of Capitol. It does not include all the parking that Pinnacle workers use to the south.

Redevelopment of the site has the potential to link the new development around the Qwest Center with the Old Market and the rest of downtown, Heider said.

"That is literally a defining redevelopment site, the only defining redevelopment site left," he said.

City Planning Director Bob Peters called it "a linchpin site" because of the potential to create "a very active pedestrian route" between the convention center and the performing arts center and Old Market.

Such a route, he said, is important to the success of both the convention center and the performing arts center.

"At the present time, the visible relationship is generally non-existent on the west side of 10th Street," Peters said. "It's not a pedestrian friendly area."

The city has a right of first refusal on the Pinnacle property because of an incentives package that was put together to keep the plant open in 2001.

The city would be notified of its option once Pinnacle Foods received a purchase contract, said Peters and Kelley Maggs, senior vice president for the company.

The company announced in April that it would close the plant, which has had a downtown presence for nearly a century, operating under the Swanson, Campbell and Vlasic names.

"We'd certainly look to work with the city or a purchaser who came along" about the city's preferences for how the property is redeveloped, Maggs said.

The plant, originally scheduled to close in October, will remain in production for another six or eight weeks, Maggs said.

Both Maggs and Heider said that even though the property hasn't been on the market until this week, there already have been inquiries from potential buyers.

"We anticipate this opportunity will not be out there very long," said Heider, who is working with Brinker Harding, a Pacific Realty associate and former chief of staff for former Mayor Hal Daub, to market the property.

Peters said the property could offer a prestige office location for a major corporation but more likely will be downtown's first opportunity for a true mixed-use project that combines residential and entertainment uses. Previous efforts, he said, have maintained a more suburban separation of uses than he expects to see at this site.

Heider predicted that the developers being targeted with information about the Pinnacle land, downtown's redevelopment and characteristics of the Omaha area would have similar views as city planners on what would be the best use for the land.

What would make the most sense, he and Harding said, would be to demolish the plant and develop a mixed-use project featuring apartments or condominiums along with office space and some type of retail.

Heider said that even though downtown has a surplus of office space right now, a project offering space in a unique project and location "would work real well."

Even though a number of projects are under way to renovate old buildings into downtown residences, only two projects offer new construction, Heider said.

The timing for retail development on the Pinnacle property could be perfect, Heider said, since downtown's residential population is growing and needs more retail businesses, particularly service-oriented retail.

The Pinnacle property is being presented to "a short list" of developers who have experience with downtown mixed-used projects, Heider said. He said they include firms in Chicago, Kansas City, Denver and Minneapolis.

"We're very excited about it," Heider said. "From a community standpoint, it will be exciting to see the next step in what's happening downtown."



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Postby projectman » Wed Nov 03, 2004 11:13 am

I hope it is well thought out whoever gets the opportunity to develop the site.

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Brad
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Postby Brad » Wed Nov 03, 2004 12:17 pm

I hope this will be an archtiectual wonder of the city. Something people from all over come to use. Also I hope whatever it is, that it is taller than a few floors.

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Postby redfield » Wed Nov 03, 2004 12:47 pm

Also I hope whatever it is, that it is taller than a few floors.

Amen.

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Postby projectman » Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:14 pm

I don't want to see another 2 story Kiewit Education Center/State Office building. What a waste of prime land!

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Postby Will » Wed Nov 03, 2004 1:16 pm

What a waste of prime land!
amen!
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Postby nebport5 » Wed Nov 03, 2004 4:41 pm

I wish the city could buy it. Too bad we don't have a creative mayor that would jump on this.


here's a thought: sell back the old UP center to UP who will enevitably need more space. there's a million right there.

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Postby StreetsOfOmaha » Wed Nov 03, 2004 11:07 pm

This sounds VERY promising. I hope that some aspect of the project has height to it. I'm envisioning something along the lines of Time Warner Center in NYC (on a slightly smaller scale, of course :) )

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Postby projectman » Thu Nov 04, 2004 8:11 am

Why smaller scale? Let's go for the pot of gold!!! :wink:

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Postby StreetsOfOmaha » Thu Nov 04, 2004 2:01 pm

Haha, I'm all for that!
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Postby nebport5 » Fri Nov 05, 2004 12:08 am

there's plenty of other space for high-rises. this would be the wrong use of this space.

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Postby StreetsOfOmaha » Fri Nov 05, 2004 12:13 am

Absolutely not. Any piece of land downtown, however big or small, is the perfect spot for a highrise.
"The right to have access to every building in the city by private motorcar in an age when everyone possesses such a vehicle is actually the right to destroy the city."
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Postby projectman » Fri Nov 05, 2004 8:07 am

I agree with Streets. That piece of land is very high profile and could be a showpiece for the city as people enter downtown or cross over from Iowa via 480.

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Postby redfield » Fri Nov 05, 2004 8:21 am

I'd like to see a highrise structure or two on this property too, but it's also very important that the area be pedestrian friendly.

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Postby Brad » Fri Nov 05, 2004 3:50 pm

That project would never fit on 3.2 Acres

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Postby AZCorey » Fri Nov 05, 2004 10:51 pm

I'm wondering if anyone with any influence or pull actually reads these posts? Meaning, there are so many great ideas discussed here, I wonder if any potential developers, builders, architechts, etc, actually see some of these ideas. I agree that a nice high rise building in that spot would be delightful. I will not be content until Omaha has at least 4 high rise skyscrapers in their skyline...!!! We already have 2, only 2 more....that's not asking too much, is it??

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Postby guy4omaha » Sat Nov 06, 2004 10:46 am

AZCorey wrote:I will not be content until Omaha has at least 4 high rise skyscrapers in their skyline...!!! We already have 2, only 2 more....that's not asking too much, is it??


It took more than 30 years to go from 1 to 2. Maybe it's not too much to ask but do you have 60 or more years of lifespan available to see it happen? It shouldn't take another 60 years obviously but I don't expect it to happen within the next ten either. I hope I am wrong. Ah, to have a real skyline... but at least we're not Wichita. Now there is a hurting skyline.
My son got a 27 on his ACT. No this score is not as high as what Jeff's son achieved. But one has to remember the paternal gene-pool my son has to overcome. On a PGPAB [Paternal Gene-Pool Adjusted Basis], my son's score is a 37 and Jeff's son's PGPAB ACT score is 19.

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Postby projectman » Sat Nov 06, 2004 6:03 pm

Phoenix, Albuquerque and El Paso are 3 other cities with lame skylines. Lets hope Omaha can get a couple more real sky scrapers. UP could have given us one but they chose the 19 story box.

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Postby nebport5 » Sat Nov 06, 2004 8:38 pm

I still say conecting the OM to the near north side is more important than our skyline at this point and alot more feasable. This plenty of other "high profile" locations for a highrise. This could be the last opportunity to connect these two areas. Think of the implications and of what coould occur throughout DT as a result. I could see a rebirth of the 16th St area or central business district if you want to call it that. The foot traffic we get, the better chance we have of getting "quality" retail to move in.

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Postby Will » Sat Nov 06, 2004 10:39 pm

The story said mixed use, so why not a 25 story building with a nice fountain and some green in front. The first floor be a couple of resturants. the next four or so floors could be retail. The 6 thru 15th floor could be for offices and then the last ten could be condos or arpments. The site is far enough away from the river so they could make use of undergroud parking for the resadents and office tenets. the second floor would make a great full service grocery store.
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Postby almighty_tuna » Sun Nov 07, 2004 2:09 am

I doubt they will, but it would be a great asset to make use of the old train tracks on Capitol Ave in conjunction with this project. Don't they go along the south side of the Pinnacle Foods land, out to Cuming and up past the Performing Arts Center?

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Postby AZCorey » Sun Nov 07, 2004 9:12 pm

projectman wrote:Phoenix, Albuquerque and El Paso are 3 other cities with lame skylines. Lets hope Omaha can get a couple more real sky scrapers. UP could have given us one but they chose the 19 story box.


As a resident of Phoenix I must absolutely agree that for the 5th largest city in the country, Phoenix's skyline is totally lame!! Nothing interesting or memorable about it.....

As for my earlier post about wanting 2 more skyscrapers for Omaha, even though it took 30 years to get two, I think with the boom downtown and the momentum that is building in DTO that more will be along the way soon enough.....it would only make sense based on the construction trends, the increase in downtown residency and the push to get big businesses to downtown.

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Postby Swift » Sun Nov 07, 2004 9:19 pm

AZCorey wrote:
projectman wrote:Phoenix, Albuquerque and El Paso are 3 other cities with lame skylines. Lets hope Omaha can get a couple more real sky scrapers. UP could have given us one but they chose the 19 story box.


As a resident of Phoenix I must absolutely agree that for the 5th largest city in the country, Phoenix's skyline is totally lame!! Nothing interesting or memorable about it.....

As for my earlier post about wanting 2 more skyscrapers for Omaha, even though it took 30 years to get two, I think with the boom downtown and the momentum that is building in DTO that more will be along the way soon enough.....it would only make sense based on the construction trends, the increase in downtown residency and the push to get big businesses to downtown.


12 years at the most.

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Postby StreetsOfOmaha » Sun Nov 07, 2004 9:22 pm

Ok, just a little peve of mine...

I know what people mean when they say "Omaha only has two skyscrapers, and it's taken us 30 years to get the second one." But, that's wrong. Yes, Woodmen and FNC are the tallest and most NOTICEABLE skyscrapers, but there are many skyscrapers in Omaha.

But anyway...HERE'S TO MORE SKYSCRAPERS!
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Postby projectman » Sun Nov 07, 2004 10:58 pm

Ok, per skyscrapers.com there are 52 minus the 7 that have been demolished. I think the standards for tall buildings have changed.

Maybe its just the tower envy we all have.

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Postby DMRyan » Sun Nov 07, 2004 11:33 pm

I guess it depends on what you want to deem a skyscraper. I don't usually consider 12 story midrises to be true skyscrapers, but the very meaning is subjective. Technically, a grain elevator can "scrape the sky" considering its surroundings.
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Postby projectman » Sun Nov 07, 2004 11:35 pm

I agree Ryan. For the midwest I guess 15 stories is a skyscraper but I would like Omaha to be able to compete with the big boys. To me skyscrapers should be 400 feet or taller.

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Postby StreetsOfOmaha » Mon Nov 08, 2004 7:39 pm

I, of course, want Omaha to have as many tall buildings as possible, but that doesn't change the fact that UPC, Landmark, Qwest, old FN building, Orpheum Tower, Kensington Tower, Mutual of Omaha, Commercial Federal, etc. aren't skyscrapers.

I suppose, you could make the argument that all the above listed are just "Highrises", not skyscrapers....it's all just names.
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Postby OmahaDevelopmentMan » Tue Nov 09, 2004 6:19 pm

I think a nice twin tower mixed-use development would be nice. It doesn't have to be too tall, maybe 30 stories, and could have maybe a grocery store, movie theatre, and maybe a few other stores. That would be in my opinion, the best possible use of the land. Let's just hope we don't get a little 3 story Kiewit Center of 8 story Hilton here. What a disaster that would be!

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Postby Will » Tue Dec 07, 2004 12:27 am

does anyone know what kind of timeline that we are on for when the project will be selected? I see this as a great chance for Fahey to redeem himself to all of those who are still mad at him over the marriott. The city gets to say what goes in there but it does not cost us any tax dollars :D
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Postby blueskyomaha » Tue Dec 07, 2004 9:41 am

The property is 3.24 acres and includes two small parcels that are in the parking lot across the street. The listing price is $6,332,580. The estimated price for the demolition is around $1.2M.
The potential for the property is unlimited, but the price, in my opinion, is too steep and is not reflective of current market rates.
My guess is that any local developer would have to partner to make any thing happen on the current site. Otherwise Omaha will have to rely on an out of towner with deeper pockets ...
Let's all hope that we hear something soon.

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Postby redfield » Tue Dec 07, 2004 12:35 pm

This site does have a ton of potential, but it also has some drawbacks. It is so close to the interstate, that it will take a bit of height to get any views on the north side of any structure that would go there. Not that I'm apposed to a tall structure. Thats what I want to see, but whatever goes there will have to deal with about 4-6 floors of unmarketable views of the underside of the interstate. Additionally, there will be concern, be it warranted or not, about noise from the interstate since almost any structure would be right on top of it practically.

As for it being a key spot connecting DT to the qwest center, in terms of pedestrian traffic, something would need to happen between the site itself and the old market, because the apartments accross the street, and the parking lot next to it aren't exactly well lit pedestrian friendly areas. On the other side of the site, pedestians are going to have to cross under the interstate, which isn't exaclty scenic at the moment either.

Does anybody know what is to become of the parking lot to the south of the site, which will not be a part of the sale? Please don't say Omaha park 9, or whatever number is next.

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Postby adam186 » Tue Dec 07, 2004 1:18 pm

Yes, views would be unmarketable if you were puting in condos or something else that requires a view. This would be a good reason to put in a movie theatre instead and build then build condos or anything else. Even a parking structure could eleminate some but not all of the problem. It's a small problem that developers can use for their advantage because it will draw a lot of attention to the building with it proximity to interstate.

I'm expecting a lot from this building and hope it will be great.

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Postby almighty_tuna » Tue Dec 07, 2004 2:00 pm

Agreed. Its proximity to the freeway should serve as nothing more than an incentive to build pedestrian friendly shops at street level, and theaters, etc in the levels above. That will kill two birds w/one stone and leave the great, marketable views to whatever office or condo space is built further above. I think it will go one of two ways: One, the developer will build below the freeway and not go for height...or it will be built in similar proportion to what the Butternut building was to the 10th street bridge.

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Postby DTO Luv » Wed Dec 08, 2004 10:48 pm

I don't think noise will be to bad a factor. The "L" train in Chicago goes not more than 10' from people's houses and they still live there. Avanzee, you beat me to it about putting a movie theatre on the 480 side. I hope that they build 2 towers. One for residences and one for offices and maybe adding a small hotel in it. I hope people don't put something lackluster here. The Hilton across the street is already a let down.
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Postby Ingersoll1978 » Wed Dec 08, 2004 11:11 pm

Living next to the L in Chicago makes it feel very urban. I liked living next to it. A freeway is an entirely different thing.

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Postby Greg S » Thu Dec 09, 2004 9:38 am

How is the Hilton a letdown? I hope the reasoning is not because it was not built as a high rise. I just read where it I believe is the only 4 star hotel in the entire state. I thought they did a great job making it "fit" with the design of the Qwest Center.

There are a lot of people that put too much emphasis on a city's downtown and basing it on how many skyscrapers there are. I think the best part of Omaha's is the Old Market.

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Postby Finn » Thu Dec 09, 2004 11:03 am

Amen Greg. The Hilton is a nice hotel with beautiful features and art. It does blend nicely with the Quest Center. I believe that it was built with the ability to accommodate more floors in the future - if the need arises. But, of course, if they build a few more stories as the market increases, some will complain that they didn't do it right in the first place. It is nice to see someone else post without skyscraper envy! :lol:

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Postby OhioStreetKid » Thu Dec 09, 2004 12:29 pm

Yes, Hilton haters should recognize the fact that the hotel is both the largest and highest rated hotel in Nebraska(not sure if that is saying a whole lot, but it shouldn't be minimized either).

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Postby OmahaDevelopmentMan » Thu Dec 09, 2004 3:20 pm

Guys, as much as I hate to say it...you're right. I mean a beautiful Hilton full of beautiful art and great amenities beats some Marriott in all ways...except height. But that theatre idea is great. It would be a good spot with the Qwest Center and old market right there. I just wish someone at maybe douglas theatres or amc thinks of that.


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