Omaha Forums

Some of my Creighton connections keep hearing rumors that St. Joseph's will close sooner or later. Trauma Center moves to Bergen, Creighton continues to use it for research.

What hospital would serve the areas around downtown then?

RNcyanide wrote:What hospital would serve the areas around downtown then?

The Med Center, I assume.

Anonymous wrote:Some of my Creighton connections keep hearing rumors that St. Joseph's will close sooner or later. Trauma Center moves to Bergen, Creighton continues to use it for research.

I have been hearing the same for about 6 months now.

As someone that works for a major supplier to Alegent Creighton Health, I can tell you that this is absolutely not happening in the short term.  They have already spent millions of dollars bringing the CUMC campus on Alegent Healthcare IT systems, and updating several departments at CUMC to the equipment Alegent has standardized on across their network of hospitals (lab, radiology, etc).  It would be foolish of them to have spent all this money just to shut the place down.

That being said, I'm sure as part of long term strategic planning, they're exploring all options for the campus, as well as the full Alegent hospital network here in town.  I can tell you that if long term plans keep them at the current CUMC campus, Alegent will have to spend >$10mil to update the facilities and bring it more in line with the modern feel and ameneties that Alegent is known for elsewhere (grand entryway/lobby, private rooms, etc).

With CUMC being a full teaching institution though, its not quite as simple as moving departments to other hospitals.  Besides the main doctors and nurses seeing patients, there's an entire academic infrastructure of professors doing research, residents, medical students  and their affiliated offices, labs, classrooms, etc.

The main issue with the hospital is that it can't sustain itself financially. Like I said, it would still be used for research, and may be converted to additional classroom space, but as a hospital? That is becoming less likely as time goes.

My source was someone who was transferred from St Joe to Bergen. Her impression is that St. Joe is not in the long-term plans for the company. Coincidentally, she used to work with someone who is getting a lot of local news airtime lately.

St Joe has been getting a bad reputation. There's a very disparaging politically incorrect name by which it's known. (Ask around or pm me if you feel a need to know.)

If this rumor is true, unless Catholic Health Initiatives which bought Alegent post CUMC acquisition eventually wants to dump the property, I have no idea why Alegent bought Tenant's stake in the hospital to begin with.

I don't know if it's still true but at one point the building was the largest in Nebraska, square footage wise.

jessep28 wrote:I have no idea why Alegent bought Tenant's stake in the hospital to begin with.

What they were buying was the patient revenue.

Omababe wrote:

jessep28 wrote:I have no idea why Alegent bought Tenant's stake in the hospital to begin with.

What they were buying was the patient revenue.

Or,were they were buying the services that could transport to Bergan (Cardiology, GI, NICU, High risk OB)?  Then dump gen med, fam med, and trauma.

Can't believe that they would move trauma to Bergan.  Don't think that the Bloods and the Yuppies mix too well.  And with  ACO's, you would get crunched on your patient satisfaction score.

An interesting rumor was heard from a CU med staff member.  That CHI wants to have regional trauma coverage located in a few centers (take advantage of scale).  They want to use St Joe to be a 7 day a week trauma center for all of eastern Nebraska and western Iowa hospitals in their ACO.

ACO stands for Accountable Care Organizations for those who don't know.

Heard the same thing a few days ago.

Personally doubting this happens, but I guess stranger things have happened.

My sister works in one of the research labs. No one there has heard anything about this.

Alegent Creighton: Big changes are coming

Rick Ruggles and Bob Glissmann: World-Herald staff writers wrote:Hachten and the Rev. Timothy Lannon, Creighton University's president, stressed that no decisions on consolidation of services, hospital closures or anything else have been made. They suggested, though, that one or more hospitals' emphasis may change from inpatient to mostly outpatient services.

Coyote wrote:Alegent Creighton: Big changes are coming

Rick Ruggles and Bob Glissmann: World-Herald staff writers wrote:Hachten and the Rev. Timothy Lannon, Creighton University's president, stressed that no decisions on consolidation of services, hospital closures or anything else have been made. They suggested, though, that one or more hospitals' emphasis may change from inpatient to mostly outpatient services.

Sounds like changes are in the works, but the reality is that Midlands sounds like its in for even more of a shakeup than CUMC is.  

Midlands was never terribly busy, and its slowed down even more since Bellevue opened, and Midlands lost the Offutt referral business to Bellevue....

I think that what the article outlined for CUMC (and the whole Alegent system) was always in the works, this will just speed up the process.  Specialization of each of the campuses to focus on their strengths, and avoid as much duplication of resources as possible.  Just like Immanuel doing othopedics, rehab and phsyc, as they've been pushing that site for several years now...

CUMC is a cringeworthy abbreviation.

http://www.omaha.com/article/20130927/L ... g-hospital

They are considering the possibility of making Bergan Mercy a teaching hospital.

Three Options
Alegent Creighton Health and Creighton University leaders are considering three options to improve and expand their trauma center and academic medical center, which for years have been based at the CU Medical Center.

The options:

1. Spend $270 million to upgrade and renovate CU Medical Center. Alegent Creighton leaders say that would take seven to eight years because it would have to be done in steps.

2. Improve and expand Bergan Mercy Medical Center so it could take on the job of trauma center and academic medical center. That would cost $115 million to $135 million, and possibly up to $200 million. This and Option 3 could lead to Creighton University Medical Center becoming an outpatient clinic, possibly with an emergency room.

3. Build a brand new academic medical center, including a trauma center, at a site that hasn't been chosen. That would cost $400 million or more.

I'd prefer if they built the new one instead.

It would be nice to have a more westerly trauma center, since both of the current ones are way out east. I think Bergan would be a good choice.

RNcyanide wrote:It would be nice to have a more westerly trauma center, since both of the current ones are way out east. I think Bergan would be a good choice.

Like a lot of things, this is not just an "Omaha Trauma Center" it serves the whole region....  

The Eastern 1/2 of Nebraska and Western Iowa.  

Not sure how far east it serves, but a would assume 1/2 way to Des Moines.  To the west it serves all the way to North Platte.

Out of the three options its likely they chose the first, move trama to Bergan and use CUMC as a outpatient.  I would like to see em build a new one but the cost estimate on it is alot more then the system may want to spend

Anonymous wrote:Out of the three options its likely they chose the first, move trama to Bergan and use CUMC as a outpatient.  I would like to see em build a new one but the cost estimate on it is alot more then the system may want to spend

Plus the metro needs another hospital like it needs another indoor mall.  We have way to many beds as it is.

bigredmed wrote:

Omababe wrote:

jessep28 wrote:I have no idea why Alegent bought Tenant's stake in the hospital to begin with.

What they were buying was the patient revenue.

Or,were they were buying the services that could transport to Bergan (Cardiology, GI, NICU, High risk OB)?  Then dump gen med, fam med, and trauma.

Can't believe that they would move trauma to Bergan.  Don't think that the Bloods and the Yuppies mix too well.  And with  ACO's, you would get crunched on your patient satisfaction score.

An interesting rumor was heard from a CU med staff member.  That CHI wants to have regional trauma coverage located in a few centers (take advantage of scale).  They want to use St Joe to be a 7 day a week trauma center for all of eastern Nebraska and western Iowa hospitals in their ACO.

So I have to do a hedge on this bet.

The three options listed in the OWH:

1.  Move CU to Bergan for $115 M
2.  Rebuild CU for $270 M
3.  Build a new place for both for $400 M

Which is most likely to happen?

I will take mixing the Bloods and the Yuppies for a thousand, Alex...

(But CHI is not nearly as adverse to metal detectors as the Jesuits, so I would think that Bergan will be much like it is now, just busier at night.)

It might bring more of those icky people from Northeast Omaha down to 72nd and Center with a trauma center at Bergan, so there might be some community pushback for a move.

jessep28 wrote:It might bring more of those icky people from Northeast Omaha down to 72nd and Center with a trauma center at Bergan, so there might be some community pushback for a move.

Maybe, but they will just counter that UNMC is still there and that they are open to all of the community, blah blah blah.   Meanwhile, they will still have Midlands for the South, and Lakeside for the West.   Immanuel for the North.   The clinic stuff sounds like it would stay at CU, which means the exposure to the gang bangers is going to be passing in the halls (happens already) and in the ED (will be more, but safer than currently at CU).   Other than the true crypto or overt racists, Bergan should handle their crowds fine.  The others will just go to Midlands or Lakeside.   Their staff will be another, but considering how bad the health professions employment picture will be in a couple of years, the leaders of CHI won't be worrying about that, as there will be no place for them to go.

Still, will be interesting.

Comments like yours will serve to keep the "community push back" from happening in an organized overt manner.  You will see further westward migration for healthcare.  No specific reason given, just a lot of people saying that it's "more convenient" to do so.   So CHI will be thanking you.

A new CEO for CHI Nebraska is in the process of being hired, and then once that person is onboard, this decision making process should happen relatively quickly.  They're thinking that they'll know what direction they're going sometime in Q1 2014...

The one thing I did hear is that its pretty much a done deal that either Midlands or CUMC will end up no longer as a hospital.  Too many beds in total.  Just a matter of which they'll cut.

Ben wrote:A new CEO for CHI Nebraska is in the process of being hired, and then once that person is onboard, this decision making process should happen relatively quickly.  They're thinking that they'll know what direction they're going sometime in Q1 2014...

The one thing I did hear is that its pretty much a done deal that either Midlands or CUMC will end up no longer as a hospital.  Too many beds in total.  Just a matter of which they'll cut.

A big, not too good hospital in a lucratively insured part of town or a hospital in the inner city with walk up service for gun shot wounds?  Hmmm.  Which will they pick?

Considering what went on at the Shark Club last weekend, Bergan might be accepting walk-up gunshot victims if they move the trauma center there.

jessep28 wrote:Considering what went on at the Shark Club last weekend, Bergan might be accepting walk-up gunshot victims if they move the trauma center there.

They're still having problems at the Shark Club? That place really turned the corner in about 2005, from what I remember.

Three people were shot there last Friday night. Nothing life threatening though:

http://www.omaha.com/article/20131019/N ... 18514/1694

bigredmed wrote:

Ben wrote:A new CEO for CHI Nebraska is in the process of being hired, and then once that person is onboard, this decision making process should happen relatively quickly.  They're thinking that they'll know what direction they're going sometime in Q1 2014...

The one thing I did hear is that its pretty much a done deal that either Midlands or CUMC will end up no longer as a hospital.  Too many beds in total.  Just a matter of which they'll cut.

A big, not too good hospital in a lucratively insured part of town or a hospital in the inner city with walk up service for gun shot wounds?  Hmmm.  Which will they pick?

Believe it or not, if it wasn't for the major physical remodel of CUMC needed, I'd say hands down close Midlands - not that I have a say in these things.  They lost over 1/3 of their buisiness when Bellevue Med Ctr opened - which not only took civilian population of Bellevue away, but also the Offutt contract for inpatient (non-critical) stuff.  They're so slow that they've already shut their OB practice, as its hard to keep competency levels up and justify a full time staff for 20-30 babies/yr.  Its far and away the lowest volume of any of the hospitals in the Alegent Creighton system..

Ben wrote:

bigredmed wrote:

Ben wrote:A new CEO for CHI Nebraska is in the process of being hired, and then once that person is onboard, this decision making process should happen relatively quickly.  They're thinking that they'll know what direction they're going sometime in Q1 2014...

The one thing I did hear is that its pretty much a done deal that either Midlands or CUMC will end up no longer as a hospital.  Too many beds in total.  Just a matter of which they'll cut.

A big, not too good hospital in a lucratively insured part of town or a hospital in the inner city with walk up service for gun shot wounds?  Hmmm.  Which will they pick?

Believe it or not, if it wasn't for the major physical remodel of CUMC needed, I'd say hands down close Midlands - not that I have a say in these things.  They lost over 1/3 of their buisiness when Bellevue Med Ctr opened - which not only took civilian population of Bellevue away, but also the Offutt contract for inpatient (non-critical) stuff.  They're so slow that they've already shut their OB practice, as its hard to keep competency levels up and justify a full time staff for 20-30 babies/yr.  Its far and away the lowest volume of any of the hospitals in the Alegent Creighton system..

I dont know much about this stuff but does the growing population south make them want to limp Midlands along?  Eventually there will be enough rooftops down there that it might be a good location again.  CUMC is what it is and likely wouldnt change much.  Available space at Midlands should be a plus to over time.

Anonymous wrote:

Ben wrote:

bigredmed wrote:

Ben wrote:A new CEO for CHI Nebraska is in the process of being hired, and then once that person is onboard, this decision making process should happen relatively quickly.  They're thinking that they'll know what direction they're going sometime in Q1 2014...

The one thing I did hear is that its pretty much a done deal that either Midlands or CUMC will end up no longer as a hospital.  Too many beds in total.  Just a matter of which they'll cut.

A big, not too good hospital in a lucratively insured part of town or a hospital in the inner city with walk up service for gun shot wounds?  Hmmm.  Which will they pick?

Believe it or not, if it wasn't for the major physical remodel of CUMC needed, I'd say hands down close Midlands - not that I have a say in these things.  They lost over 1/3 of their buisiness when Bellevue Med Ctr opened - which not only took civilian population of Bellevue away, but also the Offutt contract for inpatient (non-critical) stuff.  They're so slow that they've already shut their OB practice, as its hard to keep competency levels up and justify a full time staff for 20-30 babies/yr.  Its far and away the lowest volume of any of the hospitals in the Alegent Creighton system..

I dont know much about this stuff but does the growing population south make them want to limp Midlands along?  Eventually there will be enough rooftops down there that it might be a good location again.  CUMC is what it is and likely wouldnt change much.  Available space at Midlands should be a plus to over time.

Bellevue is too far east for the people in southern Papillion, LaVista, Chalco, and Springfield.  Gretna is far enough away that any of the hospitals are a hike, so they don't factor in.  Midlands will be the winner between CUMC and them, so that CHI can keep the well insured in central and southern Sarpy County.

I think that Gretna sends their patents to Lakeside. I'll have to listen to the Sarpy Fire feed on my police scanner app sometime to confirm.

If the Alegent/Creighton Trauma Center is moved to Bergan, do you think they will improve their Helicopter Pad?  Right not its way off in the north 40...

jessep28 wrote:I think that Gretna sends their patents to Lakeside. I'll have to listen to the Sarpy Fire feed on my police scanner app sometime to confirm.

From the town of Gretna according to Google Maps, Lakeside is roughly 2 miles closer than Midlands. Likely closer than that in the Northern parts of Gretna Fire's operating area.

Another data point here.

Last week a friend of mine went to see his cardiologist, who practices at Lakeside and Bergen. He apparently spoke along the line that the closing of St. Joe is all but a done deal.

jessep28 wrote:

jessep28 wrote:I think that Gretna sends their patents to Lakeside. I'll have to listen to the Sarpy Fire feed on my police scanner app sometime to confirm.

From the town of Gretna according to Google Maps, Lakeside is roughly 2 miles closer than Midlands. Likely closer than that in the Northern parts of Gretna Fire's operating area.

Definitely.  Lakeside is not in play at the moment.