Holland's Greenspace

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Coyote
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Holland's Greenspace

Postby Coyote » Tue Jul 28, 2015 8:17 pm

SaveOmaha wrote:They're going to try and demo the Omaha landmark Specht Building next to Frankie Pane's again?


I heard today that Holland is going to turn that greenspace to the east into parking... Don't know if that is new news though...
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Re: New HDR Corporate Headquarters

Postby daveoma » Wed Jul 29, 2015 12:20 am

Coyote wrote:
SaveOmaha wrote:They're going to try and demo the Omaha landmark Specht Building next to Frankie Pane's again?


I heard today that Holland is going to turn that greenspace to the east into parking... Don't know if that is new news though...

That's horrible! Can't they work out an agreement with the city to share the parking garage to the north?

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Re: New HDR Corporate Headquarters

Postby iamjacobm » Wed Jul 29, 2015 1:29 am

daveoma wrote:
Coyote wrote:
SaveOmaha wrote:They're going to try and demo the Omaha landmark Specht Building next to Frankie Pane's again?


I heard today that Holland is going to turn that greenspace to the east into parking... Don't know if that is new news though...

That's horrible! Can't they work out an agreement with the city to share the parking garage to the north?


Hahahaha. Omaha using our parking efficiently? That's a riot.

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Re: New HDR Corporate Headquarters

Postby Coyote » Wed Jul 29, 2015 7:33 am

They are negotiating with HDR for parking, but, from what I just heard, the green space is already targeted as parking. I asked about the supposed outdoor 'theatre', but that idea seems to be forgotten, at least I thought that space was going to be some sort of outdoor venue...
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Re: New HDR Corporate Headquarters

Postby MTO » Wed Jul 29, 2015 7:36 am

Well they already have s courtyard. If they wanted to have something outside in s larger scale they should put on a Julliard in the park thing across the street.
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Re: New HDR Corporate Headquarters

Postby Joe_Sovereign » Wed Jul 29, 2015 12:17 pm

MTO wrote:Well they already have s courtyard. If they wanted to have something outside in s larger scale they should put on a Julliard in the park thing across the street.


The reason they had to tear down all of the buildings to the east was for an outdoor venue. It was suppose to also be rented for events but there hasn't been a tent there since the first year the CWS was downtown. I hope the city stops them from putting a surface lot there.

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Re: New HDR Corporate Headquarters

Postby MTO » Wed Jul 29, 2015 12:57 pm

But that valet is slower than shįt, this could speed things up.
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Re: New HDR Corporate Headquarters

Postby Midwestern » Wed Jul 29, 2015 1:18 pm

Joe_Sovereign wrote:
MTO wrote:Well they already have s courtyard. If they wanted to have something outside in s larger scale they should put on a Julliard in the park thing across the street.


The reason they had to tear down all of the buildings to the east was for an outdoor venue. It was suppose to also be rented for events but there hasn't been a tent there since the first year the CWS was downtown. I hope the city stops them from putting a surface lot there.


What were the buildings that were torn down? I don't remember them. Anyone have pics?

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Re: New HDR Corporate Headquarters

Postby Coyote » Wed Jul 29, 2015 2:07 pm

You don't remember Frankie Payne?
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Re: New HDR Corporate Headquarters

Postby Uffda » Wed Jul 29, 2015 8:07 pm


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Re: New HDR Corporate Headquarters

Postby Omababe » Thu Jul 30, 2015 6:55 am

Coyote wrote:You don't remember Frankie Payne?


You mean this one:

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Re: New HDR Corporate Headquarters

Postby Coyote » Sat Aug 01, 2015 9:18 pm

Coyote wrote:
SaveOmaha wrote:They're going to try and demo the Omaha landmark Specht Building next to Frankie Pane's again?


I heard today that Holland is going to turn that greenspace to the east into parking... Don't know if that is new news though...


Holland's Greenspace:

Image
Image

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Re: New HDR Corporate Headquarters

Postby MTO » Sat Aug 01, 2015 9:25 pm

If this were NYC a highrise with a cantalever over those buildings would be a certainty but this is Omaha :?. Maybe a random fire takes care of them so new development can put the lot to actual use.
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Re: New HDR Corporate Headquarters

Postby omahahawk » Tue Aug 04, 2015 7:42 am

Coyote wrote:
Coyote wrote:
SaveOmaha wrote:They're going to try and demo the Omaha landmark Specht Building next to Frankie Pane's again?


I heard today that Holland is going to turn that greenspace to the east into parking... Don't know if that is new news though...


Holland's Greenspace:

Image


Hope not, this space doesn't look that big for parking anyway and seems like it could be used for something much better. The Holland has been there for a decade and getting along just fine without a parking lot there. Although I am assuming this would be pay parking and Omaha Performing Arts may be wanting the additional revenue. If I can't get my normal spot when I go to a show there or I'm running late I will go ahead and use the parking garage immediately to the south on Capital and I can tell you there is always plenty of space in there at night. I would love to see a suitable development there but if nothing else, I wouldn't mind if a little landscaping and benches were put in and it was just left as a green space.

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Re: New HDR Corporate Headquarters

Postby Uffda » Tue Aug 04, 2015 8:16 am

omahahawk wrote:
Holland's Greenspace:

Image


Hope not, this space doesn't look that big for parking anyway and seems like it could be used for something much better. The Holland has been there for a decade and getting along just fine without a parking lot there. Although I am assuming this would be pay parking and Omaha Performing Arts may be wanting the additional revenue. If I can't get my normal spot when I go to a show there or I'm running late I will go ahead and use the parking garage immediately to the south on Capital and I can tell you there is always plenty of space in there at night. I would love to see a suitable development there but if nothing else, I wouldn't mind if a little landscaping and benches were put in and it was just left as a green space.[/quote]

I think that green area is a little over half of the lot that HDR is going to build on so same amount of parking. I haven't been to an event at the Holland in years so my question is where do the event goers park now streets, the lot that HDR is building on, the parking garage on Capital? With the city extending the parking meter times that garage may get more use.

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Re: New HDR Corporate Headquarters

Postby omahahawk » Tue Aug 04, 2015 8:26 am

omahahawk wrote:
Coyote wrote:
Coyote wrote:
SaveOmaha wrote:They're going to try and demo the Omaha landmark Specht Building next to Frankie Pane's again?


I heard today that Holland is going to turn that greenspace to the east into parking... Don't know if that is new news though...


Holland's Greenspace:

Image


Hope not, this space doesn't look that big for parking anyway and seems like it could be used for something much better. The Holland has been there for a decade and getting along just fine without a parking lot there. Although I am assuming this would be pay parking and Omaha Performing Arts may be wanting the additional revenue. If I can't get my normal spot when I go to a show there or I'm running late I will go ahead and use the parking garage immediately to the north on Capital and I can tell you there is always plenty of space in there at night. I would love to see a suitable development there but if nothing else, I wouldn't mind if a little landscaping and benches were put in and it was just left as a green space.

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Re: New HDR Corporate Headquarters

Postby skinzfan23 » Tue Aug 04, 2015 12:02 pm

Yes, the Holland is only a 2,000 seat venue. The buildings better not be torn down. The Specht building was built in 1884 and is one of two extant cast-iron front buildings in Omaha.

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Re: New HDR Corporate Headquarters

Postby MTO » Tue Aug 04, 2015 12:09 pm

Nostalgia is overrated in fact it's a weakness doze them!
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Re: New HDR Corporate Headquarters

Postby iamjacobm » Tue Aug 04, 2015 12:22 pm

MTO wrote:Nostalgia is overrated in fact it's a weakness doze them!


Yeah screw productive storefronts facing GLM. We need another dead parking garage facing our DT park!

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Re: New HDR Corporate Headquarters

Postby GetUrban » Tue Aug 04, 2015 12:46 pm

iamjacobm wrote:
MTO wrote:Nostalgia is overrated in fact it's a weakness doze them!


Yeah screw productive storefronts facing GLM. We need another dead parking garage facing our DT park!


Watch, they'll try to appease the destruction by re-assembling the Salvage-dogged Specht facade in the parking garage lobby.
He said "They are some big, ugly red brick buildings"
...and then they were gone.

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Re: New HDR Corporate Headquarters

Postby MTO » Tue Aug 04, 2015 3:20 pm

...not for parking but for anything denser and or newer...
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Re: New HDR Corporate Headquarters

Postby GetUrban » Tue Aug 04, 2015 3:41 pm

It would be extremely dense to tear them down. Newer is not always better. I'll admit the original context they were built within is long gone.
He said "They are some big, ugly red brick buildings"
...and then they were gone.

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Re: New HDR Corporate Headquarters

Postby MTO » Tue Aug 04, 2015 5:02 pm

New typically* has higher energy efficiency standards also supurior safety standards from fire to disability features. Old is novel, get over it.
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Re: New HDR Corporate Headquarters

Postby iamjacobm » Tue Aug 04, 2015 6:11 pm

Should we move this convo?

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Re: Holland's Greenspace

Postby TitosBuritoBarn » Wed Aug 05, 2015 1:38 am

Yeah, that's why so many people and jobs are moving to Austin. All the new buildings have great fire safety features.
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Re: Holland's Greenspace

Postby PotatoeEatsFish » Wed Aug 05, 2015 4:31 am

That lot would be perfect for a condo tower!
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Re: New HDR Corporate Headquarters

Postby GetUrban » Wed Aug 05, 2015 8:55 am

(Note: moved this over from the HDR HQ thread, since it was left behind when the Holland's Greenspace thread was created)

On the site east of Holland, I heard the owners of the building on the southeast corner are meeting with the Omaha Performing Arts reps this week.

I'd hate to see those buildings go (especially Specht) after the effort that has been expended to save them so far. Sounds like yet another Historic Preservation fight is on the horizon. Old photos of the southeast corner show the (now Alvine) building was once 4 stories but they lost the two upper stories in a fire long ago...I think it was early 20th century.

The view of the buildings from the alley side doesn't do them much justice....it is a much nicer view from Douglas & 11th. It seems like having even well-landscaped parking east of the Holland will really detract from the view of that building itself. I can't believe adding that small amount of parking would be that important with all of the other parking choices nearby, possibly even in the new HDR development, which could be shared with the Holland. It's only about a 2,000 seat venue, right?

skinzfan23 wrote:Yes, the Holland is only a 2,000 seat venue. The buildings better not be torn down. The Specht building was built in 1884 and is one of two extant cast-iron front buildings in Omaha.
He said "They are some big, ugly red brick buildings"
...and then they were gone.

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Re: Holland's Greenspace

Postby GetUrban » Wed Aug 05, 2015 8:58 am

PotatoeEatsFish wrote:That lot would be perfect for a condo tower!


There are better locations for that...like the Old U.P. site filling in first with the Lanoha Tower.
He said "They are some big, ugly red brick buildings"
...and then they were gone.

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Re: Holland's Greenspace

Postby Joe_Sovereign » Wed Aug 05, 2015 10:45 am

This is crazy. Isn't the adjacent giant City owned Union Pacific parking garage mostly empty by the time any Holland performance starts, plus the HDR design can include parking for the Holland, plus the old UP lot could become temporary parking while HDR is built, or walk a block or two to get to a f*cking show.

I wouldn't see it as the best use of that space but there is enough space without tearing anything down to add a couple hundred parking spot garage in the existing Green Space.

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Re: Holland's Greenspace

Postby GetUrban » Wed Aug 05, 2015 11:03 am

Hopefully this rumor will turn out to NOT be true...at least the part about taking down the remaining historical buildings. If it was a blank slate already, I agree it would be a good site for a mixed-use high-rise, which would have a great view of GLM. Of course you could still save the historical buildings and slip-in a mixed-use highrise in between them and the Holland.

The GLM does seem to lack much happening building-wise along the perimeter. The Landmark Center on the south side is DOA at street level from 12th-11th. That would be great to move that data center and open up the bulk of the first floor of Landmark for restaurants/retail, etc....sorry venturing off-topic again.
He said "They are some big, ugly red brick buildings"
...and then they were gone.

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Re: Holland's Greenspace

Postby mr. omaha » Wed Aug 05, 2015 12:57 pm

If those buildings are demolished for parking when the UP garage is RIGHT FREAKING THERE AND UNUSED AFTER 5PM I am going to lose my sh#t. Why does this keep coming up? What brilliant mind on the Holland board pitched this? WHY ARE SO MANY PEOPLE IN THIS CITY AGAINST WALKING A COUPLE BLOCKS TO GET TO THEIR DESTINATION!?!???!???!??!!!!? Seriously... Stuff like this makes me hate living in this town. Omaha: We Don't Coast... Because we demolished the coast for surface parking.

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Re: Holland's Greenspace

Postby MTO » Wed Aug 05, 2015 1:18 pm

A parking garage with retail and residential is what I'm hoping.
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Re: Holland's Greenspace

Postby Joe_Sovereign » Wed Aug 05, 2015 1:52 pm

MTO wrote:A parking garage with retail and residential is what I'm hoping.


That sounds fine if the build around the existing historic buildings. You don't tear down 130 year old buildings for a parking lot.

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Re: Holland's Greenspace

Postby MTO » Wed Aug 05, 2015 1:56 pm

No, not for a parking lot.
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Re: Holland's Greenspace

Postby skinzfan23 » Wed Aug 05, 2015 2:31 pm

I don't think you tear them down to build a parking garage either. There is plenty of parking downtown and if the garage is needed so badly they can build around the buildings or on another lot. There is still a ton of vacant lots downtown that I wouldn't mind a garage on.

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Re: Holland's Greenspace

Postby Coyote » Wed Aug 05, 2015 2:37 pm

If I remember correctly what I overheard, this was not necessarily going to be turned into a garage per se, just parking was mentioned.
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Re: Holland's Greenspace

Postby Joe_Sovereign » Wed Aug 05, 2015 2:50 pm

Tearing down art (historic architecture) for a surface lot so people can park conveniently to celebrate a different type of art (music) is extraordinarily stupid, and a case of actual irony.

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Re: New HDR Corporate Headquarters

Postby Joe_Sovereign » Wed Aug 05, 2015 2:58 pm

Holland's Greenspace:

Image

In New York they build 1000ft towers in a fraction of this open space. If they build a parking garage or, hopefully not, a surface lot in the green space that is one thing, but tearing down historic buildings for a surface lot would be a crime.

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Re: Holland's Greenspace

Postby Midwestern » Wed Aug 05, 2015 3:30 pm

Am I the only one who dislikes the Gene Leahy Mall? I hate how it destroyed a lot of neat 2-3 story buildings and also made it basically impossible for businesses to thrive on Douglas St along GLM. We have very few of those thin, older historical 2-3 story "main street" type buildings left. I'd rather have a lot more of those buildings back than Jobber's Canyon. Oh well.

But goodness I hope they don't bulldoze those for any sort of parking.

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Re: Holland's Greenspace

Postby GetUrban » Wed Aug 05, 2015 5:18 pm

Yeah there were some great buildings removed for the GLM. It's arguable whether it was worth it, but back then DT was in dire shape in many places, and the GLM was a shot in the arm to spark redevelopment. IMO, Jobbers was a much bigger loss architecturally, for future development potential, and by shear mass. I'm too young to remember much about the GLM blocks, but I think this might be one of the blocks demolished....
Image

Found it on the Landmarks Heritage website

Here's another of Frankie Panes in the early 70's, I would guess...with the Specht building to the right.
Image
He said "They are some big, ugly red brick buildings"
...and then they were gone.


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