Death Penalty in NE

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RNcyanide
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Death Penalty in NE

Postby RNcyanide » Sat Sep 19, 2015 9:49 am

http://www.omaha.com/news/crime/enough- ... 4acc0.html

There was enough signatures gathered to put the repeal of the repeal on a referendum for 2016. Hooray.

I couldn't find an existing thread about this, but if there is one, please merge it.
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Re: Death Penalty in NE

Postby bigredmed » Sat Sep 19, 2015 1:01 pm

RNcyanide wrote:http://www.omaha.com/news/crime/enough-signatures-verified-to-suspend-nebraska-s-death-penalty-repeal/article_fe5eff51-ef18-522a-946d-50f15f64acc0.html

There was enough signatures gathered to put the repeal of the repeal on a referendum for 2016. Hooray.

I couldn't find an existing thread about this, but if there is one, please merge it.


Not a supporter of the death penalty, but I do find the notion that high impact issues should be handled without a popular vote to be troubling. I find more troubling the leftist thugs that tried to block people from accessing the petitions including blocking uninvolved people from simply walking on the sidewalk.

Now we can have a vote and let it be decided once and for all.

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Re: Death Penalty in NE

Postby Professor Woland » Sat Sep 19, 2015 1:59 pm

bigredmed wrote:
RNcyanide wrote:http://www.omaha.com/news/crime/enough-signatures-verified-to-suspend-nebraska-s-death-penalty-repeal/article_fe5eff51-ef18-522a-946d-50f15f64acc0.html

There was enough signatures gathered to put the repeal of the repeal on a referendum for 2016. Hooray.

I couldn't find an existing thread about this, but if there is one, please merge it.


Not a supporter of the death penalty, but I do find the notion that high impact issues should be handled without a popular vote to be troubling. I find more troubling the leftist thugs that tried to block people from accessing the petitions including blocking uninvolved people from simply walking on the sidewalk.

Now we can have a vote and let it be decided once and for all.


I'm going to have to strongly disagree here. The death penalty is so odious that no majority can possibly make it legitimate. Other than outright physical violence any means used to prevent it from returning are alright by me.

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RNcyanide
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Re: Death Penalty in NE

Postby RNcyanide » Sat Sep 19, 2015 2:33 pm

It's really easy to support the death penalty when you're not a member of the family of someone who was killed who keeps having to go to court every time a convict appeals their sentence. Assuming the person is even guilty. Over the years, there's been a lot of instances of people who were found to be innocent after the execution, and it was found that the police, the prosecutors, and other legal/crime staff buried or tampered with evidence, forced confessions, and other shady |expletive|. I remember glancing past an article recently about a man who is supposed to be executed in Oklahoma and is supposedly innocent.

Another disappointing example, involving man of the hour Donald Trump, is where three teens were forced to confess to murders in Memphis that they didn't commit and he spent years trumpeting why they should be executed, even as evidence supporting their innocence mounted. Even their release didn't stop him from talking about how they were guilty. Think of someone like that trying to influence people as to why we need a death penalty, or why someone is guilty even though he knows nothing about the case.
When fortune smiles on something as violent and ugly as revenge, it seems proof like no other that not only does God exist, you're doing his will.

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bigredmed
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Re: Death Penalty in NE

Postby bigredmed » Sat Sep 19, 2015 2:55 pm

Professor Woland wrote:
bigredmed wrote:
RNcyanide wrote:http://www.omaha.com/news/crime/enough-signatures-verified-to-suspend-nebraska-s-death-penalty-repeal/article_fe5eff51-ef18-522a-946d-50f15f64acc0.html

There was enough signatures gathered to put the repeal of the repeal on a referendum for 2016. Hooray.

I couldn't find an existing thread about this, but if there is one, please merge it.


Not a supporter of the death penalty, but I do find the notion that high impact issues should be handled without a popular vote to be troubling. I find more troubling the leftist thugs that tried to block people from accessing the petitions including blocking uninvolved people from simply walking on the sidewalk.

Now we can have a vote and let it be decided once and for all.


I'm going to have to strongly disagree here. The death penalty is so odious that no majority can possibly make it legitimate. Other than outright physical violence any means used to prevent it from returning are alright by me.

Shoving people into the street? Is that OK for you?

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Re: Death Penalty in NE

Postby Professor Woland » Sat Sep 19, 2015 3:55 pm

bigredmed wrote:
Professor Woland wrote:
bigredmed wrote:
RNcyanide wrote:http://www.omaha.com/news/crime/enough-signatures-verified-to-suspend-nebraska-s-death-penalty-repeal/article_fe5eff51-ef18-522a-946d-50f15f64acc0.html

There was enough signatures gathered to put the repeal of the repeal on a referendum for 2016. Hooray.

I couldn't find an existing thread about this, but if there is one, please merge it.


Not a supporter of the death penalty, but I do find the notion that high impact issues should be handled without a popular vote to be troubling. I find more troubling the leftist thugs that tried to block people from accessing the petitions including blocking uninvolved people from simply walking on the sidewalk.

Now we can have a vote and let it be decided once and for all.


I'm going to have to strongly disagree here. The death penalty is so odious that no majority can possibly make it legitimate. Other than outright physical violence any means used to prevent it from returning are alright by me.

Shoving people into the street? Is that OK for you?



No, that counts as outright physical violence. It's morally reprehensible and counterproductive to boot. None of which changes the fact that in the true sense of the concept the people as a whole and as individuals do not have the right to vote for the death penalty's return, any more than they would have the right to outlaw Presbyterianism or reinstate slavery.

bigredmed
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Re: Death Penalty in NE

Postby bigredmed » Sat Sep 19, 2015 4:58 pm

See I disagree.

The argument made was the penalty was too costly because of the appeals. The problem is that the people making this argument are the same people now propagandizing against life sentences. So where does it stop? No punishment at all?

The issue is whether or not someone has done a crime vile enough to warrant being put down like a rabid dog. If yes, then confirm their guilt and then provide them with a high velocity curroplumbum cerebral bolus infusion in 9mm and repeat as necessary.

If someone's crime is not so bad, then jail. If you are not convinced of their guilt, then jail till you can prove it one way or another (assuming they have been convicted once).

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Re: Death Penalty in NE

Postby Professor Woland » Sat Sep 19, 2015 6:11 pm

bigredmed wrote:See I disagree.

The argument made was the penalty was too costly because of the appeals. The problem is that the people making this argument are the same people now propagandizing against life sentences. So where does it stop? No punishment at all?

The issue is whether or not someone has done a crime vile enough to warrant being put down like a rabid dog. If yes, then confirm their guilt and then provide them with a high velocity curroplumbum cerebral bolus infusion in 9mm and repeat as necessary.

If someone's crime is not so bad, then jail. If you are not convinced of their guilt, then jail till you can prove it one way or another (assuming they have been convicted once).


That may have been some people's reason for opposing the death penalty, but mine is that the legitimate use of violence is determined by proportionality and necessity. Any person or group of people has the right to use a reasonably necessary and proportionately warranted amount of violence to stop an imminent or ongoing event. The death penalty can only meet this requirement in a nomadic society, so it's an illegitimate use of lethal violence. As for punishment, I oppose that on principle as well. Prison or penal colonies should exist to keep dangerous people away from us, not to teach them a lesson or prove a point. When practical a just system would compel a criminal to make restitution to their victims, if the criminal is guilty of something truly heinous and represents a threat to innocent people, then lock them up or settle them somewhere. Now, it's entirely possible that you reject my understanding of justified violence, but I think it holds up pretty well.

bigredmed
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Re: Death Penalty in NE

Postby bigredmed » Sat Sep 19, 2015 6:59 pm

Again I am not a supporter of the death penalty. I didn't sign up he petition, but I was sorely tested by the behavior of the opponents. I find your need to become preachy annoyingly similar to ethics and have no need for such a discussion.

We settle the debate by vote and go from there.

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Re: Death Penalty in NE

Postby Professor Woland » Sat Sep 19, 2015 7:09 pm

bigredmed wrote:Again I am not a supporter of the death penalty. I didn't sign up he petition, but I was sorely tested by the behavior of the opponents. I find your need to become preachy annoyingly similar to ethics and have no need for such a discussion.

We settle the debate by vote and go from there.


I wasn't being preachy, I was being long winded. Sorry you were annoyed, I thought it was interesting.

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iamjacobm
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Re: Death Penalty in NE

Postby iamjacobm » Fri Feb 10, 2017 11:04 am

Mississippi, never to be outdone, votes to move a bill forward to bring the firing squad back.

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Re: Death Penalty in NE

Postby MadMartin8 » Fri Feb 10, 2017 2:50 pm

iamjacobm wrote:Mississippi, never to be outdone, votes to move a bill forward to bring the firing squad back.


Normally I would disapprove and say "I hope Nebraska never does this", but then I read the Public Pulse and also drive in this city....and suddenly my attitude towards executions changes.
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Re: Death Penalty in NE

Postby jessep28 » Sat Feb 11, 2017 6:52 pm

I'm anti death penalty, but if the "will of the voters" is to maintain capital punishment for public safety, or whatever BS excuse death penalty proponents use to justify it, then Nebraska should explore using the guillotine. The state killing people shouldn't be watered down as a medical procedure. The guillotine is quick, efficient and less prone to errors than hanging, shooting squad, electric chair, or lethal injection.

Every state senator and governor/LT governor should be required to view it too.
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