Local Gas Prices

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Uffda
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Local Gas Prices

Postby Uffda » Fri Apr 18, 2008 6:23 am

Well a month ago the prediction was $3.50/gallon by summer. I heard on the TV last night that has been raised to $4 by Memorial Day.

I know topics of discussion on this forum are sprawl and public transportation but this increase in gas prices is going to effect a lot more than just how much I have to pay to top off the tank. This increase is going right on down the line to other consumer goods --- food, clothes, how much I have to spend for a night out and HEAVEN FORBID ..... the price of beer is going up again.......  :(

I might have to go back to making my own.

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Postby SabrinaFaire » Fri Apr 18, 2008 8:21 am

It's $3.55 in the far north suburbs of Chicago (I'd assume that it's more in the city). I'm looking forward to moving because I'll have a shorter commute. Right now I drive 30 miles one way to work.

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Postby Brad » Fri Apr 18, 2008 9:45 am

Fuel Cell!

I think Honda's technology is out front right now, but no gas and ZERO emissions!

Honda:
http://automobiles.honda.com/fcx-clarit ... 0418144122

Chevy:
http://www.chevrolet.com/fuelcell/

Ford:
http://www.motortrend.com/features/auto ... ford_focus
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Postby Big E » Fri Apr 18, 2008 10:28 am

I'm getting me one of these if/when they come out:

Image

All electric or electric/gas hybrid to the tune of 100+ MPG.

http://www.flytheroad.com

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Postby Uffda » Fri Apr 18, 2008 11:12 am

Well those might solve part of the problem of the money going out of your pocket for gas but there still will be the increased costs of goods such as groceries as the transportation/delivery costs are rising - cost for farmes/ranchers to grow the crops/raise the animals.

Ties in with the transportation thread --- MAT doesn't cover the area I would need to go from my home -- 78th and sorensen parkway to work at the school --- 144th and Fort. I think if I walk a mile or more to the East I can catch the bus at Immanuel but it doesn't come anywhere close to dropping me off.

There are going to be some major adjustments made and the construction around Omaha could slow down as many of those places use diesel fuel for their heavy equipment.

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Postby flyOMA » Sun Apr 20, 2008 5:40 pm

My wife and I finally had enough and both bought hybrids.  I got a Ford Escape Hybrid which gets me around 34MPG and my wife a Honda Civic Hybrid which gets between 45-50MPG, depending on the weather.  This is about the best we can do right now, at least until some of the plug-in/gasoline hybrids start coming out in 3-5 years.

I just hope that the new administration (one without personal oil interests) will be more proactive about this problem.  Commodity prices are going through the roof, even before the recession started to take hold.  It is driving airlines, trucking companies, and now the consumer into dire straits.  F'ing OPEC/oil companies.....

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Postby ricko » Mon Apr 21, 2008 1:50 am

And they're raking-it-in while they can.

My cynical, 'lived-in-DC-too-long' side predicts a price drop after Labor Day, and another big drop right before the election, after which there will be a spike, and then another drop after the Inauguration---of course a lot depends on who's elected.  The real sad part----they don't even care what people think of them anymore (if they ever did).

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Postby Erik » Mon Apr 21, 2008 2:03 pm

ricko wrote:And they're raking-it-in while they can.

My cynical, 'lived-in-DC-too-long' side predicts a price drop after Labor Day, and another big drop right before the election, after which there will be a spike, and then another drop after the Inauguration---of course a lot depends on who's elected.  The real sad part----they don't even care what people think of them anymore (if they ever did).



Living in dt or midtown is looking and sounding better all the time.  :x

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Postby Brad » Mon Apr 21, 2008 2:12 pm

my planned unlimited MPG purchase for work commuting:

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.

Postby Erik » Mon Apr 21, 2008 2:43 pm

Brad wrote:my planned unlimited MPG purchase for work commuting:

Image



I've been thinking long and hard about doing the same, even though I live 6 miles from work :-)

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Re: .

Postby Brad » Mon Apr 21, 2008 2:50 pm

Erik wrote:I've been thinking long and hard about doing the same, even though I live 6 miles from work :-)


I would be commuting from 90th and Fort to 120th and Dodge, I have looked over the route I would use many times and I think it is very doable.
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Re: .

Postby Erik » Mon Apr 21, 2008 3:03 pm

Brad wrote:
Erik wrote:I've been thinking long and hard about doing the same, even though I live 6 miles from work :-)


I would be commuting from 90th and Fort to 120th and Dodge, I have looked over the route I would use many times and I think it is very doable.




yeah, I am more and more becoming more appreciative of density.  The thought of filling up the pockets of the oil companies makes me more sick all the time, I bet within a year I will live in a condo in DT  :D

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Postby Stargazer » Mon Apr 21, 2008 3:08 pm

I'm curious how long and how many miles it would take (well, actually I already know) one of these brand new, hybrid buyers to recoup the difference between their purchase price (not to speak of finance costs) and that of my 'recycled' 2002, 100% gas combustion Honda Civic.

Once the novelty wears off... maybe I'll see you in the deposit line in the bank.  Meanwhile, I'll keep waiting for a real alternative energy car. :)

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Postby Big E » Mon Apr 21, 2008 3:09 pm

Brad wrote:my planned unlimited MPG purchase for work commuting:

[bikepicture]


Would love to, but I'd have to find a route from DTO to Fremont that was downhill...

...both ways.

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Postby Erik » Mon Apr 21, 2008 3:32 pm

Big E wrote:
Brad wrote:my planned unlimited MPG purchase for work commuting:

[bikepicture]


Would love to, but I'd have to find a route from DTO to Fremont that was downhill...

...both ways.

-Big E



Wow, that is a long way!  

I use to live in fremont, NO MORE  :;):

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Postby Brad » Mon Apr 21, 2008 3:50 pm

Stargazer wrote:I'm curious how long and how many miles it would take (well, actually I already know) one of these brand new, hybrid buyers to recoup the difference between their purchase price (not to speak of finance costs) and that of my 'recycled' 2002, 100% gas combustion Honda Civic.

Once the novelty wears off... maybe I'll see you in the deposit line in the bank.  Meanwhile, I'll keep waiting for a real alternative energy car. :)


One of the Fuel Cell cars I posted above or something completely different?
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Postby Big E » Mon Apr 21, 2008 3:54 pm

Stargazer wrote:I'm curious how long and how many miles it would take (well, actually I already know) one of these brand new, hybrid buyers to recoup the difference between their purchase price (not to speak of finance costs) and that of my 'recycled' 2002, 100% gas combustion Honda Civic.

Once the novelty wears off... maybe I'll see you in the deposit line in the bank.  Meanwhile, I'll keep waiting for a real alternative energy car. :)


Assuming you're willing to compare the exact same trim level (CD, power seats, GPS, etc,) it really doesn't take that long - especially with $3.40 gas.  If you're trying to compare a new hybrid to a six year old car, well duh.

Quick calculator, assuming I bought today and drive 21,000+ miles/yr (which I do) @ $3.40/gal gas:

2008 Civic non-hybrid
±$18,500
est. 30 real world MPG
$3.40 gas = $2380 gas/yr
$4.00 gas = $2800 gas/yr

2008 Civic Hybrid
±$23,500
est. 40 real world MPG
$3.40 gas = $1785 gas/yr
$4.00 gas = $2100 gas/yr

So, at $3.40/gal, it would take roughly 8.3 years to recoup the cost difference, and roughly 7.2 @ $4 gas (don't think you aren't going to see that this summer) - based on onlythe price of gas.

But you also have to figure in the $2100 federal tax credit for the Hybrid purchase and the better resale value (especially as percentage of cost).  And yes, you have to be willing to put a value on the fact that 1) you're supporting a new technology/making a statement with your dollars, and 2) you're actually using 33% less gas.  And don't forget the feeling you get looking down your nose at everyone else. :;):

Admittedly, I can't make an incredibly powerful argument for it from a strictly dollars and cents standpoint for everyone - yet.  But you also have to acknowledge it isn't that far off before it does make dollar sense.  If you look at the overall shrinking car market (I'm looking in your direction, Detroit), you'll notice that the hybrid market is making gains at other models' expense:

http://www.cnn.com/2008/TECH/04/21/hybr ... index.html

If everyone sat around waiting for the next alternative, there would be no first alternative.  Be happy you have early adopters to shake your head at, or you might still be on horseback.

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Postby DTO Luv » Mon Apr 21, 2008 4:09 pm

Here's what gets me to my job

Image



Here's what gets me to my part time job. They're horribly fuel inefficient though.


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Postby Stargazer » Mon Apr 21, 2008 4:17 pm

I'm just rather irritated that our federal government is sitting around letting this decades long, incremental advance in extending the use of gas combustion burning technology continue to play out... rather than introducing incentives... not to buyers in the form of tax credits on this half |expletive| hybrid technology... but in accelerating research and development of entirely new technologies.  This is rapidly becoming a national security issue.  I guess it will all work itself out eventually.. in one way or another.

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Postby Big E » Mon Apr 21, 2008 4:38 pm

Stargazer wrote:I'm just rather irritated that our federal government is sitting around letting this decades long, incremental advance in extending the use of gas combustion burning technology continue to play out... rather than introducing incentives... not to buyers in the form of tax credits on this half |expletive| hybrid technology... but in accelerating research and development of entirely new technologies.  This is rapidly becoming a national security issue.  I guess it will all work itself out eventually.. in one way or another.


I agree with all of that 4000%, particularly the national security issue, which WILL manifest itself in domestic food riots before too long.  

But I'd rather go with half-assed and at least have some impact than no-assed and no impact, though.  Imagine if EVERYONE cut their fuel usage by 33%.  They wouldn't even have to change their habits - just their vehicles.  Soccer Moms (and some people living in Cornerstone) getting 15 MPG in their Excursions would only have to jump to 20 MPG to achieve that.

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Postby thenewguy » Mon Apr 21, 2008 10:20 pm

with the amount of sprawl Omaha has (which isn't as much as many other cities), i can't believe they don't promote a carpool lane more.  I don't understand (honestly, it makes WAY too much sense) to expand public transportation.  MAT should be capitalizing on this right here and now, invest in a few more buses and more routes, and promote it as a friendly alternative.  I know people are a little leery of it, but if they got after it they'd be seeing a huge ROI in a lot less time than they think.  And the big one: mass transit rail lines.  I know that pretty much 90% of people on here [because surely NDizona would represent the other 10%, and argue the negatives :;):  Just kidding---where's he been lately anyway?] support it, want it, and would probably be the first in line to use it.  

I don't want to see $4/gallon at all, and even though i have not yet bought a hybrid or newer car with a higher mpg rating (i get between 23-27), i have done a lot to reduce consumption:

1) i have planned trips more effectively; if i need to do things, I'll usually do them all in one day (store, hair cut, etc) so that way i'm not coming home and leaving, and repeating.  2) using less power on my car's ac (in the summer--heater in the winter) and utilize opening the windows.  3) making sure the tire pressure on my car is set correctly (between 32 and 35psi), because having improperly inflated tires reduces your mpg rating.  4)  slowing down.  We all know how this works.  5) carpool with my fiance as much as possible.  It hasn't taken much to tweak our schedules to make it work.  6) take a lunch to work; this cuts down on trips to fast food, more healthy for your body, idle time in your car, etc.  7)  keep the house at 68 in the winter, 73 in the summer.  Uses less energy, and cars aren't the only thing that use petroleum for energy :;):  

And finally: get someone else in office.  8 years ago, gas was around a buck a gallon.  Amazing what 1 president can do.  And it doesn't really have much to do with there being a short supply.  What a bunch of |expletive| holes.
from msn.com
An OPEC official also said over the weekend that the group was not likely to increase production. The official said oil prices would likely rise and said OPEC might boost production if the price pressure was because of a supply shortage, something he doubted.
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Postby ricko » Tue Apr 22, 2008 1:55 am

Stargazer wrote:I'm just rather irritated that our federal government is sitting around letting this decades long, incremental advance in extending the use of gas combustion burning technology continue to play out... rather than introducing incentives... not to buyers in the form of tax credits on this half |expletive| hybrid technology... but in accelerating research and development of entirely new technologies.  This is rapidly becoming a national security issue.  I guess it will all work itself out eventually.. in one way or another.

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Postby ricko » Tue Apr 22, 2008 2:51 am

I'll figure this out somehow, being digitally challenged and all.

Regarding Jeff's quote above:

The stench of money and its influence on politics is unreal in this town (DC) when it comes to energy policy.  We've known, since the 70's that a comprehensive energy policy challenging the status quo is desperately needed.  EVERY single candidate running for president since 1976 has trotted out his or her 'energy policy' for the press and the concerned public to drool over.  Some of them are sincere, for others it's just P.R. designed to make them look good on paper.  The reality has more to do with the enormous amounts of money spent on lobbying efforts on behalf of economic interests interested in maintaining the status quo.  Lobbying 'firms' operate much like large law firms, with 'associates' hoping to make 'partner' some day (so they can divvy-up the big bucks).  It's not unusual for top lobbyists to make well into six-figures, some seven.  Of the top 10 lobby groups in town, only one (A.A.R.P.) is an organization that actually represents 'people'.  Do we have the technology and the talent to solve our energy dilemma----damn right we do.   Do we have elected leaders with the backbone and political will to act on the nation's behalf?  Not enough.  If powerful interests feel threatened anywhere, they'll fight with everything they've got in order to maintain their advantage.  One of the things we CAN do is to make sure our elected officials are not beholden to them (and that they have an energy policy that isn't designed  to just make you feel good about what some party operative wrote for him/her).  I sincerely believe this is a national security issue that transcends party politics, and I think our elected officials need to be held accountable.

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Postby Stargazer » Tue Apr 22, 2008 10:08 am

But I'd rather go with half-assed and at least have some impact than no-assed and no impact, though.


Forgive my scifi nerdiness... but that's about like wanting back into the Matrix.  You ought to be parking your hybrid Civic out in front of auto row... and taking a sledge hammer to it... while yelling "I'm mad as heck... and I'm not going to take it any more!" ;)

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Postby ricko » Tue Apr 22, 2008 1:04 pm

A great movie to rent on the subject: 'Who Killed the Electric Car' (2006)

Love the 'Howard Beal' reference from "Network"

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Postby the1wags » Tue Apr 29, 2008 9:36 pm

Yet diesel is half of US prices in Mexico. Hmmm........Any way you slice it, we are getting |expletive|. For the record, I'd have NO problem paying 4-5 a gallon if the increase was due to taxes that were earmarked for investing in alternative transportation (i.e. streetcars, commuter rail, etc) but it's just the companies like Exxon reporting record profits every quarter for 3 years straight.

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Postby Big E » Tue Apr 29, 2008 10:43 pm

Asten wrote:haha.. I love all the people trying to blame the prices on Bush.   I'm no fan, but the same people that think he's an incompetent nincompoop are the same ones that think he's got this amazing capacity for manipulating and scheming vast conspiracies.  Heh.


Actually, we think he's an incompetent nincompoop that is being manipulated by people that have an amazing capacity for manipulating and scheming vast conspiracies.

But we quibble.  ;)
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Postby papiostud » Wed Apr 30, 2008 3:32 am

Bush is an oil guy.   The gas prices have trippled since he's been in office.   Of course its his and his cronies fault!

Not to worry, its an Election year and like the last election year in 2006 they went down 80 cents from Aug to Nov.

Source: http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/opinion/2 ... ces02.html

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Postby DTO Luv » Wed Apr 30, 2008 8:35 am

The President doesn't have nearly the affect on gas prices as people make it out to be. Get a clue folks. Most of the oil the US uses does not come from the Middle East. It comes from Canada. So get ready to mount an attack on Alanis Morrisette, Geddy Lee, and CTV. A big reason that gas is going up is because more people around the world are using it.

America still uses more than most places but we are also trending towards getting away from oil. Meanwhile India and China (almost half of the planet) are getting more car oriented. That's why gas is going up so much.
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Postby Omababe » Wed Apr 30, 2008 10:01 am

Asten wrote:haha.. I love all the people trying to blame the prices on Bush.  


Not a conspiracy, just business ...  Let's see here ...

We have oil industry executives, plural, in the administration.

Oil company profits are at an all-time high.

Gasoline prices are at an all-time high.

Coincidence?

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Postby Uffda » Wed Apr 30, 2008 10:18 am

That's why gas is going up so much.


Partly it is supply and demand. But also oil is sold in dollars worldwide and the dollar has been falling in value. Also speculators have jumped on the oil band wagon and have pushed the price up. There are many articles out there that say there is plenty of oil (right now) so it isn't because of a lack of supply.

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Postby the1wags » Wed Apr 30, 2008 10:39 am

DTO Luv wrote:.... but we are also trending towards getting away from oil.


:lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol:  :lol: Thanks for the laughs.

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Postby DTO Luv » Wed Apr 30, 2008 11:55 am

You know what I mean. There's a lot more talk about useless hybrids and other modes of transportation and energy then there was 8 years ago.
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Postby Big E » Thu May 01, 2008 4:00 pm

But that's the trick...  propose something implausible that sounds great to the half-wit mouth-breathing voting block out there, and then when it doesn't become reality (like you knew it wouldn't) you can point a finger at the other guy and say "It's his fault! I was looking out for you!"

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Postby Brad » Thu May 01, 2008 11:54 pm

Exxon Mobil posted a $10.89 billion first-quarter profit but the results still disappointed investors as weak production and low refining margins took some steam out of profits from record-high crude prices.


Europe's two biggest oil producers, posted combined profits of $17 billion earlier this week -- $9.08 billion for Shell, $7.6 billion for BP.


http://www.cnbc.com/id/24401300

:roll:

Can you imagine if they took the number of gallons sold and divided it by 28 billion?
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Postby OmahaBen » Fri May 02, 2008 8:29 am

Brad wrote:
Exxon Mobil posted a $10.89 billion first-quarter profit but the results still disappointed investors as weak production and low refining margins took some steam out of profits from record-high crude prices.


Europe's two biggest oil producers, posted combined profits of $17 billion earlier this week -- $9.08 billion for Shell, $7.6 billion for BP.


http://www.cnbc.com/id/24401300

:roll:

Can you imagine if they took the number of gallons sold and divided it by 28 billion?


Can you imagine if you had actually read the whole article? The company made the vast majority of its profits from its crude oil drilling/pumping operations. It's refined products operations, aka gasoline, saw its profits cut because the increase in gas prices did not keep pace with the increase in crude oil prices.

You can blame speculative investors as much as oil companies themselves. There isn't a vast difference in the amount of oil we have today versus what we had 5 years ago. It's just there's been a "run on the bank" so to speak, and god only knows when that run's gonna end. It's the same thing with food prices this year.

The fed isn't helping matters by continually lowering interest rates, which only adds to the inflationary pressures on the market.

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Postby Stargazer » Fri May 02, 2008 9:25 am

So who are the customers to their crude oil drilling/pumping operations?  Themselves?  Foreign nations in turn shipping oil here (perhaps even to the same domestic oil companies refining operations) ?

To suggest that their profits are justified because they're simply the result of activities in another part of the chain is rather silly.

We can thank ourselves for jacking these prices up as well... having given a substantial piece of our wealth to China and India... they're suddenly the fastest growing 'car economies' in the world... and are driving increased demand.

I applaud Obama for his position on the proposed summer season gas tax cut as well... which on average would amount to less than $10 a month... costing several BILLION in federal tax receipts... while in all likelihood, actually increasing consumption of oil... driving up prices still further, and resulting in more profits to the oil companies (surprise... sounds like someones brilliant idea).

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Postby bbinks » Fri May 02, 2008 10:01 am

I have always been a skeptic of the pump price.  

The pump price will today will rise if (because?) the cost of today's'  barrel of oil rises.  That is, the pump price rises on speculation of future costs.   If the closing price of a barrel of oil drops, the pump price stays the same; or rises.  Also, the cost of ethanol blend has always been 10 cents higher.  The cost of ethanol is not linear to the cost of gasoline.   So why the constant 10 cent variance?  Someone is making some extra money in that equation.   And as others have mentioned,  the oil company profits are at an absurd record high.  Businesses making a reasonable  profit is one thing, what the oil companies are making in profit is just wrong.

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Postby thenewguy » Fri May 02, 2008 10:31 am

that's why I'm looking at fuel economy before anything else with my next vehicle purchase; with any luck, the light rail being built in downtown Omaha will spill over to suburbs, and to Council Bluffs, and i can just hop on it to get to work.
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