HDR Proposed Downtown Office

Linkin5 · Post by **Linkin5** » Sun Apr 17, 2016 3:30 pm

Garrett wrote:
S33 wrote:I know we've spent a lot of time here discussing the importance of having multiple, strong urban cores, in the metro area.

Everyone is disappointed that no high rise is getting built (even though the one they proposed, was a joke to begin with), but isn't this a "good" thing, in the big picture, for the entire metro?

To me, having multiple urban cores, will only advance the case for expanded mass transit and for more areas.

Just a thought.
Absolutely right. I think the main issue most people have is that traffic is already |expletive| in the area.

Also, I think people are just generally turned off by how HDR has handled this whole mess.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Sun Apr 17, 2016 3:42 pm

I think many of you are looking at the fix to the parking problem downtown to simplistic. It's easy to say get a good mass transit system and the parking problem is solved. But there is a massive difference between parking problems and commuting problems. Very, very few people in Omaha complain about their commute. With all the gizmos cars have, plus iPhones, there is plenty to do while stuck in traffic. And at worst its only 30 min here in omaha. People are not going to give up their cars/SUVs to ride a bus downtown. It won't happen. Also, when people are done at work they might have to pick up kids or do errands. Omahas 1 hr rush hour does little to interfere with daily life. Heck, look at large cities where commutes take 1-3 hrs each way, and see how many people still drive. So the commute part of the mass transit idea is going to have so little buy in that will not help with the parking issues.
Companies that might go downtown have to look way into the future to see how the will manage parking for their employees. You don't want to always have people being late because they can't find a parking space. And it will only get worse in 20yrs. That's why they want to have full control over parking. 100 stalls might not seem like much today, but what about in 20 yrs? The commute issue is not that important to a company because there is little they can do to change it.
Yes, a strong mass transit system would solve both problems, but currently, only parking is seen as a problem. Until both are seen as a problem, nothing is going to change. There will have to be big incentives to get people to drop their cars and get onto a bus to go to work.

S33 · Post by **S33** » Sun Apr 17, 2016 7:46 pm

Linkin5 wrote:
Garrett wrote:
S33 wrote:I know we've spent a lot of time here discussing the importance of having multiple, strong urban cores, in the metro area.

Everyone is disappointed that no high rise is getting built (even though the one they proposed, was a joke to begin with), but isn't this a "good" thing, in the big picture, for the entire metro?

To me, having multiple urban cores, will only advance the case for expanded mass transit and for more areas.

Just a thought.
Absolutely right. I think the main issue most people have is that traffic is already |expletive| in the area.
Also, I think people are just generally turned off by how HDR has handled this whole mess.

Some of this sounds like it could be on the city and property owners, as well.

Either way, at least they aren't moving to Chicago.

c dub · Post by **c dub** » Mon Apr 18, 2016 8:15 am

Guest wrote:I think many of you are looking at the fix to the parking problem downtown to simplistic. It's easy to say get a good mass transit system and the parking problem is solved. But there is a massive difference between parking problems and commuting problems. Very, very few people in Omaha complain about their commute. With all the gizmos cars have, plus iPhones, there is plenty to do while stuck in traffic. And at worst its only 30 min here in omaha. People are not going to give up their cars/SUVs to ride a bus downtown. It won't happen. Also, when people are done at work they might have to pick up kids or do errands. Omahas 1 hr rush hour does little to interfere with daily life. Heck, look at large cities where commutes take 1-3 hrs each way, and see how many people still drive. So the commute part of the mass transit idea is going to have so little buy in that will not help with the parking issues.
Companies that might go downtown have to look way into the future to see how the will manage parking for their employees. You don't want to always have people being late because they can't find a parking space. And it will only get worse in 20yrs. That's why they want to have full control over parking. 100 stalls might not seem like much today, but what about in 20 yrs? The commute issue is not that important to a company because there is little they can do to change it.
Yes, a strong mass transit system would solve both problems, but currently, only parking is seen as a problem. Until both are seen as a problem, nothing is going to change. There will have to be big incentives to get people to drop their cars and get onto a bus to go to work.

This is oversimplified in the opposite extreme. How many people have kids? An ever shrinking percentage, if you have an errand, drive, but other days maybe not? The fact is, more options will spread the traffic out a bit, probably more as people learn how and when it will best serve them. I have had to park blocks away and walk, and I have taken a bus to a downtown job. The more options we give people, the better things will get. The problem occurs when there is one (or everyone acts like it anyway). An HDR move would help too as it would change the face almost immediately, and its a place people want to work, so IF they lost anyone, they could replace them easily.
The fact is you can't change the perception without first changing the landscape. We arent going to convince people to get out of their cars before anything changes.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Mon Apr 18, 2016 12:39 pm

Linkin5 wrote:Also, I think people are just generally turned off by how HDR has handled this whole mess.

You mean Omaha Performing Arts, right?

Linkin5 · Post by **Linkin5** » Mon Apr 18, 2016 2:34 pm

Guest wrote:
Linkin5 wrote:Also, I think people are just generally turned off by how HDR has handled this whole mess.
You mean Omaha Performing Arts, right?

They both equally f*cked this up.

MTO · Post by **MTO** » Mon Apr 18, 2016 3:32 pm

Linkin5 wrote:
Guest wrote:
Linkin5 wrote:Also, I think people are just generally turned off by how HDR has handled this whole mess.
You mean Omaha Performing Arts, right?
They both equally f*cked this up.

Let us not forget the Specht crybabies.

Post by **Coyote** » Mon Apr 18, 2016 3:52 pm

MTO wrote:Let us not forget the Specht crybabies.

In the grand scheme those buildings had quite nothing to do with this deal, until OPAS thought they could get a free land grab and their imaginations ran wild. In the final analysis OPAS got way too greedy.

MTO · Post by **MTO** » Mon Apr 18, 2016 4:01 pm

Coyote wrote:
MTO wrote:Let us not forget the Specht crybabies.
In the grand scheme those buildings had quite nothing to do with this deal, until OPAS thought they could get a free land grab and their imaginations ran wild. In the final analysis OPAS got way too greedy.

I'll never forget...

GetUrban · Post by **GetUrban** » Mon Apr 18, 2016 10:13 pm

MTO wrote:
Linkin5 wrote:
Guest wrote:
Linkin5 wrote:Also, I think people are just generally turned off by how HDR has handled this whole mess.
You mean Omaha Performing Arts, right?
They both equally f*cked this up.
Let us not forget the Specht crybabies.

Yeah, the only people who had a clue in this whole debacle.

iamjacobm · Post by **iamjacobm** » Mon Apr 18, 2016 10:31 pm

On another note I would be excited about HDR in A/V.

Maybe they could team with DLR to help UNO to get a full fledged Arch program at UNO and enhanced engineering opportunities, they would be two killer pillars to bring talent to the school and to attract grads with internships. A program like that would be a big step for the university.

Post by **Coyote** » Mon Apr 18, 2016 10:45 pm

iamjacobm wrote:On another note I would be excited about HDR in A/V.

Maybe they could team with DLR to help UNO to get a full fledged Arch program at UNO and enhanced engineering opportunities, they would be two killer pillars to bring talent to the school and to attract grads with internships. A program like that would be a big step for the university.

I never thought about that prospect.
Which begs the question... What are the better Arch programs in the Midwest?

iamjacobm · Post by **iamjacobm** » Mon Apr 18, 2016 10:58 pm

Coyote wrote:
iamjacobm wrote:On another note I would be excited about HDR in A/V.

Maybe they could team with DLR to help UNO to get a full fledged Arch program at UNO and enhanced engineering opportunities, they would be two killer pillars to bring talent to the school and to attract grads with internships. A program like that would be a big step for the university.
I never thought about that prospect.
Which begs the question... What are the better Arch programs in the Midwest?

IDK about that.

It is pretty interesting to see thses types of massive firms in Omaha like HDR, DLR and Leo A Daly when neither major university in the city has the program(I don't think Creighton has an Arch program, not 100%.)

RNcyanide · Post by **RNcyanide** » Tue Apr 19, 2016 1:59 am

iamjacobm wrote:On another note I would be excited about HDR in A/V.

Maybe they could team with DLR to help UNO to get a full fledged Arch program at UNO and enhanced engineering opportunities, they would be two killer pillars to bring talent to the school and to attract grads with internships. A program like that would be a big step for the university.

Haha over UNL's dead body. They'd never let that happen.

Linkin5 · Post by **Linkin5** » Tue Apr 19, 2016 6:12 am

RNcyanide wrote:
iamjacobm wrote:On another note I would be excited about HDR in A/V.

Maybe they could team with DLR to help UNO to get a full fledged Arch program at UNO and enhanced engineering opportunities, they would be two killer pillars to bring talent to the school and to attract grads with internships. A program like that would be a big step for the university.
Haha over UNL's dead body. They'd never let that happen.

This^

MTO · Post by **MTO** » Tue Apr 19, 2016 8:48 am

PKI hasn't severed ties with UNL yet?!

guest2016 · Post by **guest2016** » Tue Apr 19, 2016 9:22 am

iamjacobm wrote:It is pretty interesting to see (these) types of massive firms in Omaha like HDR, DLR and Leo A Daly when neither major university in the city has the program(I don't think Creighton has an Arch program, not 100%.)

Of the top 100 arch firms, 23 are in the midwest - 28 if you count Denver. These companies account for roughly $2.7 billion in architectural revenue from total company revenue of $10.9 billion.

In 2014 revenue...
HDR: Arch: $298.5 million | Tot: $1.8 billion (Arch: 17%)
Daly: Arch: $119.6 million | Tot: $149.7 million (Arch: 80%)
DLR: Arch: $83.1 million | Tot: 110.0 million (Arch: 76%)

So, a few things...
1. With these companies, HDR has 225+ offices, Daly has 32, DLR has 24 - so while you all are talking about how none of the universities in Omaha have a program, it really doesn't matter because their employees probably have the opportunity to work from any of their offices. Co-location is a huge thing in architecture. I have a relative who is an architect who has co-located between Nebraska, Iowa and North Carolina for multiple years on several projects. He could move to any of their offices and continue just fine with the company.

2. 17% of HDR's revenue is Architecture and arguably, Daly has had a more prominent role in the Omaha skyline. If you take each companies revenue and divide by the number of offices, Daly may make more money per office (I don't know how many of HDRs 225+ offices offer Arch services). If we assumed 80 or more, HDRs arch offices would make less individually than Daly's, 86 or more and it would be less than DLRs.

Coyote wrote:Which begs the question... What are the better Arch programs in the Midwest?

Top arch schools in the midwest: Washington University (St. Louis), Iowa State, Notre Dame, Ohio State, Kansas, Kansas State, Cincinnati, Michigan. For some of these, they might have a specialty in a certain type of design for which they are ranked and not universally ranked outside of that specialty.

Creighton does not have an architecture program (nor engineering, but they have a faux engineering program in sustainable energy science that is geared to push kids into graduate engineering programs).

iamjacobm wrote:Maybe they could team with DLR to help UNO to get a full fledged Arch program at UNO and enhanced engineering opportunities. A program like that would be a big step for the university.

MTO wrote:PKI hasn't severed ties with UNL yet?!

UNL merged UNO/PKI's Computer/Electrical engineering with Lincoln's Department of Electrical Engineering in 2014 or 2015. What people unfamiliar might not know - The engineering professors were employed by UNL and the engineering students at UNO were technically UNL students.

UNL doesn't have a graduate program in Arch, and it's unlikely the university system would launch a competing undergraduate program without launching a graduate program at UNL first.

PKI is not allowed to "sever ties" with UNL - they are part of UNL (go to their website - "The Peter Kiewit Institute is home to the University of Nebraska-Lincoln's College of Engineering and the University of Nebraska at Omaha's College of Information Science and Technology.").

Sources: Architectural Record, UNL website, UNO website, PKI website, Creighton website, HDR/Daly/DLR websites

GetUrban · Post by **GetUrban** » Tue Apr 19, 2016 9:50 am

Midwest architecture schools, national ranking:

# 7 Washington U, St. Louis
# 8 Michigan
# 9 University of Texas, Austin
#15 Kansas State
#19 Kansas
#20 Iowa State
#21 Colorado
#30 Ohio State
#34 UNL

Source:
http://architecture-schools.startclass.com/

UNL has a 4-year undergraduate program AND a 2-year Masters of Architecture program:
http://architecture.unl.edu/degree-prog ... chitecture

Since Lincoln is only 60 miles away, it's really not a factor. Being that close to HDR & DLR is not a good reason to move a well established program, especially when there are many other good firms in Lincoln and Omaha that influence the college just as much as HDR & DLR, if not more so. Effort would be better spent strengthening the UNL program. Moving the Master of Architecture program to Omaha would be the only thing I would consider, with a greater focus on Urban Design and Planning. The Community and Regional Planning dept. is part of the UNL Architecture College too, with interior Design.

MTO · Post by **MTO** » Tue Apr 19, 2016 1:07 pm

guest2016 wrote:
iamjacobm wrote:It is pretty interesting to see (these) types of massive firms in Omaha like HDR, DLR and Leo A Daly when neither major university in the city has the program(I don't think Creighton has an Arch program, not 100%.)
Of the top 100 arch firms, 23 are in the midwest - 28 if you count Denver. These companies account for roughly $2.7 billion in architectural revenue from total company revenue of $10.9 billion.

In 2014 revenue...
HDR: Arch: $298.5 million | Tot: $1.8 billion (Arch: 17%)
Daly: Arch: $119.6 million | Tot: $149.7 million (Arch: 80%)
DLR: Arch: $83.1 million | Tot: 110.0 million (Arch: 76%)

So, a few things...
1. With these companies, HDR has 225+ offices, Daly has 32, DLR has 24 - so while you all are talking about how none of the universities in Omaha have a program, it really doesn't matter because their employees probably have the opportunity to work from any of their offices. Co-location is a huge thing in architecture. I have a relative who is an architect who has co-located between Nebraska, Iowa and North Carolina for multiple years on several projects. He could move to any of their offices and continue just fine with the company.

2. 17% of HDR's revenue is Architecture and arguably, Daly has had a more prominent role in the Omaha skyline. If you take each companies revenue and divide by the number of offices, Daly may make more money per office (I don't know how many of HDRs 225+ offices offer Arch services). If we assumed 80 or more, HDRs arch offices would make less individually than Daly's, 86 or more and it would be less than DLRs.

Coyote wrote:Which begs the question... What are the better Arch programs in the Midwest?
Top arch schools in the midwest: Washington University (St. Louis), Iowa State, Notre Dame, Ohio State, Kansas, Kansas State, Cincinnati, Michigan. For some of these, they might have a specialty in a certain type of design for which they are ranked and not universally ranked outside of that specialty.

Creighton does not have an architecture program (nor engineering, but they have a faux engineering program in sustainable energy science that is geared to push kids into graduate engineering programs).

iamjacobm wrote:Maybe they could team with DLR to help UNO to get a full fledged Arch program at UNO and enhanced engineering opportunities. A program like that would be a big step for the university.

MTO wrote:PKI hasn't severed ties with UNL yet?!
UNL merged UNO/PKI's Computer/Electrical engineering with Lincoln's Department of Electrical Engineering in 2014 or 2015. What people unfamiliar might not know - The engineering professors were employed by UNL and the engineering students at UNO were technically UNL students.

UNL doesn't have a graduate program in Arch, and it's unlikely the university system would launch a competing undergraduate program without launching a graduate program at UNL first.

PKI is not allowed to "sever ties" with UNL - they are part of UNL (go to their website - "The Peter Kiewit Institute is home to the University of Nebraska-Lincoln's College of Engineering and the University of Nebraska at Omaha's College of Information Science and Technology.").

Sources: Architectural Record, UNL website, UNO website, PKI website, Creighton website, HDR/Daly/DLR websites

That's |expletive| stupid, |expletive| UNL!

bmt · Post by **bmt** » Tue Apr 19, 2016 2:39 pm

All of UNO's engineering majors are technically part of UNL's College of Engineering. These majors include architectural, civil, computer, construction, electrical, and electronics engineering. That being said, architectural engineering is only offered on UNO's campus, and there are <20 architectural engineering programs nationally. So while architecture is only available in Lincoln, architectural engineering is only available on UNO's campus.

iamjacobm · Post by **iamjacobm** » Tue Apr 19, 2016 2:47 pm

One thing I was told about today that I didn't even consider, not sure it would even apply to HDR either.

Had a conversation about how certain businesses need to be located on major fiber-optic lines and there aren't a ton of sites in the city with that kind of infrastructure right now. DT is one that is wired and ready to go for heavy users. Was told there are probably less than 5 sites(as in areas not single plots of land) in the city that are set up for offices that use high levels of data.

EDIT: I would assume A/V has the capability with Scott Technology Center there.

MTO · Post by **MTO** » Tue Apr 19, 2016 3:54 pm

As fast as they've been pushing fiber it won't be long until those other places get their fat pipes.

Post by **BRoss** » Sun Apr 24, 2016 5:43 pm

Heard HDR is looking to build a campus now, so it sounds like downtown is out of the question. There's a plan for a 13 story building (not HDR) in the area they are to build.

RNcyanide · Post by **RNcyanide** » Mon Apr 25, 2016 8:45 am

HR Paperstacks wrote:Heard HDR is looking to build a campus now, so it sounds like downtown is out of the question. There's a plan for a 13 story building (not HDR) in the area they are to build.

In what area?

Post by **BRoss** » Mon Apr 25, 2016 1:09 pm

RNcyanide wrote:
HR Paperstacks wrote:Heard HDR is looking to build a campus now, so it sounds like downtown is out of the question. There's a plan for a 13 story building (not HDR) in the area they are to build.
In what area?

Not sure yet.

Spatial77 · Post by **Spatial77** » Mon Apr 25, 2016 1:19 pm

Gee, they could always build a nice suburban style campus in the old Conagra space

Post by **Brad** » Mon Apr 25, 2016 9:24 pm

Same person that told me about the Spect building also said the Daly residence at 96th and Dodge is on the short list for HDR... Can you imagine HDR tearing down Daly's personal residence to build their HQ???

RNcyanide · Post by **RNcyanide** » Mon Apr 25, 2016 9:32 pm

I hope your source is as wrong as that mansion's interior decorating.

bmt · Post by **bmt** » Mon Apr 25, 2016 9:37 pm

Brad wrote:Same person that told me about the Spect building also said the Daily residence at 96th and Dodge is on the short list for HDR... Can you imagine HDR tearing down Daley's personal residence to build their HQ???

If HDR builds on the Dailee residence, maybe that will light a fire under Dayly to move their HQ to OPA parking lot and show them how it is done.

RockHarbor · Post by **RockHarbor** » Tue Apr 26, 2016 12:07 am

I came across this great aerial of the area awhile ago.

I thought there was a for-sale sign out front of that woodsy lot. Am I mistaken? (I'll look next time I drive by...)

guest2016 · Post by **guest2016** » Tue Apr 26, 2016 8:36 am

bmt wrote:
Brad wrote:Same person that told me about the Spect building also said the Daily residence at 96th and Dodge is on the short list for HDR... Can you imagine HDR tearing down Daley's personal residence to build their HQ???
If HDR builds on the Dailee residence, maybe that will light a fire under Dayly to move their HQ to OPA parking lot and show them how it is done.

Better yet, they could move the 3 blocks down the street to HDR's current building and demolish them.

guest2016 · Post by **guest2016** » Tue Apr 26, 2016 8:37 am

RockHarbor wrote:I came across this great aerial of the area awhile ago.

I thought there was a for-sale sign out front of that woodsy lot. Am I mistaken? (I'll look next time I drive by...)

Fairly certain that for sale sign has been there for the better part of a decade.

hatwate · Post by **hatwate** » Tue Apr 26, 2016 8:52 am

After looking at the WH story on the estate the last month or so and the land records, I think the Daly estate does not front on Dodge. It is more like at the corner of 96th and Burt. It was transferred last year from what looks like the Daly estate to Shelf LLC, whatever that is. I also think the For Sale sign is for one of the 2 pieces of property that do front on Dodge.

Joe_Sovereign · Post by **Joe_Sovereign** » Tue Apr 26, 2016 9:51 am

That would certainly be a prominent position with a high rise on the top of that hill. That has to be one of the highest points in the City.

Traffic would be interesting because you could access that site from the northend and go east or west with access to 90th or to Blondo. However there is no way to turn left from eastbound Dodge onto 96th Street. I wonder if the city would but a stoplight in at 96th and Dodge and expand 96th street to four lanes.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Tue Apr 26, 2016 9:58 am

Have it on pretty good authority that it wont be HDR that builds at the Daly land but it will be LEO A Daly building there.

As a side note. Look for an announcement for Methodist to build a big new 350+ room tower on the HDR site

RNcyanide · Post by **RNcyanide** » Tue Apr 26, 2016 10:14 am

Guest wrote:Have it on pretty good authority that it wont be HDR that builds at the Daly land but it will be LEO A Daly building there.

As a side note. Look for an announcement for Methodist to build a big new 350+ room tower on the HDR site

Like tear down the current hdr office? I work for methodist hospital and have heard nothing about this. When could this announcement be expected?

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Tue Apr 26, 2016 10:19 am

You haven't heard that Methodist wants the HDR land? That has to be one of the worst kept secrets in town. I hadn't heard that it would be a patient tower but that makes sense. They already own several parcels west of HDR on the south side of West Dodge Road between 84th and 90th.

Guest · Post by **Guest** » Tue Apr 26, 2016 10:22 am

I don't have any authority to back up the earlier assertion that a Leo Daly building will be at the residence location other than to say that it would be a terrible location for HDR. Not to mention that anyone who knows anything about Rosemary Daly would guess that the site would probably be repurposed for either the architectural firm or more likely, a purpose desired by the Archdiocese (possibly a new chancery???).

RNcyanide · Post by **RNcyanide** » Tue Apr 26, 2016 10:42 am

Guest wrote:You haven't heard that Methodist wants the HDR land? That has to be one of the worst kept secrets in town. I hadn't heard that it would be a patient tower but that makes sense. They already own several parcels west of HDR on the south side of West Dodge Road between 84th and 90th.

I know they're interested in the office itself because they are short on administrative space, and their current medical office building is a dump, but I'm not sure they'd be willing to rent it from someone else. I think that's why Children's decided to build their offices on Cass.

guest2016 · Post by **guest2016** » Tue Apr 26, 2016 2:04 pm

RNcyanide wrote:
Guest wrote:You haven't heard that Methodist wants the HDR land? That has to be one of the worst kept secrets in town. I hadn't heard that it would be a patient tower but that makes sense. They already own several parcels west of HDR on the south side of West Dodge Road between 84th and 90th.
I know they're interested in the office itself because they are short on administrative space, and their current medical office building is a dump, but I'm not sure they'd be willing to rent it from someone else. I think that's why Children's decided to build their offices on Cass.

Either Methodist or Children's used to be in HDR's building - don't know which. Can't imagine it would be cheap if they were to buy it - the tax assessed value of the two properties (HDR's two office buildings and the Durham building in front) is near $20 million. Methodist owns four plots to the west of HDR's current offices. Ideally, Methodist would take over HDR's 2 buildings, the Durham blue building, and the NP Dodge building and build a better complex than the sporadic, shoddy presence they have now.

From what I saw the other day - the NP Dodge Building (separates two other Methodist buildings) is now empty and they are looking to lease it. It would be hard to believe that Methodist isn't in vying for that building.