The Big 10 thread

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S33
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Postby S33 » Fri Sep 03, 2010 12:33 pm

icejammer wrote:
Stargazer wrote:So I'm guessing the Big 10 doesn't want to see us winning the title game in our first year?   We host Ohio State and Iowa... and travel to Wisconsin, Michigan and Penn State.  We play Michigan/Penn State/Iowa in a three game stretch!

Throw in Fresno State, Washington, and Wyoming... and I'd venture to say that we have one of the toughest schedules in the nation.


But....I thought the 'Skers were going to blow through the Big 10/12, since it's so inferior to the real Big 12/10, according to all the fans.    :;):


Overall, I think the conferences are very comparable with the obvious exception of championship game appearances.  :;):

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Postby mrdwhsr » Fri Sep 03, 2010 1:30 pm

Big E wrote:
There's no way the B12 continues without a conference championship game.  Whether that means the conference completely dissolves or they expand back to 12 or more is TBD.  Either way, whatever the B12 does sets off another round of fun.  

If any one of the BCS conferences goes past 12 teams to 14 or 16, you can bet that one or more other conferences will follow.  Pretty soon, scheduling as an independent becomes a nightmare.  Assuming Texas isn't an independent at that point (or that the SEC, PAC12 and MWC haven't absorbed what's left of the B12), the most likely candidates for the B12 to stay together are BYU and ND, as they both bring national and regional markets that the B12 currently doesn't have (the B12 cares not for TCU.)

This is nowhere near close to over.  It just might be quiet for a couple years as TV contracts trickle out.



No chance the Big Texas Conference invites Colorado State? Probably depends on who takes ND to the dance. The Denver Metro market goes to the PAC 10 with CU in 2012 and not a sure thing that CSU would bring it back - at least short term.

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Postby Big E » Fri Sep 03, 2010 1:55 pm

mrdwhsr wrote:No chance the Big Texas Conference invites Colorado State?


Only way I see that happening is if some of the B12 South heads off to the SEC, or if Texas goes independent.  Even then I think you'd see TCU, BYU, and/or Houston before CSU.

Basically, the whole thing is in the hands of Texas, Notre Dame, and the Big Ten right now.  Any one of them makes a move and the |expletive| hits the fansites.

I also really, really, really believe that BYU went independent to make joining the B12 something they could do at a moment's notice.  Let's face it: Texas will have its own network, BYU already has its own network, and Notre Dame basically has its own network.  I see the B12 becoming an island of misfit (but very rich) toys, where the big programs with their own networks go to actually be able to schedule other teams.
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Postby Zilla » Fri Sep 03, 2010 2:09 pm

Big E wrote:There's no way the B12 continues without a conference championship game.


Not so fast my friend.  Texass likes the idea of no conference championship game.  They've been knocked out of National Championship contention more than once due to that game.  They've been big opponents to it since the beginning as well.  It may well come back, but I guarantee they aren't rushing back to it.

I'll be shocked if Notre Dame joins the Big Texass and Little 9.  That's alot of ego to cram into one conference.  If you think that the Domers are going to accept having things tilted towards Texas (like having the conference championship game at Jerryworld every year) then you haven't met many Domer fans.  :)

I fully expect the Big Texass and Little 9 conference to break up in the next couple of years.  Too much animosity that a verbal "firm commitment to this conference" just isn't going to save.  You can bet that if Missou or TexasAM gets an offer from somewhere else that they'll jump ship.
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Postby Big E » Fri Sep 03, 2010 2:35 pm

Zilla wrote:
Big E wrote:There's no way the B12 continues without a conference championship game.


Not so fast my friend.  Texass likes the idea of no conference championship game.  They've been knocked out of National Championship contention more than once due to that game.  They've been big opponents to it since the beginning as well.  It may well come back, but I guarantee they aren't rushing back to it.


Explains why they voted with Nebraska in that original 10-2 vote, right?

I stand by my statement: the B12 doesn't continue (3 years?) without a conference championship game.  The B12 could continue without Texas (assuming they added some other "names").

The B10 and PAC10 were adamantly opposed to a CCG for a decade plus, as well.  

Zilla wrote:I'll be shocked if Notre Dame joins the Big Texass and Little 9.  That's alot of ego to cram into one conference.  If you think that the Domers are going to accept having things tilted towards Texas (like having the conference championship game at Jerryworld every year) then you haven't met many Domer fans.  :)


ND to the B12 is contingent on Delaney forcing ND's scheduling hand (which I think we all agree he will, if he hasn't already).  What is ND going to do?  Play Army, Navy and the Sun Belt every year?  

Zilla wrote:I fully expect the Big Texass and Little 9 conference to break up in the next couple of years.  Too much animosity that a verbal "firm commitment to this conference" just isn't going to save.  You can bet that if Missou or TexasAM gets an offer from somewhere else that they'll jump ship.


Who is going to offer them?  SEC and TAMU already flirted, and the Texas state legislature basically put an end to that.  No other Texas school does anything without UT's blessing (nor is wanted by any other conference).  Missouri is still standing outside the Big Ten clubhouse crying in the rain.  Where else do they go?  Other than Oklahoma, what other B12 school would anyone want other than KU for basketball?

Short of Texas going independent in the middle of the night a la BYU, I don't see any other set of circumstances that triggers anything significant - unless the SEC hits one out of the park and grabs Miami and FSU (<2% chance of that happening.)  Heck, Texas going independent would probably expedite the BYU-ND to the B12 scenario.

The Big 12 exists today for one reason and one reason only: it was the only league willing to cave to Texas' independent network demands.  Seems like a pretty nice landing pad for a couple of other teams that pride themselves on having independent networks already.
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Postby Hawkeye » Sun Sep 05, 2010 7:44 am

mrdwhsr wrote:
Stargazer wrote:So I'm guessing the Big 10 doesn't want to see us winning the title game in our first year?   We host Ohio State and Iowa... and travel to Wisconsin, Michigan and Penn State.  We play Michigan/Penn State/Iowa in a three game stretch!

Throw in Fresno State, Washington, and Wyoming... and I'd venture to say that we have one of the toughest schedules in the nation.



I'm guessing the Big 10 wants to see large stadiums filled with fans and plenty of butts parked in front of the TV.  Ohio State/Wisconsin/Michigan/Penn State/Iowa mean five prime ABC TV games. Gotta be better than watching Big Texas football. No whining!


And last year Iowa played AT Michigan State, AT Wisconsin, AT Ohio State, and AT Penn State (and just to complete the sentiment, we also played AT Iowa State).  And came within an OT Field Goal of running the road table.  Off our schedule were Big Ten bottom-feeders Illinois and Purdue...and our home schedule included most of the rest of the Big Ten's lower echelon, save Northwestern.

No whining indeed. It's called a Big Ten schedule. Get used to it.

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Postby joeglow » Sun Sep 05, 2010 10:25 am

Hawkeye wrote:And last year Iowa played AT Michigan State, AT Wisconsin, AT Ohio State, and AT Penn State (and just to complete the sentiment, we also played AT Iowa State).  And came within an OT Field Goal of running the road table.  Off our schedule were Big Ten bottom-feeders Illinois and Purdue...and our home schedule included most of the rest of the Big Ten's lower echelon, save Northwestern.

No whining indeed. It's called a Big Ten schedule. Get used to it.


I don't think anyone is complaining about it.  Of course, due to the nature of scheduling, you will occasionally get a schedule like this.  Most people I know think it is clearly demanding, but they are excited about it.

That said, don't kid yourself.  Nebraska got the schedule they did on purpose and for one reason:  the Big 10 does NOT want Nebraska coming in and winning the title in the first couple years.  It would NOT look for them if that happened.

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Postby Erik » Wed Sep 08, 2010 1:41 pm

joeglow wrote:
Hawkeye wrote:And last year Iowa played AT Michigan State, AT Wisconsin, AT Ohio State, and AT Penn State (and just to complete the sentiment, we also played AT Iowa State).  And came within an OT Field Goal of running the road table.  Off our schedule were Big Ten bottom-feeders Illinois and Purdue...and our home schedule included most of the rest of the Big Ten's lower echelon, save Northwestern.

No whining indeed. It's called a Big Ten schedule. Get used to it.


I don't think anyone is complaining about it.  Of course, due to the nature of scheduling, you will occasionally get a schedule like this.  Most people I know think it is clearly demanding, but they are excited about it.

That said, don't kid yourself.  Nebraska got the schedule they did on purpose and for one reason:  the Big 10 does NOT want Nebraska coming in and winning the title in the first couple years.  It would NOT look for them if that happened.


I'm excited for that schedule.  If we lose 2-3 games the first two years I think we would have done very well!  Along with the national exposure it would increase our recruiting prowess even further.  Our recruiting has been at the highest level in over a decade and better than many of Osborne's classes (recruiting services opinion that is).

I'm geeked and every week in the Big10 will be exciting.

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Postby Stargazer » Sat Nov 06, 2010 10:56 am

Just noticed, thought it was kind of funny, that the UNL home page has already moved to the Big 10... http://www.unl.edu/ (lower right corner)

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Postby Big E » Mon Nov 29, 2010 7:32 pm

TCU to the Big East.  Veeeerrrrryyyy interesting.  I had heard it mentioned as a possibility but didn't think it made any sense.  

However, if TCU makes 9...

...does Notre Dame make 10?

Who makes 11 and 12?

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Postby Coyote » Mon Nov 29, 2010 7:45 pm

That makes 17 for basketball (which the conference was originally made for)

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Postby S33 » Mon Nov 29, 2010 8:36 pm

And all along was I was certain an invite from the Big12 was coming. Between baseball and football, they could have been a perfect replacement for CU.

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Postby Big E » Mon Nov 29, 2010 8:40 pm

TCU brought nothing to the B12 the B12 didn't already have (ie, the Texas TV market).

Remember, this is the conference that would have let A&M go to the SEC had members of the Texas state legislature not flexed.

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Postby cp jay 07 » Mon Nov 29, 2010 11:15 pm

Big E wrote:TCU to the Big East.  Veeeerrrrryyyy interesting.  I had heard it mentioned as a possibility but didn't think it made any sense.  

However, if TCU makes 9...

...does Notre Dame make 10?

Who makes 11 and 12?


The Big East will stop at 10 teams and petition the NCAA to have a title game with just 10 teams.

They have already invited Villanova to join for football and if they decline expect Houston or UCF to be next in line for the call up.

It really sounds like ND is not going to give in on football and cave to a conference, they have pretty much turned down the Big 10 and Big East now.

I do think it is good that the BE has taken the offensive when it comes to football, especially with the Pitt and Syracuse to the Big 10 rumors starting again. I will admit I would have loved to seen the Orange and Skers in the same conference.

As for basketball I still think we will see the BE kick one team out. Could be Seton Hall or Depaul.

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Postby Stargazer » Tue Nov 30, 2010 8:20 pm

I will admit I would have loved to seen the Orange and Skers in the same conference.


?

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Postby Coyote » Tue Nov 30, 2010 8:25 pm

Syracuse in the Big11?

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Postby cp jay 07 » Wed Dec 01, 2010 1:20 am

Coyote wrote:Syracuse in the Big11?


When the reports about Nebraska started going around there were reports saying the Big 10 wanted to go to 16 or 14 teams and wanted the NYC Media market. There were 3 teams rumored. ND, PITT, and Syracuse. Recently those rumors started to appear again when AOL ran a story saying in 4 years the Big 10 wanted more east coast teams to go along with Penn State.

Just because Syracuse had a bad 4 year run do not forget they still have a good football program and a great basketball program along with great academics. I'm glad the Big East is saved now but the ACC and Big 10 have had their eyes on Syracuse if the Big East went down.

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Postby Big E » Wed Dec 01, 2010 8:22 am

cp jay 07 wrote:Just because Syracuse had a bad 4 year run....


uhhh.... they were solid in the 90s when McNabb was there for 11 years, and back in the late 50s/60s.  They weren't even good when Jim Brown was on the team.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syracuse_O ... ar_Results

Unfortunately, from a conference realignment standpoint, Syracuse brings about as much cache as Buffalo or UMass.

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Postby cp jay 07 » Wed Dec 01, 2010 4:10 pm

Wow Big E you know less about sports than I thought you did.

Ok take Syracuse football out of the equation, what about Syracuse basketball? They give a conference a top 25 team year in and year out, can Buffalo or UMass do that? Buffalo athletics is a joke and UMass basketball has been nothing since Coach Cal left. Then add the academics because the Big 10 is pretty big on that, you have one of the top journalistic schools in America at Syracuse with many famous alums.

Football has been an up and down sport at Syracuse, 50's and 60's one of the top programs in the nation. 70's and early 80's we sucked. Late 80's till 2004 very consistent bowl team. 2004-2009 complete joke and embarrassment. 2009 rebuilding, 2010 back in the Hunt for Big East title and Pin Stripe Bowl invitation. Also Syracuse football is in the top 25 of all time wins, even after a disastrous 4 years, last time I checked they were in the 14-15 area. Am I saying Syracuse football could win the big ten, heck no, could they be middle of the pack Big 10? I believe so.

Maybe I am a little biased due to me being a Syracuse fan but to say they add nothing to a conference and are like a Buffalo or UMass is just idiotic.

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Postby lnkS » Wed Dec 01, 2010 9:32 pm

Conference expansion, along with most of the money in college athletics, is largely about football programs, for which Syracuse really provides nothing.  Syracuse also doesn't bring a TV market (NYC doesn't care) which could help accommodate for the lack of a major football program.

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Postby OmahaJaysCU » Wed Dec 01, 2010 11:20 pm

In CPJays defense, New York has a lot of TVs...

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Postby cp jay 07 » Thu Dec 02, 2010 12:30 am

lnkS wrote:Conference expansion, along with most of the money in college athletics, is largely about football programs, for which Syracuse really provides nothing.  Syracuse also doesn't bring a TV market (NYC doesn't care) which could help accommodate for the lack of a major football program.


Wow so you are saying NYC is not a TV market? Very interesting. I guess no one watches sports in NYC or NY State.

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Postby Big E » Thu Dec 02, 2010 12:51 am

Wow Big E you know less about sports than I thought you did.

Ok take Syracuse football out of the equation, what about Syracuse basketball?


All of the money (proportionately) that will ever be made from every sport other than football is already being made, with the possible exception of women's volleyball (or any other game 20 year old girls can play in sports bras).  

Other than football.

Period.

End of discussion.

You can talk about Syracuse lacrosse, or UConn women's basketball, or Iowa wrestling, or Stanford crew or Princeton yachting or MIT blackjack all you want.

NO

ONE

CARES

NCAA basketball makes ALL of its relevant money off of the Big Dance.®

When(/if) college football figures it out, it might actually make the NFL look stupid.

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Postby S33 » Thu Dec 02, 2010 12:11 pm

Speaking of the Big Dance, was the Qwest awarded and games this year for the tournament?

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Postby Coyote » Thu Dec 02, 2010 12:17 pm

S33 wrote:Speaking of the Big Dance, was the Qwest awarded and games this year for the tournament?

No - but they will in 2012

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Postby lnkS » Thu Dec 02, 2010 12:40 pm

cp jay 07 wrote:
lnkS wrote:Conference expansion, along with most of the money in college athletics, is largely about football programs, for which Syracuse really provides nothing.  Syracuse also doesn't bring a TV market (NYC doesn't care) which could help accommodate for the lack of a major football program.


Wow so you are saying NYC is not a TV market? Very interesting. I guess no one watches sports in NYC or NY State.


No, I said that NYC doesn't CARE about Syracuse.  NYC is not a college sports city, and why should it be with a plethora of professional sports (some of them even performing a high quality).  Syracuse can, and should, claim that it will bring the NYC market because that really is the only thing that Syracuse can claim, but a vast majority of NYC residents are not going to care.

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Postby nebugeater » Thu Dec 02, 2010 12:54 pm

lnkS wrote:
cp jay 07 wrote:
lnkS wrote:Conference expansion, along with most of the money in college athletics, is largely about football programs, for which Syracuse really provides nothing.  Syracuse also doesn't bring a TV market (NYC doesn't care) which could help accommodate for the lack of a major football program.


Wow so you are saying NYC is not a TV market? Very interesting. I guess no one watches sports in NYC or NY State.


No, I said that NYC doesn't CARE about Syracuse.  NYC is not a college sports city, and why should it be with a plethora of professional sports (some of them even performing a high quality).  Syracuse can, and should, claim that it will bring the NYC market because that really is the only thing that Syracuse can claim, but a vast majority of NYC residents are not going to care.



caring is not necessarily a requirement.  If they are in the home footprint most cable and sat companies will carry the offerings thus resulting int he $$$ they are after.
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Postby cp jay 07 » Thu Dec 02, 2010 1:37 pm

nebugeater wrote:

caring is not necessarily a requirement.  If they are in the home footprint most cable and sat companies will carry the offerings thus resulting int he $$$ they are after.



Exactly. The fact that they have a team in the Big 10 is enough right there.

I do find it funny how this conversation started, we start talking about the big east, all I said was you can kill the Pitt and Syracuse to the big 10 rumors and now we are talking about college football playoffs and whether anyone would watch the Big 10 Network in NYC. I love message boards.

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Postby almighty_tuna » Thu Dec 02, 2010 1:51 pm

cp jay 07 wrote:I do find it funny how this conversation started, we start talking about the big east, all I said was you can kill the Pitt and Syracuse to the big 10 rumors and now we are talking about college football playoffs and whether anyone would watch the Big 10 Network in NYC. I love message boards.


Creighton goes two rounds in March Madness this year then joins the Mountain West Conference for 2011-12.  Discuss.


:;):

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Postby icejammer » Thu Dec 02, 2010 3:12 pm

lnkS wrote:
cp jay 07 wrote:
lnkS wrote:Conference expansion, along with most of the money in college athletics, is largely about football programs, for which Syracuse really provides nothing.  Syracuse also doesn't bring a TV market (NYC doesn't care) which could help accommodate for the lack of a major football program.


Wow so you are saying NYC is not a TV market? Very interesting. I guess no one watches sports in NYC or NY State.


No, I said that NYC doesn't CARE about Syracuse.  NYC is not a college sports city, and why should it be with a plethora of professional sports (some of them even performing a high quality).  Syracuse can, and should, claim that it will bring the NYC market because that really is the only thing that Syracuse can claim, but a vast majority of NYC residents are not going to care.


Shoot, if they even delivered 1% of the NYC market, that would add more than all the Nebraska market alone (well, almost).
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Postby cp jay 07 » Fri Dec 03, 2010 9:22 am

almighty_tuna wrote:
cp jay 07 wrote:I do find it funny how this conversation started, we start talking about the big east, all I said was you can kill the Pitt and Syracuse to the big 10 rumors and now we are talking about college football playoffs and whether anyone would watch the Big 10 Network in NYC. I love message boards.


Creighton goes two rounds in March Madness this year then joins the Mountain West Conference for 2011-12.  Discuss.


:;):


Do they bring back Football as well?

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Postby Big E » Sun Dec 05, 2010 4:13 pm

Big Ten no longer seeking expansion:

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncaa/news/story?id=5888109

The Big Ten announced Sunday that it will no longer actively pursue expansion after a 12-month study period.

...

In a statement, the Big Ten said it will monitor the landscape in college sports but "will not be actively engaged in conference expansion for the foreseeable future and does not expect to be proactively seeking new members."


I like this.  With the long shot exception of going to a 16 team quad division format, 12 teams is pretty ideal for scheduling and revenue.

I'll postpone my Notre Dame / BYU to the B12 prediction until we see what the Big East can pull off.

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Postby nebugeater » Sun Dec 05, 2010 6:12 pm

They must really be getting close to the next additions!


Big E wrote:Big Ten no longer seeking expansion:

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncaa/news/story?id=5888109

The Big Ten announced Sunday that it will no longer actively pursue expansion after a 12-month study period.

...

In a statement, the Big Ten said it will monitor the landscape in college sports but "will not be actively engaged in conference expansion for the foreseeable future and does not expect to be proactively seeking new members."


I like this.  With the long shot exception of going to a 16 team quad division format, 12 teams is pretty ideal for scheduling and revenue.

I'll postpone my Notre Dame / BYU to the B12 prediction until we see what the Big East can pull off.
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Postby S33 » Mon Dec 13, 2010 11:39 am

New BigTen logo...

Image

Division names: Leaders and the Legends

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Postby Brad » Mon Dec 13, 2010 12:47 pm

All around not impressed.
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Postby S33 » Mon Dec 13, 2010 2:02 pm

Considering the amount of thought, input and deliberation they did to make a decision, me neither.

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Postby nebugeater » Mon Dec 13, 2010 2:52 pm

On the Big 10 facebook page the comments that follow this logo announcement are running about 50 - 1 Negative.
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Postby NovakOmaha » Tue Dec 14, 2010 6:31 am

For me it doesn't matter if they call the divisions a and b or ken and barbie, it's all about actually being in the big 10, playing Michigan, Ohio State, Penn State and the rest instead of big 12 schools.

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Postby Big E » Tue Dec 14, 2010 9:39 am

NovakOmaha wrote:For me it doesn't matter if they call the divisions a and b or ken and barbie...


I tend to agree, but from a marketing standpoint its an unmitigated disaster.

An analyst yesterday made a good point: name the teams in the Atlantic and Coastal Divisions of the ACC.  Other than the die-hards, no casual fan will ever know or care, and the casual fans are where your future die-hards come from.  If they were going to go with names with no essentially no meaning, there are surely dozens of better options. (Black and Blue?)

Ultimately, the B10 is going to be beyond fine.  But this is a pretty silly misstep out of the gate.

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Postby Stargazer » Tue Dec 14, 2010 1:36 pm

I liked the idea of Black and Blue divisions.


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