UNO Maverick Athletics

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Big E
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Postby Big E » Fri Mar 25, 2011 11:33 am

Big E wrote:I'm saying you would have higher attendance because of alcohol sales.  heck, UNO drew 13,000 against UNK a few years ago.  You think Northern Iowa wouldn't draw?  Missouri State?  Southern Illinois?  Believe it or not, these teams have fans that travel.


I completely spaced North Dakota State and South Dakota State, both members of the MVC in football.  Plus, North Dakota and South Dakota are 1-AA now (Great West), as well. I don't see how scheduling or travel would be any different than it is now or ever has been ($4 gas not included).

The arguments against not even trying or bringing it in front of the public to judge interest are feeble at BEST.

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Postby cp jay 07 » Fri Mar 25, 2011 12:26 pm

Zilla wrote:I think those numbers make sense, but your biggest problem is getting people to actually show up.  I don't know why, but there just doesn't seem to be any interest in UNO Football.  I've gotten a handful of free tickets on more than one occasion and was never able to get anyone to go with me.  FREE tickets...no takers.  W T F?  I think beer would help, but I don't know that it'd be enough.  I don't have any better suggestions though....

I understand there was some regents meeting or something this morning that someone was trying to organize a "rally" for....or something.  Anyone know how that turned out?


Honestly the biggest problem with getting people to go was probably Caniglia field itself. With all due respect to my former high school, where I spent many nights at the Al cheering on Prep, the place is a Shi# hole.

Parking there is a joke, even when there is 4,000 for a Prep game people would have to park as far away as the alumni house on Dodge. Imagine what the big games at Caniglia were like for parking, it would take you longer to find a parking spot than it would to actually drive there. And since my last Prep game as a student in 06 they took away one of their biggest lots for the new fitness center. Many afternoons tailgating on Fridays in that lot.

There is only 1 real concession stand and that was located in the so called concourse that would make Rosenblatt look like T.D.A. The rest of the stands were just carts or poorly built sheds. Same thing with the bathrooms, you had the best bathrooms in the place as porta potties, there was one true set of bathrooms in the concourse. Here is an interesting stat about sporting events and bathrooms, Minor league baseball took a survey of female attendees, the main thing they were concerned about when attending a MILB game was the bathrooms, how many, the wait, and how clean. Bathrooms make a huge difference when it comes to stadiums.

The ticket window on the home side was located all the way at the field house or in a shed by the gate, they had 4 windows in total and the only other 2 were on the visitors side in another shed with 2 windows.

Maybe with a better product, a spanking new stadium with beer sales, OR a renovated AL, which already had a video board some D-1AA teams would dream of, people would come out

It may surprise some but not everyone is a husker fan and some people can't afford 100 dollar tickets. Picture this UNL plays at 11 AM on a saturday like almost all Big 10 teams do, UNO then plays in downtown Omaha at 6 against UNI or SIU. Tickets are 15 dollars and you have beer. You would draw your casual football fan for live football in Omaha, you have UNO fans, and SIU and UNI fans would travel. You also might get a few CU fans just to cheer against fellow Valley rivals like SIU and UNI  :;):

As for wrestling, that was Trev's personal agenda and shows he should not have been chosen as UNO's AD. He was just looking out for Trev and not the school in that case. There is a reason ESPN fired him, he thought he was better than the gameday stars and was a jack as$.

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Postby Zilla » Fri Mar 25, 2011 1:00 pm

Stargazer wrote:The whole thing makes me sick... isn't their inclusion of wrestling alone in this... proof enough that they picked and chose what they didn't want conflicting with Lincoln??


Yes, absolutely.  No other factors came into play in this at all.  Trev and TO have been cooking this up for months.  Now the Empire can expand without opposition.
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Postby cp jay 07 » Fri Mar 25, 2011 1:03 pm

Zilla wrote:
Stargazer wrote:The whole thing makes me sick... isn't their inclusion of wrestling alone in this... proof enough that they picked and chose what they didn't want conflicting with Lincoln??


Yes, absolutely.  No other factors came into play in this at all.  Trev and TO have been cooking this up for months.  Now the Empire can expand without opposition.


Please tell me what factors led to wrestling being cut. Football makes a little sense but wrestling none.

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Postby Zilla » Fri Mar 25, 2011 1:05 pm

Big E wrote:I completely spaced North Dakota State and South Dakota State, both members of the MVC in football.  Plus, North Dakota and South Dakota are 1-AA now (Great West), as well. I don't see how scheduling or travel would be any different than it is now or ever has been ($4 gas not included).

The arguments against not even trying or bringing it in front of the public to judge interest are feeble at BEST.


Ironically, while watching the live chat during the meeting on Omaha.com I saw a few people comment something to the effect of "Whoopie.  Can't wait to go see South Dakota State play UNO in basketball.  Who cares!"  And other such comments regarding the new teams we'd be playing.  I realize it's basketball vs. football....but can't help but feel people just feel the same way regardless of the sport.
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Postby Big E » Fri Mar 25, 2011 1:12 pm

I'll check out of this thread by adding this:

All the reasons I hear for UNO football not working at the D1-AA level are the same reasons UNO hockey should never have worked at the D1 level.

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Postby Zilla » Fri Mar 25, 2011 1:30 pm

cp jay 07 wrote:Please tell me what factors led to wrestling being cut. Football makes a little sense but wrestling none.


Twiztid pretty much beat me to it.  Are those "enough" reasons....the only reasons....the best reasons?  I don't know.  I confess I haven't done a ton of research on the whole process so I couldn't tell you every little thing.  So, I take it from your response that you believe that the ONLY reason wrestling was cut was to appease UNL?  Seriously?  No chance for anything else....solely to not conflict with UNL?
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Postby joeglow » Fri Mar 25, 2011 2:06 pm

Big E wrote:I used attendance numbers and ticket prices from Youngstown State's own website there for a comparison, and I see no reason UNO couldn't start or beat them.


Comparing a sub-par D2 school with a top tier FCS team certainly makes sense.

Big E wrote:Which BCS schools are charging less than $25 (on average)?  Free tickets for Baylor hosting Sam Houston State aren't exactly the barometer I'm using.


Clearly you aren't.  You are already saying UNO is the cream of the crop and can demand their prices.  Either of those schools would smoke UNO 9 out of 10 times.

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Postby cp jay 07 » Fri Mar 25, 2011 2:06 pm

Twiztid1 wrote:
cp jay 07 wrote:
Zilla wrote:[quote="Stargazer"]The whole thing makes me sick... isn't their inclusion of wrestling alone in this... proof enough that they picked and chose what they didn't want conflicting with Lincoln??


Yes, absolutely.  No other factors came into play in this at all.  Trev and TO have been cooking this up for months.  Now the Empire can expand without opposition.


Please tell me what factors led to wrestling being cut. Football makes a little sense but wrestling none.


I'd say title IX, an increased budget, and a desire to be more in line with the Summit and not be in four different leagues.  I applaud the administration for making cuts and providing a stable future for athletics.  They realized hockey is their niche sport that hopefully they can turn into a cash cow once again by decreasing costs.[/quote]


All of those excuses have already been debunked, actually quite a few Summit league teams have wrestling. As for title IX that does not effect the wrestling team like it would have the football team. They would actually be in 3 different leagues, like many schools are in there situation. UNI for example is in 3 different leagues.  Summit Member Western Illinois is in 2 different leagues. Missouri State is in 2 different leagues also so I am not buying that one.

You are buying Trev's lies like he wants you to. Fortunately the educated sports fans in Omaha know better than to trust that as$ clown and they are not buying it.

I've said this before Football unfortunately does make since and I do applaud the school having the balls to cut that program. But then Trev comes out and tells 3 different lies about wrestling and locks the team out of their locker room after winning a national title. Not very smart on his part.

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Postby joeglow » Fri Mar 25, 2011 2:07 pm

Stargazer wrote:The whole thing makes me sick... isn't their inclusion of wrestling alone in this... proof enough that they picked and chose what they didn't want conflicting with Lincoln??


Um, to those us not blinded by our hatred of UNL, thereby allowing us to look down at the heathens we are better than, no.

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Postby UNMCStudent » Fri Mar 25, 2011 2:12 pm

At several times during today's meeting, speakers mentioned the inequity between funds given to UNL/UNK and UNO.  Is this really true?  If so, why is UNO getting a smaller share than UNK?

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Postby iamjacobm » Fri Mar 25, 2011 2:17 pm

If they would of moved football up they would of been gambling that the entire athletic department would be dropped by the end of the decade.  Could it have been done? Yes if they decided the risk was worth it they could of made a run at football, but they decided to make a tough business decision and guarantee that athletics of any sort will exist at UNO for generations to come.

For ever comment on how football could of been successful there is an equal chance it fails and if you move football to D-1 and it fails the entire athletic department would of ended up going D-III.  That risk wasn't worth it to more than just Alberts.  It sucks, heck I probably would of gone to UNO games at TD if they sold beer, but it was deemed not worth the risk and I can't blame them.

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Postby Omababe » Fri Mar 25, 2011 2:18 pm

cp jay 07 wrote:a spanking new stadium with beer sales,


How about {pause - deep breath ...} Ameritrade!

Or even that other stadium out in BFE.

Beer? Ain't gonna happen.

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Postby Big E » Fri Mar 25, 2011 2:42 pm

joeglow wrote:Comparing a sub-par D2 school with a top tier FCS team certainly makes sense.


Which - for the absolute last fcuking time - I'm not doing.

I'm comparing a current 1-AA team with a potential (well, formerly potential, as of this morning) 1-AA team, in a decent sized, fairly affluent, football crazed market whose only competition has a wait list for tickets nearly as long as the capacity of the stadium they could play in.

I readily acknowledge I'm comparing apples to hypothetical apples.  At least they are apples, instead of this D2 banana everyone wants to keep arguing about.  Economics are not the same, marketability are not the same, location is not the same, product is not the same.

I'm not making any jumps in logic, expectations, or faith that weren't made when UNO started hockey.  I'd actually say fewer.  D1-AA football would have less competition than hockey did when it started.

It could work.  UNO decided they didn't want to try.

In the meantime, have fun drawing a hockey crowd to an on campus facility with no beer.

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Postby cp jay 07 » Fri Mar 25, 2011 3:40 pm

Twiztid1 wrote:
cp jay 07 wrote:
Twiztid1 wrote:[quote="cp jay 07"][quote="Zilla"][quote="Stargazer"]The whole thing makes me sick... isn't their inclusion of wrestling alone in this... proof enough that they picked and chose what they didn't want conflicting with Lincoln??


Yes, absolutely.  No other factors came into play in this at all.  Trev and TO have been cooking this up for months.  Now the Empire can expand without opposition.


Please tell me what factors led to wrestling being cut. Football makes a little sense but wrestling none.


I'd say title IX, an increased budget, and a desire to be more in line with the Summit and not be in four different leagues.  I applaud the administration for making cuts and providing a stable future for athletics.  They realized hockey is their niche sport that hopefully they can turn into a cash cow once again by decreasing costs.[/quote]


All of those excuses have already been debunked, actually quite a few Summit league teams have wrestling. As for title IX that does not effect the wrestling team like it would have the football team. They would actually be in 3 different leagues, like many schools are in there situation. UNI for example is in 3 different leagues.  Summit Member Western Illinois is in 2 different leagues. Missouri State is in 2 different leagues also so I am not buying that one.

You are buying Trev's lies like he wants you to. Fortunately the educated sports fans in Omaha know better than to trust that as$ clown and they are not buying ify.

I've said this before Football unfortunately does make since and I do applaud the school having the balls to cut that program. But then Trev comes out and tells 3 different lies about wrestling and locks the team out of their locker room after winning a national title. Not very smart on his part.[/quote]

Title IX affects all sports.  It's about the ratio of athletic participation to female enrollment.  UNO is already not compliant.  So adding wrestling scholarships puts them into a worse position, though football would be more difficult.  And do you want to go into a new conference offering only three of their men's sports?  Are you going to add women's sports to match the two men's sports added if you keep wrestling?  No, because it's too expensive.  Do you want to spread out athletic resources over three conferences, four if you keep football?  No, because it's not efficient.  

Then consider the increase in the wrestling budget.  Yes, the program raises most of it themselves.  However, they don't fund their entire program so how are they going to raise enough funds when costs double?

The administration's reasoning is justified.  Just because other schools do things a certain way doesn't mean UNO can do the same.  Each school has its own circumstances.  UNO is trying to go D1 at a time when state aid is flat and will probably be cut more.  The fact that their athletic department is on life support means they are a lot more handcuffed than other institutions.  [/img][/url][/quote]

They would not need to add scholarships for wrestling in the move up, that was only in football. (Don't quote me on that though, I'm only 90 percent sure). As for going into the new conference you could still keep wrestling and add soccer or least golf. That gives you 4 mens sports to compete in the summit. NDSU and USD have 5 mens summit sports and a wrestling program so you are on par with them. Plus the Summit came out and said it was going to accecpt UNO no matter what, they did not need to cut wrestling. They would have been fine with 4 summit sports + wrestling. Plus with UNO being in a low major conference who knows where they will be in 10 years. These conferences lose teams like it's their job. TCU just joined the Big East, Nebraska just joined the Big 10 and Big East basketball is getting ready to blow up any year now so that shows you how stable conferences are now a days. So to throw one of your best programs away with all its history for a conference that who knows how long you will be in seems a little odd to me, once again showing Trev's personal agenda.

Now you have the budget which A) Wrestling does not have and B) raises its own money. This is where Big E's theory comes into place, why not let them try to at least raise the money. Do you know how much national coverage this is getting in the wrestling world. Many D-1 coaches who were at the D-1 nationals came out and said how wrong it is and how it needs to be stopped. This is getting a lot of attention and I am sure when ESPN runs the Outside the Lines piece it will only grow, not to mention a documentary movie is also in the plans. Wrestling has created their own budget for this long I don't see why it would stop now.

Oh and you wanna see how supportive and helpful Trev is to the wrestlers to at least let them finish their spring semesters and help them find new schools? This was posted by a 3 time all american national champion wrestler who was a junior at UNO who was born and raised in Omaha.

"So get to UNO to practice only to find out that our codes for the wrestling room and locker room don't work currently. Because they are locked down"

Nice Trev you are a real class act.

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Postby Big E » Fri Mar 25, 2011 4:11 pm

They would not need to add scholarships for wrestling in the move up, that was only in football.


Technically, you are not required to add scholarships at the D1-AA level for football.  Only 1-A requires a certain number of players remain on scholarship (74.5 or something like that, out of a maximum 85).  There are a maximum 63 scholarships available for 1-AA football, which can be split among a maximum of 85 players.  1-A scholarships can not be split.

Although, I'm not sure if it is the "opportunity" for these scholarships that counts against Title IX, or the actual issuance of said scholarships.

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Postby bearcatguy » Sat Mar 26, 2011 10:35 am

There's definitely a lot of emotion that's going on with this decision, and while I would be upset if my school dropped football, for UNO it makes sense.  For everyone who wants to compare UNO to SDSU, NDSU, UND and USD, you can't compare UNO to those schools.  Those are the schools in their state, and get the lion-share of the attention.  If you want to compare UNO to a former NCC school, it should be N. Colorado.  If you care to look, N. Colorado's football team nearly sunk the entire athletic department, and the program as a whole has never fully recovered from making the jump.  N. Colorado was a two-time D2 national champion in the late 90's, and was even a national quarterfinalist in football in 2002.  Since they made the jump to FCS, in 2006, they've won a grand total of 6 games, with three of those coming this past season.  That's right, 6 wins since 2006 for a program that was a top 10 D2 school.  They tried to keep up with the Jones' (the schools from ND and SD), and they couldn't.

Now, I know people will say that UNO would not have to automatically increase the number of football schollies if they made the jump to FCS.  My question is, if you aren't going to fully fund the sport (offer the max number of schollies), why even have the sport?  Just to say you have it?  That would be completely stupid, and irresponsible, especially with a sport like football.

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Postby Big E » Sat Mar 26, 2011 11:51 am

bearcatguy wrote:There's definitely a lot of emotion that's going on with this decision, and while I would be upset if my school dropped football, for UNO it makes sense.  For everyone who wants to compare UNO to SDSU, NDSU, UND and USD, you can't compare UNO to those schools.  Those are the schools in their state, and get the lion-share of the attention.  If you want to compare UNO to a former NCC school, it should be N. Colorado.  If you care to look, N. Colorado's football team nearly sunk the entire athletic department, and the program as a whole has never fully recovered from making the jump.  N. Colorado was a two-time D2 national champion in the late 90's, and was even a national quarterfinalist in football in 2002.  Since they made the jump to FCS, in 2006, they've won a grand total of 6 games, with three of those coming this past season.  That's right, 6 wins since 2006 for a program that was a top 10 D2 school.  They tried to keep up with the Jones' (the schools from ND and SD), and they couldn't.


Montana and both Dakotas have two teams supported at the 1-AA level, and none of the three states have the population of Omaha, let alone Nebraska.  Making the assumption that UNO would fail like Northern Colorado is just that: an assumption.  Granted, it's no different than my assumption that UNO would succeed.  However, you're talking about failure on the field and I'm talking about success at the box office.

Furthermore, Nebraska, Montana and the Dakotas don't have to compete with the the Denver Broncos.  A more apt comparison, in my opinion, would be to look at 1-AA Maine, Delaware, or Appalachian State - decent sized markets with no major competition for dollars.

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Postby bearcatguy » Sat Mar 26, 2011 2:00 pm

You're right, I am assuming, but that's all anyone can do at this point.  I do have a pretty good feeling that if people didn't show up to Al Caniglia field when UNO was playing NDSU, SDSU, UND, and USD at the D2 level, they likely aren't going to show up to games at the FCS level.  Heck, you'd be surprised at how many people call the FCS level D2.  I guess if you had them play off campus, at a nicer venue, with possible beer sales, the crowds would grow, but we'll never know.  We do know that UNO had pitiful support, outside of a handful of wealthy former students/players.

I mentioned N. Colorado and keeping up with the Jones'.  Here are some links to what top teams in the FCS are working with.

Appalachian State-Indoor Facility-http://www.goasu.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=21500&ATCLID=205016089
Stadium-http://www.goasu.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=21500&ATCLID=204989181

Deleware-Stadium-http://www.bluehens.com/inside-athletics/facilities/stadium.html

Montana-Stadium-http://www.montanagrizzlies.com/pages/?p=73&m=68

Montana St.-Stadium-http://www.google.com/images?hl=en&rlz=1T4GGLL_enUS321US321&q=bobcat%20stadium%20montana%20state&um=1&ie=UTF-8&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi

North Dakota-Stadium-http://www.fightingsioux.com/ViewArticle.dbml?&&DB_OEM_ID=13500&ATCLID=736149

North Dakota St.-Stadim-http://www.gobison.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=2400&ATCLID=69809

Youngstown St-Stadium-http://www.ysusports.com/information/facilities/stambaugh_stadium

Could anyone see UNO even approaching stadiums like these?  I guess they could have used TD Ameritrade.  FCS isn't quite big boy college football, but the teams that win, and win year in and year out are serious about their programs, and their facilities.  I just can't see where UNO would get the support required to win at the FCS level.

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Postby Stargazer » Sat Mar 26, 2011 2:56 pm

Give me a break... most of these teams came from the NCC... UNO would be taking no different a path.  Indeed, it is precisely that POTENTIAL for success, which scared the heck out of the people in Lincoln.   You need only look at what the Nighthawks drew (a franchise which will likely disappear with it's league in the near future)... to realize the potential that UNO has.

All the reasons I hear for UNO football not working at the D1-AA level are the same reasons UNO hockey should never have worked at the D1 level.


Yes, thank you!

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Postby Erik » Mon Mar 28, 2011 9:31 am

Okay, since we all now agreed that it is a conspiracy to protect the interests of UNL athletics and nothing to do with the betterment of UNO and it's athletic department.

We all should write hate email to Dr. Tom and his cronies as we will never forgive UNL for this!

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Postby Zilla » Mon Mar 28, 2011 10:08 am

Erik wrote:Okay, since we all now agreed that it is a conspiracy to protect the interests of UNL athletics and nothing to do with the betterment of UNO and it's athletic department.

We all should write hate email to Dr. Tom and his cronies as we will never forgive UNL for this!


No no...you can't do that.  They're all already scared to heck over UNO!!  You want to give them heart attacks!?  I heard they had a party this weekend celebrating the demise of UNO football and to plan how to shut down all the flag football tournaments, just in case.

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Postby bearcatguy » Mon Mar 28, 2011 12:14 pm

What's funny is, all the attention has gone to the athletic changes.  However, every single prof or academic at UNO that I've seen quoted, have all said what a great upgrade academically this move will be (and it will be).  Last I checked, UNO is an academic institution.  Shouldn't the fact the move will help the school's academic status be more important than any sport?

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Postby OmahaBen » Mon Mar 28, 2011 3:08 pm

bearcatguy wrote:What's funny is, all the attention has gone to the athletic changes.  However, every single prof or academic at UNO that I've seen quoted, have all said what a great upgrade academically this move will be (and it will be).  Last I checked, UNO is an academic institution.  Shouldn't the fact the move will help the school's academic status be more important than any sport?


This isn't exactly a move to the Big Ten that comes with an automatic membership to the CIC like UNL is getting.

I honestly fail to see how this move affects the academic side of things at all, except that it will result in fewer athletes being admitted who may or may not be academically qualified.

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Postby HskrFanMike » Tue Mar 29, 2011 12:59 pm

Stargazer wrote:Give me a break... most of these teams came from the NCC... UNO would be taking no different a path.  Indeed, it is precisely that POTENTIAL for success, which scared the heck out of the people in Lincoln.   You need only look at what the Nighthawks drew (a franchise which will likely disappear with it's league in the near future)... to realize the potential that UNO has.

All the reasons I hear for UNO football not working at the D1-AA level are the same reasons UNO hockey should never have worked at the D1 level.


Yes, thank you!

Uh...no...

There is a reason why the Nighthawks drew as well as they did.  It's not beer (though that probably helped)..and it's something UNO likely cannot do.

The Nighthawks had the flexibility to schedule their games away from the Nebraska Cornhuskers, who typically don't set their game times until 2 weeks before the game.  They played on a Thursday, two Fridays, and a Saturday when the Huskers had a week off.

The Nighthawks would have dawn a UFL Championship type crowd if they would have played at the same time as a Husker game, and probably a half-empty stadium on the same day as a Husker home game.

If UNO wants to schedule all of their games on Friday nights, it could work. But I don't see that working for 1-AA football on a regular basis.
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Postby Big E » Tue Mar 29, 2011 1:58 pm

HskrFanMike wrote:There is a reason why the Nighthawks drew as well as they did.  It's not beer (though that probably helped)..and it's something UNO likely cannot do.

The Nighthawks had the flexibility to schedule their games away from the Nebraska Cornhuskers, who typically don't set their game times until 2 weeks before the game.  They played on a Thursday, two Fridays, and a Saturday when the Huskers had a week off.


You're absolutely right, because when UNL changes their schedule two weeks in advance for television there's absolutely no way UNO could do the same...

Also, since the football schedules are usually only done 2-4 years in advance, there's no way UNO could ask their league to try to schedule them on opposite weeks whenever possible.  

There's literally no possible way this could be organized.  None whatsoever.

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Postby bearcatguy » Wed Mar 30, 2011 12:20 pm

Big E wrote:
HskrFanMike wrote:There is a reason why the Nighthawks drew as well as they did.  It's not beer (though that probably helped)..and it's something UNO likely cannot do.

The Nighthawks had the flexibility to schedule their games away from the Nebraska Cornhuskers, who typically don't set their game times until 2 weeks before the game.  They played on a Thursday, two Fridays, and a Saturday when the Huskers had a week off.


You're absolutely right, because when UNL changes their schedule two weeks in advance for television there's absolutely no way UNO could do the same...

Also, since the football schedules are usually only done 2-4 years in advance, there's no way UNO could ask their league to try to schedule them on opposite weeks whenever possible.  

There's literally no possible way this could be organized.  None whatsoever.


So UNO would have to dictate their schedule according to what UNL does?  Why?  If you can provide information on other schools at the FCS level who do this, I'd be interested.  Also, UNO can't just change kickoff times without getting the ok from the opposing school, because TV wouldn't be involved.  Who's to say schools would be fine with changing a 1pm kickoff time to 7pm?

I would also suspect whomever the UNO coach would have been, wouldn't have been too excited about having to make changes to the schedule based on what's going on in Lincoln.  What does that say about program support from alumni and the school, when you have to make in-season adjustments to the schedule, because NU's game time got moved?

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Postby nebugeater » Wed Mar 30, 2011 12:30 pm

bearcatguy wrote:
Big E wrote:
HskrFanMike wrote:There is a reason why the Nighthawks drew as well as they did.  It's not beer (though that probably helped)..and it's something UNO likely cannot do.

The Nighthawks had the flexibility to schedule their games away from the Nebraska Cornhuskers, who typically don't set their game times until 2 weeks before the game.  They played on a Thursday, two Fridays, and a Saturday when the Huskers had a week off.


You're absolutely right, because when UNL changes their schedule two weeks in advance for television there's absolutely no way UNO could do the same...

Also, since the football schedules are usually only done 2-4 years in advance, there's no way UNO could ask their league to try to schedule them on opposite weeks whenever possible.  

There's literally no possible way this could be organized.  None whatsoever.


So UNO would have to dictate their schedule according to what UNL does?  Why?  If you can provide information on other schools at the FCS level who do this, I'd be interested.  Also, UNO can't just change kickoff times without getting the ok from the opposing school, because TV wouldn't be involved.  Who's to say schools would be fine with changing a 1pm kickoff time to 7pm?

I would also suspect whomever the UNO coach would have been, wouldn't have been too excited about having to make changes to the schedule based on what's going on in Lincoln.  What does that say about program support from alumni and the school, when you have to make in-season adjustments to the schedule, because NU's game time got moved?



Maybe I am just running around with Blinders on but didn't UNO already do that with their FB scheduling?
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Postby HskrFanMike » Wed Mar 30, 2011 12:45 pm

bearcatguy wrote:What does that say about program support from alumni and the school, when you have to make in-season adjustments to the schedule, because NU's game time got moved?

And that, in the end, is why UNO dropped their football program.  UNO played 7 home football games last season, and season attendance for those seven games was barely more than attended the two-game UNO vs. Wisconsin hockey series in February.

And that included home games against Nebraska-Kearney and Northwest Missouri State, which drew decent crowds.

The market has spoken loudly.  The alumni have spoken loudly.  They don't care about UNO football.  Swapping Northern Iowa for Northwest Missouri State isn't going to change that much.

The only people speaking loudly are former players and their families. They should be upset. Part of their heritage is being shut down.  They have every right to be angry. Something they poured blood, sweat, and tears into is gone.

But they shouldn't be angry at Trev Alberts.  All they had to do was turn around at the games and look who was behind them.  When Creighton Prep draws more people to the campus than the UNO football team, something is wrong.
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Postby Big E » Wed Mar 30, 2011 1:01 pm

So UNO would have to dictate their schedule according to what UNL does?

Yes.
Why?

Because one is UNL and one isn't UNL.

Same reason I have to carve out a niche in my industry because I have competitors that are 500 times my size that can control the commodity market if they so choose.  I suppose I could just close the door and tell my employees to go home because dammit, it's just too hard. Image

If you can provide information on other schools at the FCS level who do this, I'd be interested.

I would be, too.  Not sure it is relevant whether they do or don't.  Point is they could and should.
Also, UNO can't just change kickoff times without getting the ok from the opposing school

Then you make some phone calls and get the permission.  There's literally no 1-AA football league (at least one with a brain in its head) that wouldn't work with it's members to try to schedule around competition for butts in seats.
Who's to say schools would be fine with changing a 1pm kickoff time to 7pm?

"Hello?  Fellow conference members?  We have two options this weekend.  One involves 3000 in attendance and the other involves 20,000 in attendance.  Can we work something out?"
I would also suspect whomever the UNO coach would have been, wouldn't have been too excited about having to make changes to the schedule based on what's going on in Lincoln.

As if Pelini is excited about changing routine based on what is going on at ESPN.  Do you want a paycheck or not?
What does that say about program support from alumni and the school, when you have to make in-season adjustments to the schedule, because NU's game time got moved?

Again, refer to above about one being UNL and the other one not being UNL.  Ask John Cook what he thinks about tweaking the volleyball schedule.  Again, do you want a paycheck or not?

Honestly, I don't think I've ever seen people digging harder for bull |expletive| reasons to quit than I have on this whole UNO athletics issue.

Yet again, every last argument I have heard against this are the same exact reasons UNO hockey shouldn't work.  I'll add Creighton basketball in to the mix at this point, as well, which has nowhere near the athletic tradition nor alumni base as UNO.

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Postby bearcatguy » Wed Mar 30, 2011 3:26 pm

Wow Big E, you've got responses to everything, except for one aspect that I've yet to see UNO football supporters touch, which I brought up in an earlier post.  Did you see the type of facilities FCS programs are playing in today?  Have you been to Al Caniglia Field?  Outside of the scoreboard, nothing about Al Caniglia Field screams FCS level football.  So, if UNO kept football, that would mean a huge fundraising effort to have a facility that was worthy of FCS level competition.  I'm talking about a 20,000 seat facility, with a state of the art press box and locker rooms, suites, everything.  Could they have used TD Ameritrade?  Sure, I guess they could have, and moved football off campus (which if you take a look at any school that plays football off campus, you'll see attendance, and student support is dismal).  

So, would you be interested in UNO taking on more debt to build new football facilities, or would you be content with two not so great options of playing at Canigilia as is (with a few minor face-lifts), or playing off-campus, halfway across town with dismal student support (based on other schools playing off-campus)?

Also, to counter some of your points.  If UNO couldn't get 10,000 people to show up for games over the past 10 years (which were some of the best 10 years in program history), they aren't sniffing 20,000 at all.  And bringing up volleyball to defend UNO football, is well, kind of making the point for me.

UNO hockey works because it's different, and doesn't really have anything competing against it.  Creighton can't play the same night as UNO hockey in Omaha, and people don't go to NU basketball games.

And come again on Creighton?  Neither tradition or alumni base come close to UNO?  Yikes.

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Postby Big E » Wed Mar 30, 2011 5:30 pm

bearcatguy wrote:Wow Big E, you've got responses to everything


Quit asking me questions then.

bearcatguy wrote:except for one aspect that I've yet to see UNO football supporters touch, which I brought up in an earlier post.  Did you see the type of facilities FCS programs are playing in today?  Have you been to Al Caniglia Field?  Outside of the scoreboard, nothing about Al Caniglia Field screams FCS level football.  So, if UNO kept football, that would mean a huge fundraising effort to have a facility that was worthy of FCS level competition.  I'm talking about a 20,000 seat facility, with a state of the art press box and locker rooms, suites, everything.


I can't believe I have to |expletive| address this again.

Oh wait...

bearcatguy wrote:Could they have used TD Ameritrade?  Sure, I guess they could have, and moved football off campus (which if you take a look at any school that plays football off campus, you'll see attendance, and student support is dismal).


I would take my chances on that one.  Aside from the stadium being a baseball stadium, there's literally nothing about it that isn't vastly superior to playing at Caniglia on campus.  Even that is a wash when taking in to consideration attendance of Nighthawks games.

bearcatguy wrote:So, would you be interested in UNO taking on more debt to build new football facilities


No.

bearcatguy wrote:or would you be content with two not so great options of playing at Canigilia as is (with a few minor face-lifts), or playing off-campus, halfway across town with dismal student support (based on other schools playing off-campus)?


How many of those 17,000 Creighton students that go to all the home basketball games live within walking distance of 10th and Cass?

bearcatguy wrote:Also, to counter some of your points.  If UNO couldn't get 10,000 people to show up for games over the past 10 years (which were some of the best 10 years in program history), they aren't sniffing 20,000 at all.


Again, quit trying to compare my hypothetical 1-AA apple to the D2 banana.

bearcatguy wrote:And bringing up volleyball to defend UNO football, is well, kind of making the point for me.


Point being that a program that routinely brings in capacity crowds is forced to schedule around another sport in order to get said crowds.  It really isn't that difficult of a concept.

bearcatguy wrote:UNO hockey works because it's different


Namely being off campus and having beer sales, and no one else in Omaha plays the sport at that level (kind of like 1-AA football).

bearcatguy wrote:and doesn't really have anything competing against it.


Other than Creighton basketball, also off campus with beer sales.

bearcatguy wrote:Creighton can't play the same night as UNO hockey in Omaha


Except that they have in the past.

bearcatguy wrote:and people don't go to NU basketball games.


According to the NCAA they ranked 45th in the country for 2010 at just north of 9,900 per game.  Barely on campus.  With no beer.

And come again on Creighton?  Neither tradition or alumni base come close to UNO?  Yikes.


UNO has double the enrollment.  UNO has been playing football for 100 years.  Aside from one trip to the CWS, no one knew Creighton had an athletic department until the basketball team moved into the Qwest.

I'd even be willing to put the collective pockets of UNO alumni up against the collective pockets of Creighton alumni.
Last edited by Big E on Thu Mar 31, 2011 11:57 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby cp jay 07 » Wed Mar 30, 2011 6:31 pm

Big E wrote:
bearcatguy wrote:
And come again on Creighton?  Neither tradition or alumni base come close to UNO?  Yikes.


UNO has double the enrollment.  UNO has been playing football for 100 years.  Aside from one trip to the CWS, no one knew Creighton had an athletic department until the basketball team moved into the Qwest.

I'd even be willing to put the collective pockets of UNO alumni up against the collective pockets of Creighton alumni.



Wow Big E I was on your side till this. Are you serious? You are saying a D-2 commuter school has more tradition than Creighton. Wow this is tough to say but I might have to join F-u-s-k-e-r fans side here because you are not making much sense.

The correct thing to say is that people did not care about UNO sports till hockey came along. Then it was we support UNO hockey and nothing else UNO type fans. UNO has about as much athletic tradition as Dana College.

Trust me people in Omaha knew about Creighton before 91 and the Qwest. They were selling the Civic out in the 70s and 80s with no problem. Also the 2003 with 12 straight sell outs happened before the Qwest.

And I don't want to start a whole private vs public school thing here but I'm pretty sure Creighton's alumni has a little more cash than UNO's. I'm not saying a UNO degree is not good and no UNO alums have money or good jobs, I'm just saying I bet the top ranked University in the Midwest has no problem fund raising.

I still think you should be worried about the sport that really got screwed and cut for no reason, the wrestling program.

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Postby joeglow » Wed Mar 30, 2011 7:53 pm

bearcatguy, you are pissing in the wind.  The people you are arguing with have made it CLEAR that they despise Nebraska football.  NO amount of logic or reasoning we deter them from their conspiracy theories.  No matter what, UNL and TO are scared of UNO and Trev colluded with them to destroy what would have threatened Nebraska.

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Postby Big E » Wed Mar 30, 2011 11:07 pm

Joe, "the people" he are arguing with is me. I went to UNL, I'm a lifelong fan and have made it clear I think the conspiracy theories are bunk.

Lately this forum gets a collective 3 on the reading comprehension portion of the ACT.

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Postby joeglow » Thu Mar 31, 2011 7:58 am

Big E wrote:Joe, "the people" he are arguing with is me. I went to UNL, I'm a lifelong fan and have made it clear I think the conspiracy theories are bunk.

Lately this forum gets a collective 3 on the reading comprehension portion of the ACT.



Ohhhh.  There is not a conspiracy theory.  The people in charge did what they honestly thought was right.  It's just that they are too stupid to run an AD and Big E should be able to fill them in on why their decision was wrong and football would have flourished if he were making the decisions.  Thanks for clearing that up.
Last edited by joeglow on Thu Mar 31, 2011 10:03 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Postby Zilla » Thu Mar 31, 2011 9:23 am

Big E wrote:Yet again, every last argument I have heard against this are the same exact reasons UNO hockey shouldn't work.  I'll add Creighton basketball in to the mix at this point, as well, which has nowhere near the athletic tradition nor alumni base as UNO.


Except, UNO football isn't UNO hockey....or Creighton basketball for that matter.  You seem to have this idea that just moving up to this new division would suddenly invigorate UNO football.  There's simply no proof of that.  People in this town just don't seem to care about UNO football.  I don't know why...it's unfortunate as they are generally fun games, but attendance speaks for itself.  I have no doubt that after everything that's happened, if football would have somehow been saved, there would have been a surge of attendance.....but I'm equally convinced that it would fall off rather quickly after the "extreme loyalty" feeling wore off.  I just don't have the faith you seem to have in the people of this town to consistently get behind a team they have historically shown little interest in.

Now, it's been said that to keep the football program they would have to gamble more money and the entire athletic department on it's success.  Meaning, if it failed to make enough money and be successful at that level, they would lose the entire AD department....not just football and wrestling.  Now, I don't know if those numbers are accurate or if that statement is true.  I know that I've seen this point glossed over by everyone wanting to keep the football/wrestling programs (at least I haven't seen anyone address it directly).  So assuming that information IS accurate, is it logical to gamble the entire AD department and throw more money at a sport that, unfortunately, hasn't been very successful in the past?  Keep in mind it needs to consistently make money....and donations need to be received EVERY year...not just this one year to keep the program afloat.  I'm sure there are lots of people right now that would throw a donation to the UNO AD department....but would they do that every year?  I doubt it.

I hate to see UNO football and wrestling go.  But if the above is true and they simply couldn't stay afloat "as is," what other choices are left?
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Postby joeglow » Thu Mar 31, 2011 10:09 am

Big E wrote:Then you make some phone calls and get the permission.  There's literally no 1-AA football league (at least one with a brain in its head) that wouldn't work with it's members to try to schedule around competition for butts in seats.


For the reason stated above, I want to stay out of this.  However, I could not let this go.  PLEASE explain to me why, as an opposing coach going on the road, I would have ANY incentive to let you change the time if that meant my team had to play in front of 15,000 fans (in Happy Big E land) instead of playing in front of only 2,500 opposing fans.  My job is to win and minimizing fan impact while on the road is a part of your job.  I cannot imagine why any coach would willingly make their and their team's job harder just so UNO can become great and dethrone Nebraska.


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