Pinnacle / Swanson Site (10th and Capitol)

Post by **Omaha Cowboy** » Mon Oct 02, 2006 9:36 am

Awesome stuff Josh..

I like the design alot..

..

..Ciao..LiO....Peace

adam186 · Post by **adam186** » Mon Oct 02, 2006 12:03 pm

I like the design too. One thought, what about a set back before the pyramid? And adding a spire?

the1wags · Post by **the1wags** » Mon Oct 02, 2006 12:05 pm

Its still a work in progress.

That being said, I'm not a fan of spires on a building just to add height.

adam186 · Post by **adam186** » Mon Oct 02, 2006 12:10 pm

What are you using for the renderings?

the1wags · Post by **the1wags** » Mon Oct 02, 2006 12:39 pm

Google earth and a add on called (I think) Google sketch.

the1wags · Post by **the1wags** » Mon Oct 02, 2006 2:00 pm

I like the idea of the streetcar jumping over to 11th for a few reasons.

10th st has more car traffic on it, Omaha by Design showed 11th getting the brick restored and being a true ped friendly street. Also, I want my 11th st ped bridge through the GLM to happen.

With it going over to 11th through the Swanson site also puts it right on that empty block between 11th and 12th, Capitol and Dodge, which makes that instantly hot property as well.

As far as going south with a future extension of the streetcar, I've stated my preference for going down 13th over 10th. Flatter route, goes by Sokal, and the other buildings along 13th (think around Boheimian cafe) is a better area to boom after streetcar.

Don't get me wrong, if they decide to build down 10th, I won't object.

Anyways, someone needs to step up to the plate on the Swanson site. That hotel anchored tower needs to happen!

zedmib · Post by **zedmib** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 2:30 pm

I like Brad's signature photo. I've had an idea for awhile. I would like to see a skyscraper on the swanson site with a similar design as the red steel markers at the corner of 10th and Cuming.
Something like:
http://www.emporis.com/en/wm/bu/?id=119425
or
http://www.emporis.com/en/wm/bu/?id=121138
Just dreaming

.

Post by **Brad** » Mon Nov 06, 2006 11:23 pm

adam186 · Post by **adam186** » Mon Nov 06, 2006 11:28 pm

DEVELOPERS: Please develop the above site. Thank you!

Edit: Should we change the thread title since it's clear they didn't find a buyer?

DTO Luv · Post by **DTO Luv** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 2:01 pm

Speaking of the Swanson site, I was talking with someone last night who worked on schemes for the Swanson site and let's just say I left very disappointed after having talked with him.

His architectural firm worked on a design for the Swanson site that would have included a combination of office, apartment, and retail space. Â There were commitments from both retailers and businesses. Â The two retailers that had signed on were Borsheims and Nebraska Furniture Mart. Â They were both going to open up smaller scaled stores in order to satisfy the needs/wants of the new customers down there.

Then it all fell through because Swanson wanted way more than the developers were willing to pay. Â I asked him if there was going to be any potential development on that site and he said 'no, because no one will pay what they want for the site.' Â Swanson can charge as much as they want right now just because they know that is a prime space for re-development.

(Copied from the other thread)

I know the city had high hopes and specific plans for this site. I'm not at all to hear about the mixed use nature of the site since this is what the city was asking for. It's disappointing to know that we probably could have had something being built now if not for the high price of the site. Does anyone know what it's going for? And as Jeff said this would be the perfect time for emminant domain. The city stands to miss out on big bucks once Phase 1 of the streetcar rolls past here if Swanson is still holding out.

Big E · Post by **Big E** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 2:44 pm

Not specifically on topic, but more of a development-centric incentive idea...

The city needs to pass tax legislation that immediately assesses your property at your asking price if it's been sitting unsold for more than 120 days. Â

When an assumed project like this is being held up because of greedy or unrealistic landowners (Swanson, the Postal Annex, the parking lot on 12th and Harney with the Diner) asking WAY too much for their land. Â Property owners would have to seriously consider asking fair market prcies if they knew they were going to have to start paying taxes on a $2.3 million slab of concrete that won't sell. Â The 120 day window would allow them to test the market, but "forces" them to reasses their asking price. Â If they balk about it being assessed that high, the city can just say "Hey, we're going off YOUR assessment... Thanks for doing our job for us. Â We must have missed something in our drive-by review."

Any thoughts?

-Big E

Ice Cream · Post by **Ice Cream** » Sat Jan 06, 2007 7:32 pm

Big E,

Your idea sounds really good. Is it something you just thought of; or do you know of something similar employed elsewhere?[/center]

Post by **Brad** » Sun Jan 07, 2007 1:09 am

No reason for a new thread

http://eomahaforums.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=1434

StreetsOfOmaha · Post by **StreetsOfOmaha** » Sun Jan 07, 2007 12:11 pm

Big E, that sounds FANTASTIC. Â I wish the city would do something like that.

And Brad, get off it already. Â There's value in a new thread, a fresh slate for discussion. Â Again, just because it has to do with a similar subject doesn't mean it has to be a part of that discussion, especially one that ENDED two years ago! Â I see the need for thread consolidation if there are two threads pretty much running parallel at the same time and discussing the same thing, but if a new discussion develops in a new thread, it is UNIQUE, and if a thread hasn't been visited in years, it is DEAD.

Big E · Post by **Big E** » Sun Jan 07, 2007 2:03 pm

That's a Big E original as far as I know.

Seems to make perfect sense and would be horribly easy to accomplish. Â I mean, how could someone legitimately claim their property was being overvalued by the city if the city was using the owner's own asking price for valuation?

Are you listening City Council??!?!?! Â Actually, I might have to send off an email on that one...

-Big E

Post by **Brad** » Sun Jan 07, 2007 4:58 pm

StreetsOfOmaha wrote:Big E, that sounds FANTASTIC. I wish the city would do something like that.

And Brad, get off it already. There's value in a new thread, a fresh slate for discussion. Again, just because it has to do with a similar subject doesn't mean it has to be a part of that discussion, especially one that ENDED two years ago! I see the need for thread consolidation if there are two threads pretty much running parallel at the same time and discussing the same thing, but if a new discussion develops in a new thread, it is UNIQUE, and if a thread hasn't been visited in years, it is DEAD.

You guys just want to start a new thread so you can argue about the same |expletive| over again.

Uffda · Post by **Uffda** » Sun Jan 07, 2007 5:49 pm

start a new thread so you can argue about the same |expletive| over again

actually i dont see any arguments happening on any of these supposedly repeat threads..... if they need to be combined then that is something the moderator could do

blueskyomaha · Post by **blueskyomaha** » Sun Jan 07, 2007 6:01 pm

DTO Luv, I posted the price for the property just over two years ago on a thread titled "Pinnacle Foods". Â The information I had back then was "3.24 acres and includes two small parcels that are in the parking lot across the street. The listing price is $6,332,580. The estimated price for the demolition is around $1.2M." Â As mentioned that information is old, and the details may be much different now.

Post by **Brad** » Sun Jan 07, 2007 6:01 pm

Anyone heard anything new on the Swanson site lately?

Big E · Post by **Big E** » Sun Jan 07, 2007 10:03 pm

adam186 wrote:DEVELOPERS: Â Please develop the above site. Â Thank you!

Edit: Â Should we change the thread title since it's clear they didn't find a buyer?

Adam, you know Brad wouldn't get to be sarcastic if we did that. Â Let him have his moment. Â ;)

-Big E

StreetsOfOmaha · Post by **StreetsOfOmaha** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 1:44 am

Brad wrote:Anyone heard anything new on the Swanson site lately?

You may have to give this thread mouth-to-mouth, Brad. Â Meanwhile, if you're interested in a CURRENT discussion of the Swanson site, there's a thread started here:

http://eomahaforums.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=5856

Â :;): Â :;): Â :;): Â :;):

StreetsOfOmaha · Post by **StreetsOfOmaha** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 1:58 am

Well, Big E, your idea is BRILLIANT.

And Brad, as someone already said, I don't see anyone "arguing" anything.

I'm just pointing out, that this thread was started, and if the other old thread was more pertinent, this thread would die and people would continue to post over there. And besides, to just tell everyone to "continue the discussion over at the old thread" completely discounts all the legitimate comments that have already been made in the new thread, and the evolving discussion that they constitute.

Post by **Brad** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 3:28 am

Aaron, and Everyone

I am not trying to be Difficult. Â We are all here for the same reason, we love Omaha.

I look at this form as an Omaha Resource. Â I hope that when people make decisions about Omaha they check out "our" forum. Â I think that it is easier and people get the full story if they can look under one topic on a "broad" subject and get the full story. Â

In the case of this thread, I would hope that people can look up "Pinnacle Foods" or "Swanson Site" and get one thread with everything. Â In the old thread there were a lot of good Ideas that people on this time took their time to think up and draw up. Â I would hope that an outside developer might look at this thread and decide there are so many possibilities with this site and we can get a GREAT new development.

I hope that we can all work together to make Omaha and surrounding areas a great place.

Sincerely,
Brad Williams

Post by **Brad** » Mon Jan 08, 2007 3:35 am

StreetsOfOmaha wrote:
Brad wrote:Anyone heard anything new on the Swanson site lately?
You may have to give this thread mouth-to-mouth, Brad. Meanwhile, if you're interested in a CURRENT discussion of the Swanson site, there's a thread started here:

http://eomahaforums.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?t=5856

:;): :;): :;): :;):

Please check out that other thread, I tried to explain myself.

Hawkeye · Post by **Hawkeye** » Thu Jan 11, 2007 10:28 am

Big E wrote:That's a Big E original as far as I know.

Seems to make perfect sense and would be horribly easy to accomplish. I mean, how could someone legitimately claim their property was being overvalued by the city if the city was using the owner's own asking price for valuation?

Are you listening City Council??!?!?! Actually, I might have to send off an email on that one...

-Big E

Actually, that very concept was tossed around a couple of years ago in CB. Â When Lewis Central School District built its new HS at Hwy 92 and 275, for some INEXPLICABLE reason, they didn't buy all of the land all the way up to the corner...so they went about their merry way building a state-of-the-art HS, and then suddenly noticed that the owner of the land sitting adjacent to the HS site had proposed building a self-storage facility (you've all seen them countless times...U-G-L-Y!).

Anyway, the guy that owned the land offered to sell it to the LC School District...at about 4 times its assessed value. Â Many on the school board, in the administration, and within Lewis Township and City of Council Bluffs leadership wanted to take the tack you suggested...and tell the guy, "Okay, you want to say your land is worth 1.2M when the county has assessed it at 300k...that's fine by us. Â We'll just charge you property taxes on your self-assessment. Â Good luck with that. Â Oh, and when you come into default because you can't pay your taxes, we'll just take your land, lock, stock, and barrel." Â

But for whatever reason (probably because they didn't really have a legal leg to stand on at the time), they never attempted that tactic. Â And now, the premier high school in southwest Iowa has a big, ugly, eyesore of a storage facility out in front of it. Â

Granted, it was the school districts own idiotic failing in not securing ALL of the land when it had the chance originally, but it certainly opened a lot of eyes to the problem of over-inflated valuations by land owners and what could be done to abort such a trend.

DTO Luv · Post by **DTO Luv** » Thu Jan 11, 2007 6:17 pm

It probably could work here since there is more at stake and more groups that would force the issue than a school board.

scraper · Post by **scraper** » Thu Jan 11, 2007 10:01 pm

Property needs to be assessed based on its actual value. Â The value an owner places on the property when they are selling property is not necessarily the actual value.

It is their property and they can ask what they want - but it doesn't mean that is what the property is worth.

Big E · Post by **Big E** » Thu Jan 11, 2007 10:45 pm

scraper wrote:Property needs to be assessed based on its actual value. The value an owner places on the property when they are selling property is not necessarily the actual value.

It is their property and they can ask what they want - but it doesn't mean that is what the property is worth.

Value and worth are purely subjective when it comes to assessing property for taxation. Â I have sold two primary residences in the past six years (in MN and MD) and not one of them was assessed close to what I paid for it originally nor what I sold it for, nor is the one I currently own in NE.

When you state that you want $100 for something for a good, service or property, you have immediately placed a value on that item. Â Worth will be determined by the market... as in, will anyone pay that much for it?

-Big E

Swift · Post by **Swift** » Thu Jan 18, 2007 4:22 pm

Did you email that to the city council? That'd get some butts moving.

OR the city should just go ahead and use eminent domain.

Post by **Brad** » Thu Jan 18, 2007 6:24 pm

Swift wrote:OR the city should just go ahead and use eminent domain.

Correct me if I am wrong, but if the city wanted to use eminent domain, wouldn't they have to pay pair market value. Â If so, then they would have to spend millions to tear it down and clean up the site.

Probably not worth it to them.

ItsAllAboutMe · Post by **ItsAllAboutMe** » Fri Jan 19, 2007 7:15 am

I think the city should get really tough on this property. Â The city of Omaha did $3 million in renovations to that plant in return Swanson agreed to keep the plant open for at least 2 years. Â I thought it was a huge mistake for Fahey to do this as I thought it was just stupid to invest city money to save 250 jobs for only a 2 year guarantee. Â So Swanson sells the plant and the new owners shut it down in less then a year. Â Â So now we have $3 million dollars wasted on a building that is just going to get torn down. Â The city should have invested $3 million dollars tearing it down and had they done that the the site would look much more inviting to development.

DTO Luv · Post by **DTO Luv** » Sat Jan 20, 2007 11:32 am

I'm not sure what all the city can do to force something along here. I do like Big E's idea about taxing them at what they say it's worth. I'm not certain how eminent domain works but it's something the city should consider.

Since the streetcar will be running next to here it would make sense for their plan to spur development by knocking this down.

Stargazer · Post by **Stargazer** » Sat Feb 24, 2007 8:39 pm

The city purportedly plans to buy the Pinnacle site for $2.5M

Mayor Mike Fahey believes the more than three acres of prime downtown real-estate are too valuable to the city's future to leave to hodgepodge development, said Paul Landow, the mayor's chief of staff.

A private buyer has offered to purchase the remaining plant, where workers once produced Swanson frozen dinners.

City officials were particularly concerned that the private buyer's short-term plan is for surface parking lots. City officials saw no long-term development plans by the private buyer, Landow said.

The city is planning to put out a request for private development of the land. The parcel is large enough to include office buildings, hotels, retail and residential buildings, (planning directory) Jensen said.

http://www.omaha.com/index.php?u_page=2 ... id=2337371

the1wags · Post by **the1wags** » Sat Feb 24, 2007 8:50 pm

This is good news. Even though it is going to cost the city some money, I for one am glad that they are acquiring this parcel to control the development there. Surface parking IS NOT good enough.

How about someone builds this, only with one tower being a hotel.

http://www.keynotecalgary.com

Post by **Brad** » Sat Feb 24, 2007 9:21 pm

About time. Â There better be something with some height to it!!!

Big E · Post by **Big E** » Sun Feb 25, 2007 3:01 pm

Wow. Â I'm thrilled that the city is willing to step in and prevent this from becoming a parking lot. Â (We need to spend all that new Elkhorn money somewhere, I guess.)

It's still just a shame that they HAVE to step in to prevent that kind of "development". Â Why does it always seem like we're in prevention mode rather than progression mode?

-Big E

Dfresh · Post by **Dfresh** » Sun Feb 25, 2007 6:43 pm

The private developer had no intention of turning the property into a parking lot. Â The developer is a local group who the city never even contacted to see what the developer might do on the lot. Â The sad thing is that the developer currently has a proposed project on the table for downtown Lincoln that would cost 30 million.
The proposed project in Lincoln will be mixed-use retail, condo, office.

All I can say is that the pinnacle property would have been nothing but 1st class...Hotel or mixed-use

The city is trying to make this look like a developer is going to come in and park cars???
Thus justifying spending 2.5 million in city funds...

I don.t get it? Â Not only that Â but the city will also lose the property tax on that property which is substantial when you consider the property is currently assessed at 6.5 million.

Minneapolis Boy · Post by **Minneapolis Boy** » Sun Feb 25, 2007 7:08 pm

Something bigger must be in the works.

OmahaJaysCU · Post by **OmahaJaysCU** » Sun Feb 25, 2007 7:33 pm

Minneapolis Boy wrote:Something bigger must be in the works.

That's what I am thinking. Â I won't be holding my breath though, it still may be a couple of years until we even hear anything.

Post by **Coyote** » Sun Feb 25, 2007 7:46 pm

The operative words in that article may have been short term and long term. Apparently whoever was looking at this property would have had to clear the block - short term - but had not secured any tenants for the long term planning. It may have been a parking lot for several years. What I read into it is that the City wants someone to come in and develop it right away and not wait 4 or 5 years. They do not want it to stay off the tax role for very long at all. They want to aggresively get something on this block - something that they have more control over. This is prime property - an entrance to Omaha - a connection between North Downtown and the Old Market - so they have a serious vested interest on this land.

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