Camden Creek (85th and Seward)

Post by **Brad** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 11:53 am

Neighbors aren't sold on plans for subdivision

http://www.omaha.com/index.php?u_pg=1636&u_sid=2057051

A proposal for an upscale subdivision north of the former Peony Park supports the city's plan to curb urban sprawl, its developers say.

WHERE? Flood plain?

TitosBuritoBarn · Post by **TitosBuritoBarn** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 2:48 pm

These "neighbors" are a bunch of pricks...and $180,000 homes aren't "low income."

Finn · Post by **Finn** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 5:02 pm

This is a vacant piece of land north of the Little League ball fields (which are between the elementary school and the Little Papio Creek). To the north of this land are a couple of warehouses that front Blondo Street (one used to be Earl Sheib Auto Painting). It would be a good place for some infill but I certainly would expect some buffer b/w the warehouses (maybe that is where the mentioned park will go).

Swift · Post by **Swift** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 5:35 pm

I love it when people throw around terms they don't understand, like "low income housing." *slaps forehead*

Apparently the words "low income" actually mean "close proximity."

MTO · Post by **MTO** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 7:38 pm

These people must have their heads up their |expletive|! The only thing that would make me happier is if it where denser.

mchine73 · Post by **mchine73** » Thu Nov 03, 2005 9:29 am

More density is exactly what I was thinking, why not just make these nice townhouses and call the matter dead.

TitosBuritoBarn · Post by **TitosBuritoBarn** » Thu Nov 03, 2005 1:43 pm

But but but....the added traffic! If all the 35 proposed "low income" homes have 5 cars each, that'll amount to 100,000 more cars passing through this area every several hours! Won't someone please think of the children!

Why is traffic always a concern? There are like 30ish homes on my street in Omaha. It is a street occasionally used to pass through in order to reach an additional 10ish homes surrounding a T junction at the other end. My friends and I played in the street all the time because it was rare for cars to pass by. And nobody ever got hit by a car except for my stupid dog who decided to stand in front of one after it waited for her to get out of the way.

Post by **Brad** » Thu Nov 03, 2005 4:29 pm

Looks like more room than I thought

eomaha · Post by **eomaha** » Thu Nov 03, 2005 9:10 pm

Thompson said he thought the planning board and City Council would back the project, which fits the city's master development plan.

But he questioned some aspects of the project.

"Is this the right market for a $180,000 house on a small lot with potentially no basement?" he asked.

Density issues, homeowners' expenses and basement additions are major issues that the neighbors and developers must resolve, Thompson said.

Is Thompson afraid he's going to lose well to do constituents to other parts of Omaha or something? If a developer wants to take the risk (although this hardly seems to be the case here) of building more upscale properties in an otherwise less than upscale area... why should anyone stop them??

reddomaha · Post by **reddomaha** » Fri Nov 04, 2005 11:19 pm

This is a good location for a project like this. I was actually involved with a couple of projects that died trying to take advantage of this land.

When did the Low Income housing come into play? Because from what has been reported in the OWH, the housed in the are average 120K and these townhomes are going to go for 180K.

Traffic is laughable too. Isn't the closest and best access off (shoot, can't remember the name of street infront of the Hy-Vee)?

Finn · Post by **Finn** » Sat Nov 05, 2005 9:26 am

It is on the opposite side of the creek than I thought. All of the name streets (running east-west) dead end to the east of 85th Street heading to the creek. 85th Street provides easy access to Western, Cass/Dodge and Blondo (but is only two lanes). There are some run-down homes where these streets dead-end (definitely not the $120,000 homes in the neighborhood).

Post by **Brad** » Sat Nov 05, 2005 12:16 pm

There is no room on the other side. its Hillside Little League and houses.

Finn · Post by **Finn** » Sat Nov 05, 2005 12:55 pm

There is (was - if the LL expanded) a large vacant tract north of the LL fields and south of the old Earl Shieb warehouse (along Blondo) as I previously mentioned.

Post by **Brad** » Sun Nov 06, 2005 2:15 am

I know, I still don't think there is room, they said between Seward and Decatur, Earl Schrib is north of Decatur, and there still isn't room there. I still think it is the first picture I showed.

In the top of this photo is Earl Schrib, in the bottom is the LL field.

Post by **Brad** » Tue Nov 27, 2007 2:25 pm

Meanwhile 2 years later.... The project is still alive. The city council approved some engineering work for public improvements for the project.

Post by **Brad** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 4:04 pm

And 2 more years... All the roads are in.

almighty_tuna · Post by **almighty_tuna** » Mon Nov 02, 2009 4:18 pm

I'm on it!!

Justmeagain · Post by **Justmeagain** » Tue May 15, 2012 2:51 am

Shall we revive this topic? The second developer has started a different project on the same location. Same number of houses and same name but different intent. Maybe this time people will get the facts before jumping to conclusions about the "neighbors."

Seth · Post by **Seth** » Wed May 16, 2012 8:32 am

Wow, this is a little history story here all in one place.

I'm curious how the intent is different now with basically the same construction. I am interested in a project that adds infill housing to an existing neighborhood that already has the needed infrastructure (well, except highway capacity for 100,000 cars an hour).

BTW, shouldn't this be in one of the development threads?

Justmeagain · Post by **Justmeagain** » Wed May 16, 2012 10:51 am

Where do I start, Seth?

The intent is different in that the houses won't be sold, they will be rented. The developer won't retain responsibility for upkeep so who does? (City Council stated, "That will be a problem.")

Neighborhood made agreements with the first developer (some not recorded) who went bankrupt (just like neighborhood said he would.) There was no existing infrastructure. He put in storm sewers to drain to the Papio & paved the streets. He hauled in tons of dirt & built up the area for compaction to allow for basements and left it. Drain tile has not been installed. When somebody builds a 6' tall privacy fence, who knew somebody could haul in dirt to the adjacent lot & build it up almost level with the top of the fence? Seriously! (Sorry, don't have a photo hosting site or I'd add a photo.)

Don't know how the "low income housing" rumor started with the first developer. The problem was the plans as presented allowed back yards of approx. 12 - 15' deep behind each house. Front yards were no better and side yards were 5'. Most didn't have driveways long enough to park a car. And he needed a minimum of $185,000 each? He planned to build a couple and sell them before building more.

The neighborhood wasn't worried about the development being completed for many years, if ever. We did, however, want assurances that, if he defaulted, someone else couldn't come in & use the plat (rezoned) to do something w/o neighborhood involvement. City Council (with Planning & Legal) stated that the rezoning was tied to the plat and approved for that developer only. Anyone else would have to start over with Planning & City Council with input from the neighborhood.

New developer has started and CC said he didn't need any reviews or approvals. We presented the CC video showing their statements and promises. But the Pres. of Planning & their legal at that time have retired and it wasn't recorded with that stipulation so it's not binding. Huh???

Neighborhood has no problems with the area being developed. But there are definitely problems with some "specifics."

BTW, I added to an existing thread in the Suburban Omaha Development Forum. Is there someplace else this should go?

Post by **Brad** » Wed May 16, 2012 11:24 am

Justmeagain wrote:The intent is different in that the houses won't be sold, they will be rented. The developer won't retain responsibility for upkeep so who does? (City Council stated, "That will be a problem.")

I don't understand how the developer won't retain responsibility. Is the developer selling them to someone else who is going to rent them? The owner is ultimately responsible for their own property no matter who lives there.

Justmeagain wrote:Neighborhood made agreements with the first developer (some not recorded) who went bankrupt (just like neighborhood said he would.) There was no existing infrastructure. He put in storm sewers to drain to the Papio & paved the streets. He hauled in tons of dirt & built up the area for compaction to allow for basements and left it. Drain tile has not been installed. When somebody builds a 6' tall privacy fence, who knew somebody could haul in dirt to the adjacent lot & build it up almost level with the top of the fence? Seriously! (Sorry, don't have a photo hosting site or I'd add a photo.) .

I don't understand the different grades? Last time I went through there I remember one big pile of dirt over by the creek, which I thought was the strippings.

Drain tile for what?

Justmeagain wrote:Don't know how the "low income housing" rumor started with the first developer. The problem was the plans as presented allowed back yards of approx. 12 - 15' deep behind each house. Front yards were no better and side yards were 5'. Most didn't have driveways long enough to park a car. And he needed a minimum of $185,000 each? He planned to build a couple and sell them before building more.

There are $185,000+ all over Midtown with no driveways at all... Just a garage on an ally. They also have very small yards.

Justmeagain wrote:The neighborhood wasn't worried about the development being completed for many years, if ever. We did, however, want assurances that, if he defaulted, someone else couldn't come in & use the plat (rezoned) to do something w/o neighborhood involvement. City Council (with Planning & Legal) stated that the rezoning was tied to the plat and approved for that developer only. Anyone else would have to start over with Planning & City Council with input from the neighborhood.

New developer has started and CC said he didn't need any reviews or approvals. We presented the CC video showing their statements and promises. But the Pres. of Planning & their legal at that time have retired and it wasn't recorded with that stipulation so it's not binding. Huh??? .

That sucks, but if its not recorded, you may as well forget about it.

Justmeagain wrote:BTW, I added to an existing thread in the Suburban Omaha Development Forum. Is there someplace else this should go?

Its in the right spot now. This thread was in the News Section, but I moved it to this section.

Justmeagain · Post by **Justmeagain** » Wed May 16, 2012 12:49 pm

I don't understand how the developer won't retain responsibility. Is the developer selling them to someone else who is going to rent them? The owner is ultimately responsible for their own property no matter who lives there.

We don't understand it either. It seems to be some kind of government program. City Council apparently doesn't know who will manage it after the project is completed. Or at least they didn't tell us when we asked.

I don't understand the different grades? Last time I went through there I remember one big pile of dirt over by the creek, which I thought was the strippings.

From the street you can't tell because that was raised, too. But the west side of the area was built up a lot. Developer had promised ranch style houses along west side. But current plans are for 2 story houses. Imagine your back yard like this and a 2 story house on top of it. (Yes the equipment, sewer pipes, etc. are sitting on the new ground level behind the fence.)

Drain tile for what?

There was supposed to be drain tile along the west edge to prevent back-flow of the natural drainage (from 90th Street to the Papio.) A drain was installed on the southwest corner, but it has sand bags around it. Stripping was done before dirt was hauled in.

There are $185,000+ all over Midtown with no driveways at all... Just a garage on an ally. They also have very small yards.

Could be but these were like modified row houses. Developer said target buyers were "young professionals and empty nesters." Maybe "young professionals," but not if they're starting a family. And "empty nesters" don't usually want a 2 story house.

That sucks, but if its not recorded, you may as well forget about it.

So the City Council can promise the moon but, if somebody fails to record it accurately, there's nothing that can be done?

Its in the right spot now. This thread was in the News Section, but I moved it to this section.[/quote]

I replied to original thread and thought it said Development at the top. Sorry.

cdub · Post by **cdub** » Wed May 23, 2012 7:51 am

There were a number of conditions regarding drainage originally that are still in place. I have no idea what the neighbors expected it to look like but it will have to work and City will have to keep tabs on that as it builds out.

Id love to know exactly what was said and when but once a plat is final and approved by CC, thats it. The lots are there and anyone can own them or build on them. Perhaps they were referring to a time prior to that final plat being approved?

Justmeagain · Post by **Justmeagain** » Thu Jun 14, 2012 8:34 am

The good news is that this (local) developer will retain responsibility.

But the City (Mayor) signed an agreement with someone who didn't even own the land. The plat was drawn based on certain plans/intentions of the original developer. (Which is why CC approved it for that developer ONLY.) And it was filed before conditions of CC approval had been met. Then the City proceeded with making improvements. The original developer didn't get financing & went bankrupt so the City was stuck with thousands of dollars of expenses.

Bottom line is the City really screwed up and the neighborhood is paying for it.
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Tiffany · Post by **Tiffany** » Mon Apr 15, 2013 1:16 pm

Well Im not sure what I did to anyone in this neighborhood but its like you hate me already and have no idea where I come from or what I stand for...I am a young professional with 2 College Degrees and also have 2 boys 14 and 10. I know everything looks kind of unorganized right now but the homes are almost finished and Camden Creek is starting to look even better now! Even better than the run downed homes already there so if you ask me it was money well spent for that area.

Justmeagain · Post by **Justmeagain** » Mon Apr 15, 2013 5:30 pm

I don't know what you read that made you think the neighborhood "hates" you. Maybe comments like:

These "neighbors" are a bunch of pricks...and $180,000 homes aren't "low income."

and

Is Thompson afraid he's going to lose well to do constituents to other parts of Omaha or something?

Those comments were made by people who obviously didn't know what they were talking about.

In the beginning the neighborhood had concerns about many issues. For one, Seward and Decatur streets were not paved and there were no storm sewers. The addition of 33 houses and the resulting traffic warranted street improvements which normally are assessed against the property owners. That issue was resolved when the City Council ordered the costs assessed to the Development. Other issues included access of emergency vehicles. Again, this was resolved by the City Council by reducing the total number of houses from 35 to 33 and increasing the turn radius of the streets into the development. There are no basements and, even though the neighborhood was assured there would be a storm shelter, there are no known plans for one. Stormwater runoff and privacy restoration are ongoing issues.

So you see, the neighborhood doesn't "hate" the people who will be living there. Quite the contrary. Many of the concerns of the neighborhood have been for the safety and well-being of the new families who will be part of the neighborhood. As for "the run downed homes already there," there might be a couple of houses that need some repair. But, to copy your words, you have "no idea" who those people are or their circumstances. Most of the people next to you are older and/or disabled. Wouldn't it be nice if they had neighbors that would help them out once in a while? Or at least look beyond their run-down house and give them a chance.

almighty_tuna · Post by **almighty_tuna** » Tue Apr 16, 2013 3:16 am

I think this is a record for years between original post and butthurt reaction.

Big E · Post by **Big E** » Tue Apr 16, 2013 8:07 am

almighty_tuna wrote:I think this is a record for years between original post and butthurt reaction.

Shut it down. Post of the Year.

Tiffany · Post by **Tiffany** » Tue Apr 16, 2013 12:12 pm

Thanks for clearing that up....but I never meant any disrespect to the people of those run down homes...I was simply pointing out that Camden Creek brings more Value to that area! And thats my opinion! And as for the Disabled and Elderly in that area, I have the most respect for them...my son is Disabled and has been since Birth! So why wouldnt I give them a chance or help them? Thats why I said you DONT know me and have no idea what I STAND FOR....My opinion

scrubby85 · Post by **scrubby85** » Tue Sep 10, 2013 1:40 am

Tiffany wrote:Thanks for clearing that up....but I never meant any disrespect to the people of those run down homes...I was simply pointing out that Camden Creek brings more Value to that area! And thats my opinion! And as for the Disabled and Elderly in that area, I have the most respect for them...my son is Disabled and has been since Birth! So why wouldnt I give them a chance or help them? Thats why I said you DONT know me and have no idea what I STAND FOR....My opinion

Yeah it will bring value until it's completely run down in 5 or so years.

cdub · Post by **cdub** » Tue Sep 10, 2013 8:14 am

scrubby85 wrote:
Tiffany wrote:Thanks for clearing that up....but I never meant any disrespect to the people of those run down homes...I was simply pointing out that Camden Creek brings more Value to that area! And thats my opinion! And as for the Disabled and Elderly in that area, I have the most respect for them...my son is Disabled and has been since Birth! So why wouldnt I give them a chance or help them? Thats why I said you DONT know me and have no idea what I STAND FOR....My opinion
Yeah it will bring value until it's completely run down in 5 or so years.

Always nice when someone signs up to make a post just aimlessly bashing someone.

The development is fine and existing neighborhoods almost always are resistant to change. In the end everyone will likely learn to accept the new normal.

Foundations · Post by **Foundations** » Thu Sep 26, 2013 9:53 am

RNcyanide · Post by **RNcyanide** » Thu Sep 26, 2013 9:56 am

Welcome, Foundations. Thanks for the picture.

scrubby85 · Post by **scrubby85** » Sat Oct 26, 2013 3:31 pm

cdub wrote:
scrubby85 wrote:
Tiffany wrote:Thanks for clearing that up....but I never meant any disrespect to the people of those run down homes...I was simply pointing out that Camden Creek brings more Value to that area! And thats my opinion! And as for the Disabled and Elderly in that area, I have the most respect for them...my son is Disabled and has been since Birth! So why wouldnt I give them a chance or help them? Thats why I said you DONT know me and have no idea what I STAND FOR....My opinion
Yeah it will bring value until it's completely run down in 5 or so years.
Always nice when someone signs up to make a post just aimlessly bashing someone.

The development is fine and existing neighborhoods almost always are resistant to change. In the end everyone will likely learn to accept the new normal.

Yeah because that's what I was doing. I just helped a friend move in here at the end of July. Give it ten years. I'm sure it will fit in perfectly to what that area has become.

scrubby85 · Post by **scrubby85** » Sat Oct 26, 2013 3:36 pm

cdub wrote:
scrubby85 wrote:
Tiffany wrote:Thanks for clearing that up....but I never meant any disrespect to the people of those run down homes...I was simply pointing out that Camden Creek brings more Value to that area! And thats my opinion! And as for the Disabled and Elderly in that area, I have the most respect for them...my son is Disabled and has been since Birth! So why wouldnt I give them a chance or help them? Thats why I said you DONT know me and have no idea what I STAND FOR....My opinion
Yeah it will bring value until it's completely run down in 5 or so years.
Always nice when someone signs up to make a post just aimlessly bashing someone.

The development is fine and existing neighborhoods almost always are resistant to change. In the end everyone will likely learn to accept the new normal.

Btw I find it hilarious that people can drive an Escalade yet basically have a 1600 sq ft house given to them for $750.00. Enlighten me on how the system works.

Seth · Post by **Seth** » Thu Oct 31, 2013 1:41 pm

Looks like pretty ordinary suburban housing to me.

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