Omaha Streetcar Discussion

[Busguy2010]

This is pretty darn cool to look at: http://www.alleypoyner.com/news/2018/4/ ... -your-help

I'm getting closer to sharing my comprehensive Omaha public transportation plan. It cues a lot off of our streetcar and bus transit history, and our current situation. I think it's the best chance we have at a useful transportation system. I've put a lot of thought and time into it, and I feel it's the most realistic plan that includes streetcars, light rail and commuter rail I've seen. Hope ya'll, as well as MAPA and Metro, like it.

[omahahawk]

great find...thanks for posting

[Stargazer]

Good grief, they should have slipped a $100 million 'transportation' bond in with all of these others on today's ballot which are passing by an average of 3 to 1.

[Doctor Fate]

[youtube][/youtube]
From 6 months ago but an interesting video with some analysis of what downtown could look like with less surface/structured parking and how that could affect the projected number of jobs returning to downtown.

[Louie]

[youtube][/youtube]
From 6 months ago but an interesting video with some analysis of what downtown could look like with less surface/structured parking and how that could affect the projected number of jobs returning to downtown.

Excellent video.

[daveoma]

Awesome! I hope everyone who complains about parking downtown watches this video.

[Greg S]

Article on Koch Brothers fighting public trans:

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/06/19/clim ... ansit.html


Greg

[buildomaha]

Omaha needs to move on the streetcar now. I think that the majority of people who live in Omaha are VERY embracing of "hip" things like the area of Blackstone and cool East O stuff that can't be found in the suburbs. Riding the bus is almost a novelty for a lot of young people and I think introducing a form of transport that is permanent and more understandable would encourage more people to try public transport. When I made my friends ride the CWS circulator to our car they took "artsy pics" on a city bus!!! Our city is already setting itself up for a PERFECT light rail system with nodules of dense and mixed-use developments/redevelopments being built and proposed all around the city which would be ideal stops along LR lines. (Downtown/Midtown, Aksarben, potentially Crossroads, Westroads, West Farm, opportunities with Millard and Oak View, the Zoo and Airport).

A streetcar could open people's eyes to the possibility that we don't have to use the majority of our space for parking! Omaha needs to press the gas on projects aiding economic development AND the city's image to those not from here. Omaha historically (and especially right now) has one of the lowest unemployment rates of any city in the nation. I think right now the city has the opportunity to transform the city's image from being known as "Just part of Nebraska" to a forward-thinking, prosperous city that is an amazing place to live in. GLM transformation, midtown's resurgence, the metro's continued success with attracting top-tier sporting events and conventions, AMAZING philanthropic community... that's a lot happening at once and I have a feeling that connecting our entire downtown-midtown area with a nice new streetcar could be the last push to set off an explosion of development. It seems like the people with the big bucks are really pushing for an investment in the city and its image, and I don't think most citizens have a problem with that. Let's not forget that this isn't just charity work for them either-attracting more people to the city helps them with their workforce as well!

Thank you for reading my very RockHarbor-esque post

[Uffda]

I saw this in the Warren Watch article in yesterday’s paper.

Electric Byd Buses

Here’s an idea to resolve that dispute over streetcars in Omaha, and it’ll even help a business with a local connection, of sorts.

Metro Transit can order a fleet (or even just a few) of the same electric buses that a European company ordered for Oslo, Norway. They’re made by BYD Inc., the Chinese company that is 10 percent owned by Berkshire.

Nobina AB, which runs buses throughout Scandinavia, ordered 42 of the buses for delivery next spring, when they will join two others running in Oslo since last year, BYD reported.

They don’t have wires overhead, instead using batteries equipped with pantograph chargers, a mechanism that hooks into a street-side charging device.

Rubber tires, flexible routes as needed, no gasoline emissions, no rails in the streets.

[Busguy2010]

Inflexibility and rails in the street are exactly the two aspects that make a streetcar the shot in the arm it is. I feel like we've been over this 1,000 times. There is no alternative.

Do we need a streetcar? No

Do we need a streetcar to excell, keep up with, and surpass other cities? Absolutely

Let's do it.

[Louie]

Inflexibility and rails in the street are exactly the two aspects that make a streetcar the shot in the arm it is. I feel like we've been over this 1,000 times. There is no alternative.

Do we need a streetcar? No

Do we need a streetcar to excell, keep up with, and surpass other cities? Absolutely

Let's do it.

Love the enthusiasm.

[Uffda]

I spent a few days a couple of weeks ago for the first time ever in Chicago -- I say screw the street car plan --- let's build an omaha elevated train instead.

[Busguy2010]

I spent a few days a couple of weeks ago for the first time ever in Chicago -- I say screw the street car plan --- let's build an omaha elevated train instead.

I'm definitely more a proponent Light rail than streetcar, but I recognize that Omaha probably would never get a light rail system. But hey, If we can all agree that a light rail system would be the ticket, then I say screw the streetcar plan too

[buildomaha]

I spent a few days a couple of weeks ago for the first time ever in Chicago -- I say screw the street car plan --- let's build an omaha elevated train instead.

I'm definitely more a proponent Light rail than streetcar, but I recognize that Omaha probably would never get a light rail system. But hey, If we can all agree that a light rail system would be the ticket, then I say screw the streetcar plan too

I couldn't agree more.

[Professor Woland]

I was under the impression that elevated trains and subways were classified as heavy rail. As I understand it light rail is more like the MAX in Portland. I loathe streetcars and light rail, but would be more than okay with heavy rail. It doesn't create more traffic congestion, goes at a good speed, actually moves a lot of people and isn't stupid. Buses are good, and if your city has or can have enough jobs clustered together to justify it, heavy rail is great. Streetcars are an abomination and light rail (as I understand the term) isn't much better.

[Busguy2010]

I was under the impression that elevated trains and subways were classified as heavy rail. As I understand it light rail is more like the MAX in Portland. I loathe streetcars and light rail, but would be more than okay with heavy rail. It doesn't create more traffic congestion, goes at a good speed, actually moves a lot of people and isn't stupid. Buses are good, and if your city has or can have enough jobs clustered together to justify it, heavy rail is great. Streetcars are an abomination and light rail (as I understand the term) isn't much better.

Yes, anything powered with a third rail is "heavy rail" or otherwise "rapid transit" or not really sure what to call it, but its not light rail. It's called heavy rail because, as far as I know, the cars are "heavy" and require much more underlayment work. Also, by nature, they have to be completely separated from other forms of traffic (or people would be electrocuted to death daily) Also, not sure if this is true or not, but it would make sense if the rail itself is bigger, thus "heavy"

Light rail is powered by the overhead wire. They don't necessarily all operate in mixed traffic, but some cities have put portions of their systems in "mixed traffic" where the trains are separated, but not by grade, so crossings with other traffic is allowed. That can be useful in some ways by getting riders closer to a more intimate street setting, or front door service... That is IF it's only used like that in short portions. Obviously there are a few systems in america that used that alignment WAY too much and have accidents all the time, and can't go very fast. You can have grade-separated light rail systems, like St louis, and have all the perks of high speed heavy rail, without quite the construction cost...

[Uffda]

Reading these comments over the years about why OMaha needs a streetcar I really feel this under current reason is because then people can say ‘Look at us we have a strettcar’ But the unspoken part of that sentence would be ‘even though the rest of our mass transportation is woefully inadequate’ BUT we have a street car.

I seen a few people on here comment about improving the mass transportation but others sort dismiss those comments because it doesn’t fit their dream of having a streetcar that runs from Creighton to midtown/Blackstone.

Like I said I had The opportunity to visit Chicago for a conference. I walked a couple of blocks to catch the green line to within 4 blocks of the conference and of course used it on the way back and also to and from Midway. I found it very easy to use and it was always busy. I talked to one gentleman at the conference who use to live in Wisconsin and taught in Chicago. He drove 40 minutes to catch the train into Chicago and then switched over to a bus to get to the school. He said his totally travel time was 1.5-2hrs each way. Not what I would want to do each day but that’s how long it would take for me to go from my house @ 78 and Sorensen to work in South O. And at my previous job off of 144th and Fort there wasn’t and still isn’t any metro bus service in that direction to even try it.

I just feel it’s too bad the energy, planning and money that has been put toward ‘we need a streetcar ‘ wasn’t out toward improving Omaha’s mass transit overall.

http://en.byd.com/usa/bus/

[bigredmed1]

Reading these comments over the years about why OMaha needs a streetcar I really feel this under current reason is because then people can say ‘Look at us we have a strettcar’ But the unspoken part of that sentence would be ‘even though the rest of our mass transportation is woefully inadequate’ BUT we have a street car.

I seen a few people on here comment about improving the mass transportation but others sort dismiss those comments because it doesn’t fit their dream of having a streetcar that runs from Creighton to midtown/Blackstone.

Like I said I had The opportunity to visit Chicago for a conference. I walked a couple of blocks to catch the green line to within 4 blocks of the conference and of course used it on the way back and also to and from Midway. I found it very easy to use and it was always busy. I talked to one gentleman at the conference who use to live in Wisconsin and taught in Chicago. He drove 40 minutes to catch the train into Chicago and then switched over to a bus to get to the school. He said his totally travel time was 1.5-2hrs each way. Not what I would want to do each day but that’s how long it would take for me to go from my house @ 78 and Sorensen to work in South O. And at my previous job off of 144th and Fort there wasn’t and still isn’t any metro bus service in that direction to even try it.

It’s just feel it’s too bad the energy, planning and money that has been put toward ‘we need a streetcar ‘ wasn’t out toward imoroving Omaha’s mass transit overall.

http://en.byd.com/usa/bus/

YEP!

[ita]

I appreciate the discussion concerning the streetcar and public transportation in general. I know this is a dream, but when arguing about whether to have a streetcar or light rail/heavy rail, why not both? I do not believe there is one single mode of mass transportation that will solve all of our problems. However, having both, supplemented by a robust bus system, would be the better overall solution to the city's growing transportation issues. I believe prior posters including Busguy, have provided their thoughts on a more integrated public transportation system. That is what we need.

I would agree with Buildomaha, however, in that the time is right for a streetcar. With growing density in DT/MT area, the city continuing to host large national events, the desire to attract more businesses to the DT/MT area, and, I assume, more people visiting our fair city, per growing service numbers at Eppley, I think the streetcar can be a catalyst for much greater connectivity and investment in DT/MT, as evidenced by other streetcar projects in Detroit, Salt Lake City, and our big brother, Kansas City. It is not the end-all of our transportation problems, but it will serve a purpose.

As for the greater transportation issues that our city faces, it has been discussed before, the City needs a comprehensive, forward-thinking plan that, like the streetcar, needs to be implemented now. I appreciate the City's efforts in improving public transportation by introducing ORBT. However, I hope this is just be an opening salvo for improving mass transportation in Omaha. This should just be one step of several, including the streetcar, rather than the end of the efforts for now until greater congestion arises.

[guy4omaha]

Thank you for reading my very RockHarbor-esque post

Oooooh, I learned a new word today!!!

[Garrett]

Thank you for reading my very RockHarbor-esque post

Oooooh, I learned a new word today!!!

Not nearly enough tangents honestly, nor admiration of the beauty of suburban office buildings and strip malls. 2/10 try again.

[Busguy2010]

I appreciate the discussion concerning the streetcar and public transportation in general. I know this is a dream, but when arguing about whether to have a streetcar or light rail/heavy rail, why not both? I do not believe there is one single mode of mass transportation that will solve all of our problems. However, having both, supplemented by a robust bus system, would be the better overall solution to the city's growing transportation issues. I believe prior posters including Busguy, have provided their thoughts on a more integrated public transportation system. That is what we need.

I would agree with Buildomaha, however, in that the time is right for a streetcar. With growing density in DT/MT area, the city continuing to host large national events, the desire to attract more businesses to the DT/MT area, and, I assume, more people visiting our fair city, per growing service numbers at Eppley, I think the streetcar can be a catalyst for much greater connectivity and investment in DT/MT, as evidenced by other streetcar projects in Detroit, Salt Lake City, and our big brother, Kansas City. It is not the end-all of our transportation problems, but it will serve a purpose.

As for the greater transportation issues that our city faces, it has been discussed before, the City needs a comprehensive, forward-thinking plan that, like the streetcar, needs to be implemented now. I appreciate the City's efforts in improving public transportation by introducing ORBT. However, I hope this is just be an opening salvo for improving mass transportation in Omaha. This should just be one step of several, including the streetcar, rather than the end of the efforts for now until greater congestion arises.

The plan I put out includes commuter rail (heavy) and light rail. If you're talking about rapid transit like what D.C., Atlanta, Miami, and LA have, I think that would be ideal, but I sincerely feel like heavy rail rapid transit is a thing of the past because of the cost and amount of right of way they require. D.C. and LA have both added onto their rapid transit systems, but chose light rail, probably for various reasons including cost, right of way, efficiency.

I feel like we need to use each level of transportation to our advantage. On the bottom, you have streetcar, which isn't great for traveling long distances, but it stimulates the development that supports all the other forms of transit. The Metro bus system should ideally feed into the ORBT system, and the ORBT system feed into the light rail system, then the light rail system and commuter rail system feed each other. It's just so simple... The amount of time it takes to travel by bus in our city is too long. Our bus system needs to feed into faster forms of transit.

Repost of my plan:

[buildomaha]

I appreciate the discussion concerning the streetcar and public transportation in general. I know this is a dream, but when arguing about whether to have a streetcar or light rail/heavy rail, why not both? I do not believe there is one single mode of mass transportation that will solve all of our problems. However, having both, supplemented by a robust bus system, would be the better overall solution to the city's growing transportation issues. I believe prior posters including Busguy, have provided their thoughts on a more integrated public transportation system. That is what we need.

I would agree with Buildomaha, however, in that the time is right for a streetcar. With growing density in DT/MT area, the city continuing to host large national events, the desire to attract more businesses to the DT/MT area, and, I assume, more people visiting our fair city, per growing service numbers at Eppley, I think the streetcar can be a catalyst for much greater connectivity and investment in DT/MT, as evidenced by other streetcar projects in Detroit, Salt Lake City, and our big brother, Kansas City. It is not the end-all of our transportation problems, but it will serve a purpose.

As for the greater transportation issues that our city faces, it has been discussed before, the City needs a comprehensive, forward-thinking plan that, like the streetcar, needs to be implemented now. I appreciate the City's efforts in improving public transportation by introducing ORBT. However, I hope this is just be an opening salvo for improving mass transportation in Omaha. This should just be one step of several, including the streetcar, rather than the end of the efforts for now until greater congestion arises.

The plan I put out includes commuter rail (heavy) and light rail. If you're talking about rapid transit like what D.C., Atlanta, Miami, and LA have, I think that would be ideal, but I sincerely feel like heavy rail rapid transit is a thing of the past because of the cost and amount of right of way they require. D.C. and LA have both added onto their rapid transit systems, but chose light rail, probably for various reasons including cost, right of way, efficiency.

I feel like we need to use each level of transportation to our advantage. On the bottom, you have streetcar, which isn't great for traveling long distances, but it stimulates the development that supports all the other forms of transit. The Metro bus system should ideally feed into the ORBT system, and the ORBT system feed into the light rail system, then the light rail system and commuter rail system feed each other. It's just so simple... The amount of time it takes to travel by bus in our city is too long. Our bus system needs to feed into faster forms of transit.

Repost of my plan:

Your plan is very impressive and I don't think I've ever seen it before.

[ita]

I appreciate the discussion concerning the streetcar and public transportation in general. I know this is a dream, but when arguing about whether to have a streetcar or light rail/heavy rail, why not both? I do not believe there is one single mode of mass transportation that will solve all of our problems. However, having both, supplemented by a robust bus system, would be the better overall solution to the city's growing transportation issues. I believe prior posters including Busguy, have provided their thoughts on a more integrated public transportation system. That is what we need.

I would agree with Buildomaha, however, in that the time is right for a streetcar. With growing density in DT/MT area, the city continuing to host large national events, the desire to attract more businesses to the DT/MT area, and, I assume, more people visiting our fair city, per growing service numbers at Eppley, I think the streetcar can be a catalyst for much greater connectivity and investment in DT/MT, as evidenced by other streetcar projects in Detroit, Salt Lake City, and our big brother, Kansas City. It is not the end-all of our transportation problems, but it will serve a purpose.

As for the greater transportation issues that our city faces, it has been discussed before, the City needs a comprehensive, forward-thinking plan that, like the streetcar, needs to be implemented now. I appreciate the City's efforts in improving public transportation by introducing ORBT. However, I hope this is just be an opening salvo for improving mass transportation in Omaha. This should just be one step of several, including the streetcar, rather than the end of the efforts for now until greater congestion arises.

The plan I put out includes commuter rail (heavy) and light rail. If you're talking about rapid transit like what D.C., Atlanta, Miami, and LA have, I think that would be ideal, but I sincerely feel like heavy rail rapid transit is a thing of the past because of the cost and amount of right of way they require. D.C. and LA have both added onto their rapid transit systems, but chose light rail, probably for various reasons including cost, right of way, efficiency.

I feel like we need to use each level of transportation to our advantage. On the bottom, you have streetcar, which isn't great for traveling long distances, but it stimulates the development that supports all the other forms of transit. The Metro bus system should ideally feed into the ORBT system, and the ORBT system feed into the light rail system, then the light rail system and commuter rail system feed each other. It's just so simple... The amount of time it takes to travel by bus in our city is too long. Our bus system needs to feed into faster forms of transit.

Repost of my plan:

Yes, this is what I was alluding to. Thanks for the re-post and the effort you put into creating this. I don't know if you updated it since your initial posting, or if you intend to, but the first proposed line along Dodge and Harney is up on ORBT's website at http://www.rideorbt.com/path/.

[bones]

I appreciate the discussion concerning the streetcar and public transportation in general. I know this is a dream, but when arguing about whether to have a streetcar or light rail/heavy rail, why not both? I do not believe there is one single mode of mass transportation that will solve all of our problems. However, having both, supplemented by a robust bus system, would be the better overall solution to the city's growing transportation issues. I believe prior posters including Busguy, have provided their thoughts on a more integrated public transportation system. That is what we need.

I would agree with Buildomaha, however, in that the time is right for a streetcar. With growing density in DT/MT area, the city continuing to host large national events, the desire to attract more businesses to the DT/MT area, and, I assume, more people visiting our fair city, per growing service numbers at Eppley, I think the streetcar can be a catalyst for much greater connectivity and investment in DT/MT, as evidenced by other streetcar projects in Detroit, Salt Lake City, and our big brother, Kansas City. It is not the end-all of our transportation problems, but it will serve a purpose.

As for the greater transportation issues that our city faces, it has been discussed before, the City needs a comprehensive, forward-thinking plan that, like the streetcar, needs to be implemented now. I appreciate the City's efforts in improving public transportation by introducing ORBT. However, I hope this is just be an opening salvo for improving mass transportation in Omaha. This should just be one step of several, including the streetcar, rather than the end of the efforts for now until greater congestion arises.

The plan I put out includes commuter rail (heavy) and light rail. If you're talking about rapid transit like what D.C., Atlanta, Miami, and LA have, I think that would be ideal, but I sincerely feel like heavy rail rapid transit is a thing of the past because of the cost and amount of right of way they require. D.C. and LA have both added onto their rapid transit systems, but chose light rail, probably for various reasons including cost, right of way, efficiency.

I feel like we need to use each level of transportation to our advantage. On the bottom, you have streetcar, which isn't great for traveling long distances, but it stimulates the development that supports all the other forms of transit. The Metro bus system should ideally feed into the ORBT system, and the ORBT system feed into the light rail system, then the light rail system and commuter rail system feed each other. It's just so simple... The amount of time it takes to travel by bus in our city is too long. Our bus system needs to feed into faster forms of transit.

Repost of my plan:

Love the plan. Only problem is the Lincoln commuter rail line conflicts with the flood Ashland plan to create the great lake of Nebraska

[bones]

In all seriousness though, in regard to the streetcar, if you still view it as only a public transportation provider, you are looking at it wrong. There is no doubt that there are countless other, cheaper, public transit alternatives to get people around the downtown and midtown area (shuttles, buses, ride sharing ect.) But the point is that a streetcar serves more purposes than only public transit.

The first, and likely most important, purpose a streetcar serves is that of an economic development tool. This is attributable to the fact that streetcars have rail lines (obviously) which are pretty difficult to move once they are placed (also obviously). This encourages businesses and developers to locate along or near the line as there is a certainty that the streetcar will continue to operate along that street for a significant period of time. Compared to other modes of transportation, such as buses, where the lines of transit could be moved at any moment. This certainty allows developers and businesses to take greater risk, take out bigger loans, and build bigger developments. It's estimated that developers in Omaha would double the size of their buildings with the presence of a streetcar (from an avg of 4-5 stories to 8-10 stories). Additionally, stores and businesses along and near the line would grow their businesses tremendously. In KC, revenues from sales tax along the line rose 56% in the first year.

This brings us to the second purpose of streetcars, revenue generating. Without a doubt, streetcars require considerable upfront capital investment. But there is a return on that investment. As mentioned, streetcars promote further development and business growth. Both of which provide property tax and sales tax respectively. For example, KC has had two luxury apartment towers rise along the rail line. The second one was a $120 million investment. At a Douglas County property tax rate of 2.07%, that's just shy of $2.5 million in property tax revenue each year. From one development project. Imagine a project like that goes up on one of the city surface lots downtown. That property went from generating $0 tax for the city to $2.5 million. Which carries me to my next point.

The streetcar is cityscape altering. It allows denser development and requires less parking. To be clear, both of those are good things. Density is a major contributor to why cities are so successful, and if you do not understand why density is good for a city, I can direct you to some materials that help explain the benefits it provides. Also, less parking! Downtown Omaha has a parking problem, as in, it has too much of it. A streetcar would allow you to park your car at UNMC or Midtown and go down to a Jays game, the riverfront, or the Old Market. It makes the city more walkable and enjoyable by bringing more things to do closer together downtown and in midtown.

The fourth point has been brought up before and is the idea that Omaha just wants a streetcar to say we have a streetcar. However, this is actually a valid reason. A streetcar acts as an indicator or an economic signal that Omaha is investing in itself and trying to be cutting edge and progressive. We are not going to be left behind and we are a "cool" "hip" place to be. Which, believe it or not, is very important to attracting and retaining talent to both the city and the state, especially considering the fact Nebraska is experiencing a brain drain where we are losing ~2,300 highly educated individuals every year. And considering our unhealthily low unemployment rate, that is doubly concerning. It is important to attracting companies too, as quality public transit was listed as one of the highest rated items for businesses when considering moving to a new city. A streetcar is a signaling tool to businesses large and small that Omaha is investing in its future.

Oh, and did I mention it is a form of public transit?

The streetcar isn't a silver bullet to Omaha's public transport needs, but it is an important link in the overall transit chain that Omaha is going to have to continue to invest in and create. It's not "Streetcar." end of story. Its "Streetcar and..." as we continue to upgrade our woefully inadequate transit system.

[buildomaha]

Kind of related to the streetcar:

Roads in downtown Omaha are ridiculously wide. I understand the need for increased capacity during morning and evening worker rush hours, but four-lane, one-way roads are ridiculous with the amount of traffic downtown gets. Like Des Moines is doing, I think many of the roads downtown should be converted to two-way roads with bike lanes. I also think MUCH wider sidewalks are needed in places downtown. Here is Vox (yes I know its Vox, but this isn't a right-left political topic) video talking about the effectiveness of such a "Road Diet."

[youtube][/youtube]

[BRoss]

Kind of related to the streetcar:

Roads in downtown Omaha are ridiculously wide. I understand the need for increased capacity during morning and evening worker rush hours, but four-lane, one-way roads are ridiculous with the amount of traffic downtown gets. Like Des Moines is doing, I think many of the roads downtown should be converted to two-way roads with bike lanes. I also think MUCH wider sidewalks are needed in places downtown. Here is Vox (yes I know its Vox, but this isn't a right-left political topic) video talking about the effectiveness of such a "Road Diet."

[youtube][/youtube]

They have plans to do road diets on a couple streets outside of downtown next year - 24th between Leavenworth and J St and 30th between Ames and Cuming.

[Busguy2010]

In all seriousness though, in regard to the streetcar, if you still view it as only a public transportation provider, you are looking at it wrong. There is no doubt that there are countless other, cheaper, public transit alternatives to get people around the downtown and midtown area (shuttles, buses, ride sharing ect.) But the point is that a streetcar serves more purposes than only public transit.

The first, and likely most important, purpose a streetcar serves is that of an economic development tool. This is attributable to the fact that streetcars have rail lines (obviously) which are pretty difficult to move once they are placed (also obviously). This encourages businesses and developers to locate along or near the line as there is a certainty that the streetcar will continue to operate along that street for a significant period of time. Compared to other modes of transportation, such as buses, where the lines of transit could be moved at any moment. This certainty allows developers and businesses to take greater risk, take out bigger loans, and build bigger developments. It's estimated that developers in Omaha would double the size of their buildings with the presence of a streetcar (from an avg of 4-5 stories to 8-10 stories). Additionally, stores and businesses along and near the line would grow their businesses tremendously. In KC, revenues from sales tax along the line rose 56% in the first year.

This brings us to the second purpose of streetcars, revenue generating. Without a doubt, streetcars require considerable upfront capital investment. But there is a return on that investment. As mentioned, streetcars promote further development and business growth. Both of which provide property tax and sales tax respectively. For example, KC has had two luxury apartment towers rise along the rail line. The second one was a $120 million investment. At a Douglas County property tax rate of 2.07%, that's just shy of $2.5 million in property tax revenue each year. From one development project. Imagine a project like that goes up on one of the city surface lots downtown. That property went from generating $0 tax for the city to $2.5 million. Which carries me to my next point.

The streetcar is cityscape altering. It allows denser development and requires less parking. To be clear, both of those are good things. Density is a major contributor to why cities are so successful, and if you do not understand why density is good for a city, I can direct you to some materials that help explain the benefits it provides. Also, less parking! Downtown Omaha has a parking problem, as in, it has too much of it. A streetcar would allow you to park your car at UNMC or Midtown and go down to a Jays game, the riverfront, or the Old Market. It makes the city more walkable and enjoyable by bringing more things to do closer together downtown and in midtown.

The fourth point has been brought up before and is the idea that Omaha just wants a streetcar to say we have a streetcar. However, this is actually a valid reason. A streetcar acts as an indicator or an economic signal that Omaha is investing in itself and trying to be cutting edge and progressive. We are not going to be left behind and we are a "cool" "hip" place to be. Which, believe it or not, is very important to attracting and retaining talent to both the city and the state, especially considering the fact Nebraska is experiencing a brain drain where we are losing ~2,300 highly educated individuals every year. And considering our unhealthily low unemployment rate, that is doubly concerning. It is important to attracting companies too, as quality public transit was listed as one of the highest rated items for businesses when considering moving to a new city. A streetcar is a signaling tool to businesses large and small that Omaha is investing in its future.

Oh, and did I mention it is a form of public transit?

The streetcar isn't a silver bullet to Omaha's public transport needs, but it is an important link in the overall transit chain that Omaha is going to have to continue to invest in and create. It's not "Streetcar." end of story. Its "Streetcar and..." as we continue to upgrade our woefully inadequate transit system.

I meant to compliment you for this post. It is the best assessment of the streetcar I've seen put into words. I sure tried multiple times, but was never able to conjure up anything this detailed, and thorough. I never came close to getting the point of a streetcar across as well as this post

[OmahaOmaha]

Kind of related to the streetcar:

Roads in downtown Omaha are ridiculously wide. I understand the need for increased capacity during morning and evening worker rush hours, but four-lane, one-way roads are ridiculous with the amount of traffic downtown gets. Like Des Moines is doing, I think many of the roads downtown should be converted to two-way roads with bike lanes. I also think MUCH wider sidewalks are needed in places downtown. Here is Vox (yes I know its Vox, but this isn't a right-left political topic) video talking about the effectiveness of such a "Road Diet."

[youtube][/youtube]

If we do this "Road Diet" on our downtown streets, how does that work with all these delivery trucks parked on the streets. What about all those buses stopping and holding up traffic? How many people are riding bikes downtown? I'm guessing about one person riding bike to every 1000 driving cars. Does that really justify cutting lanes to make room for bike lanes?

[TitosBuritoBarn]

If we do this "Road Diet" on our downtown streets, how does that work with all these delivery trucks parked on the streets.

They would likely install delivery zones in strategic locations where delivery trucks can park throughout the day.

What about all those buses stopping and holding up traffic?

They would also likely install pull-outs for buses to pull off the road so as to not impede traffic.

How many people are riding bikes downtown? I'm guessing about one person riding bike to every 1000 driving cars. Does that really justify cutting lanes to make room for bike lanes?

Sure. Traffic is low for the amount of traffic the infrastructure is built for. And focusing mobility on only one mode is not conducive to efficient city development. Now would be the perfect time to convert automobile infrastructure into infrastructure for bicycles or other modes of transportation. That way, when things do build up many years down the road, we haven't gone down a path we can't turn back from.

Note that the number of bicycle commuters is low partially because bicycle infrastructure downtown is |expletive| and traverses few origin and destination points. There also aren't that many origin and destination points to begin with. By expanding bicycle infrastructure you theoretically create a catalyst for the type of development which it would be conducive to - compact, more efficient development. But it has to be extensive, safe, and inviting. What we have in Omaha is only inviting to those who are avid cyclists.

[bigredmed1]

Sure. Traffic is low for the amount of traffic the infrastructure is built for. And focusing mobility on only one mode is not conducive to efficient city development. Now would be the perfect time to convert automobile infrastructure into infrastructure for bicycles or other modes of transportation. That way, when things do build up many years down the road, we haven't gone down a path we can't turn back from.

Note that the number of bicycle commuters is low partially because bicycle infrastructure downtown is |expletive| and traverses few origin and destination points. There also aren't that many origin and destination points to begin with. By expanding bicycle infrastructure you theoretically create a catalyst for the type of development which it would be conducive to - compact, more efficient development. But it has to be extensive, safe, and inviting. What we have in Omaha is only inviting to those who are avid cyclists.

We also have to just come to grips that Chicago, Denver, the Twin Cities, Indianapolis, OKC, Dallas, Ft Worth, Portland, Phoenix, Miami, Jacksonville, Charlotte, Houston, LA, Philadelphia, NYC, and Boston are all about a flat as a carpenter's level and are thus vastly more conducive to bike riding due to the lack of a cosine wave like geography. Trying to ape them is going to fail. When your highest climb is the bridge connecting two boroughs, bike riding is not a bad way to go. Esp when it can lower your commute time and cost dramatically. When you have 1 hill out of downtown Omaha that is so steep, that even after our ancestors carved it down, it still burns the quads going up hill, and that is just the first of many, you see the barrier.

You are correct about infrastructure. Riding along the Papio is fun for a minute, but then, you realize that it doesn't go where you need to go for work, etc. Its going to be an uphill slog to get cycling going if we don't figure out ways to make for rapid east-west commuting over 2-3 mile range and have some long haul bus system to get from Millard to UNO on a bus and use your bike to buzz around campus and the area near by.

We also have to realize that our weather is challenging for bikers many days of the year.

[Busguy2010]

Yes, this is what I was alluding to. Thanks for the re-post and the effort you put into creating this. I don't know if you updated it since your initial posting, or if you intend to, but the first proposed line along Dodge and Harney is up on ORBT's website at http://www.rideorbt.com/path/.

Yes, I did know about that. They were going to have a stop at 11th and Farnam and have the route terminate there, but they switched the stop to 10th and Douglas. That is a clear indication the route will be extended into Council Bluffs, so that's why I left it the way I had it before they made that announcement.

[bones]

In all seriousness though, in regard to the streetcar, if you still view it as only a public transportation provider, you are looking at it wrong. There is no doubt that there are countless other, cheaper, public transit alternatives to get people around the downtown and midtown area (shuttles, buses, ride sharing ect.) But the point is that a streetcar serves more purposes than only public transit.

The first, and likely most important, purpose a streetcar serves is that of an economic development tool. This is attributable to the fact that streetcars have rail lines (obviously) which are pretty difficult to move once they are placed (also obviously). This encourages businesses and developers to locate along or near the line as there is a certainty that the streetcar will continue to operate along that street for a significant period of time. Compared to other modes of transportation, such as buses, where the lines of transit could be moved at any moment. This certainty allows developers and businesses to take greater risk, take out bigger loans, and build bigger developments. It's estimated that developers in Omaha would double the size of their buildings with the presence of a streetcar (from an avg of 4-5 stories to 8-10 stories). Additionally, stores and businesses along and near the line would grow their businesses tremendously. In KC, revenues from sales tax along the line rose 56% in the first year.

This brings us to the second purpose of streetcars, revenue generating. Without a doubt, streetcars require considerable upfront capital investment. But there is a return on that investment. As mentioned, streetcars promote further development and business growth. Both of which provide property tax and sales tax respectively. For example, KC has had two luxury apartment towers rise along the rail line. The second one was a $120 million investment. At a Douglas County property tax rate of 2.07%, that's just shy of $2.5 million in property tax revenue each year. From one development project. Imagine a project like that goes up on one of the city surface lots downtown. That property went from generating $0 tax for the city to $2.5 million. Which carries me to my next point.

The streetcar is cityscape altering. It allows denser development and requires less parking. To be clear, both of those are good things. Density is a major contributor to why cities are so successful, and if you do not understand why density is good for a city, I can direct you to some materials that help explain the benefits it provides. Also, less parking! Downtown Omaha has a parking problem, as in, it has too much of it. A streetcar would allow you to park your car at UNMC or Midtown and go down to a Jays game, the riverfront, or the Old Market. It makes the city more walkable and enjoyable by bringing more things to do closer together downtown and in midtown.

The fourth point has been brought up before and is the idea that Omaha just wants a streetcar to say we have a streetcar. However, this is actually a valid reason. A streetcar acts as an indicator or an economic signal that Omaha is investing in itself and trying to be cutting edge and progressive. We are not going to be left behind and we are a "cool" "hip" place to be. Which, believe it or not, is very important to attracting and retaining talent to both the city and the state, especially considering the fact Nebraska is experiencing a brain drain where we are losing ~2,300 highly educated individuals every year. And considering our unhealthily low unemployment rate, that is doubly concerning. It is important to attracting companies too, as quality public transit was listed as one of the highest rated items for businesses when considering moving to a new city. A streetcar is a signaling tool to businesses large and small that Omaha is investing in its future.

Oh, and did I mention it is a form of public transit?

The streetcar isn't a silver bullet to Omaha's public transport needs, but it is an important link in the overall transit chain that Omaha is going to have to continue to invest in and create. It's not "Streetcar." end of story. Its "Streetcar and..." as we continue to upgrade our woefully inadequate transit system.

I meant to compliment you for this post. It is the best assessment of the streetcar I've seen put into words. I sure tried multiple times, but was never able to conjure up anything this detailed, and thorough. I never came close to getting the point of a streetcar across as well as this post

I appreciate the compliment. If you could not tell, I have looked into the streetcar pretty significantly. Is it possible for it to go wrong? Yes, as is evidenced by the handful of cities where it is going wrong. However, most of those cities have pretty clear reasons why it went wrong. All it takes is good planning, execution, and buy in from everyone involved in the process.

[almighty_tuna]

In all seriousness though, in regard to the streetcar, if you still view it as only a public transportation provider, you are looking at it wrong. There is no doubt that there are countless other, cheaper, public transit alternatives to get people around the downtown and midtown area (shuttles, buses, ride sharing ect.) But the point is that a streetcar serves more purposes than only public transit.

The first, and likely most important, purpose a streetcar serves is that of an economic development tool. This is attributable to the fact that streetcars have rail lines (obviously) which are pretty difficult to move once they are placed (also obviously). This encourages businesses and developers to locate along or near the line as there is a certainty that the streetcar will continue to operate along that street for a significant period of time. Compared to other modes of transportation, such as buses, where the lines of transit could be moved at any moment. This certainty allows developers and businesses to take greater risk, take out bigger loans, and build bigger developments. It's estimated that developers in Omaha would double the size of their buildings with the presence of a streetcar (from an avg of 4-5 stories to 8-10 stories). Additionally, stores and businesses along and near the line would grow their businesses tremendously. In KC, revenues from sales tax along the line rose 56% in the first year.

This brings us to the second purpose of streetcars, revenue generating. Without a doubt, streetcars require considerable upfront capital investment. But there is a return on that investment. As mentioned, streetcars promote further development and business growth. Both of which provide property tax and sales tax respectively. For example, KC has had two luxury apartment towers rise along the rail line. The second one was a $120 million investment. At a Douglas County property tax rate of 2.07%, that's just shy of $2.5 million in property tax revenue each year. From one development project. Imagine a project like that goes up on one of the city surface lots downtown. That property went from generating $0 tax for the city to $2.5 million. Which carries me to my next point.

The streetcar is cityscape altering. It allows denser development and requires less parking. To be clear, both of those are good things. Density is a major contributor to why cities are so successful, and if you do not understand why density is good for a city, I can direct you to some materials that help explain the benefits it provides. Also, less parking! Downtown Omaha has a parking problem, as in, it has too much of it. A streetcar would allow you to park your car at UNMC or Midtown and go down to a Jays game, the riverfront, or the Old Market. It makes the city more walkable and enjoyable by bringing more things to do closer together downtown and in midtown.

The fourth point has been brought up before and is the idea that Omaha just wants a streetcar to say we have a streetcar. However, this is actually a valid reason. A streetcar acts as an indicator or an economic signal that Omaha is investing in itself and trying to be cutting edge and progressive. We are not going to be left behind and we are a "cool" "hip" place to be. Which, believe it or not, is very important to attracting and retaining talent to both the city and the state, especially considering the fact Nebraska is experiencing a brain drain where we are losing ~2,300 highly educated individuals every year. And considering our unhealthily low unemployment rate, that is doubly concerning. It is important to attracting companies too, as quality public transit was listed as one of the highest rated items for businesses when considering moving to a new city. A streetcar is a signaling tool to businesses large and small that Omaha is investing in its future.

Oh, and did I mention it is a form of public transit?

The streetcar isn't a silver bullet to Omaha's public transport needs, but it is an important link in the overall transit chain that Omaha is going to have to continue to invest in and create. It's not "Streetcar." end of story. Its "Streetcar and..." as we continue to upgrade our woefully inadequate transit system.

Can we just pin this post. Well done.

[ita]

I just happened to search 'Omaha Streetcar' in Google today and came across this article from Next City (my first time seeing this site):

https://nextcity.org/daily/entry/omaha- ... e-heats-up

The author supposedly spoke with Jay Lund. Jay informed the author that there is a funding plan being worked on that will be release in the next couple months. So, minor update on the possible streetcar project. I am interested to see how the Modern Streetcar Advocates intend to fund it since Jay seems to indicate that special taxes should not be an option.

[obvious2677]

I just happened to search 'Omaha Streetcar' in Google today and came across this article from Next City (my first time seeing this site):

https://nextcity.org/daily/entry/omaha- ... e-heats-up

The author supposedly spoke with Jay Lund. Jay informed the author that there is a funding plan being worked on that will be release in the next couple months. So, minor update on the possible streetcar project. I am interested to see how the Modern Streetcar Advocates intend to fund it since Jay seems to indicate that special taxes should not be an option.

Government grants and possibly a p3 approach? It's being done to spur development, not to really move people.

[bigredmed1]

I just happened to search 'Omaha Streetcar' in Google today and came across this article from Next City (my first time seeing this site):

https://nextcity.org/daily/entry/omaha- ... e-heats-up

The author supposedly spoke with Jay Lund. Jay informed the author that there is a funding plan being worked on that will be release in the next couple months. So, minor update on the possible streetcar project. I am interested to see how the Modern Streetcar Advocates intend to fund it since Jay seems to indicate that special taxes should not be an option.

Government grants and possibly a p3 approach? It's being done to spur development, not to really move people.

We had a survey at UNMC last week on transportation that included a street car system that ended at UNMC and started downtown that was noted as being free to ride and not taxpayer funded. Not sure how that would work, but someone has been cooking up something. Maybe that Blackstone tax will get immortalized to fund a street car that would haul people to and from the various entertainment districts and they would fund it via taxing businesses?

[Padre]

I just happened to search 'Omaha Streetcar' in Google today and came across this article from Next City (my first time seeing this site):

https://nextcity.org/daily/entry/omaha- ... e-heats-up

The author supposedly spoke with Jay Lund. Jay informed the author that there is a funding plan being worked on that will be release in the next couple months. So, minor update on the possible streetcar project. I am interested to see how the Modern Streetcar Advocates intend to fund it since Jay seems to indicate that special taxes should not be an option.

Government grants and possibly a p3 approach? It's being done to spur development, not to really move people.

We had a survey at UNMC last week on transportation that included a street car system that ended at UNMC and started downtown that was noted as being free to ride and not taxpayer funded. Not sure how that would work, but someone has been cooking up something. Maybe that Blackstone tax will get immortalized to fund a street car that would haul people to and from the various entertainment districts and they would fund it via taxing businesses?

The Kansas City street car is funded by taxes within the district it serves. You're right, this could be something similar, like with Blackstone, just expanded.

[ita]

I just happened to search 'Omaha Streetcar' in Google today and came across this article from Next City (my first time seeing this site):

https://nextcity.org/daily/entry/omaha- ... e-heats-up

The author supposedly spoke with Jay Lund. Jay informed the author that there is a funding plan being worked on that will be release in the next couple months. So, minor update on the possible streetcar project. I am interested to see how the Modern Streetcar Advocates intend to fund it since Jay seems to indicate that special taxes should not be an option.

Government grants and possibly a p3 approach? It's being done to spur development, not to really move people.

We had a survey at UNMC last week on transportation that included a street car system that ended at UNMC and started downtown that was noted as being free to ride and not taxpayer funded. Not sure how that would work, but someone has been cooking up something. Maybe that Blackstone tax will get immortalized to fund a street car that would haul people to and from the various entertainment districts and they would fund it via taxing businesses?

The Kansas City street car is funded by taxes within the district it serves. You're right, this could be something similar, like with Blackstone, just expanded.

Jay specifically mentions that a value capture model could be a funding source. That would work well in Omaha since property values are assessed regularly and, as shown in similar markets that implemented an urban streetcar, values increased after it was constructed. Local government can provide some public financing upfront based on the potential land/property value increases, and thus increase property taxes, once the streetcar is built.

One thing I noticed was HDR's summary of the project was released in March 2018. The report stated that it would take 6-9 months to prepare a funding plan, with the following engineering, planning, and construction phases following thereafter for another 2-4 years. Although we have not seen anything concrete yet, I hope that the funding plan is based on actual funding sources rather than hypothetical, similar to how financing for the Tri-Park revitalization was already secured/commited when the news broke about the project.

http://www.ometro.com/wp-content/upload ... 3.6.18.pdf