A house cleaning..Some early trouble for Wells Fargo Arena..

Post by **Omaha Cowboy** » Sat Dec 03, 2005 7:17 am

The following is a December 2nd article from Kyle Munson, entertainment writer for the Des Moines Register:

'Wells Fargo struggles in its infancy

By KYLE MUNSON
REGISTER STAFF WRITER

December 2, 2005

The Iowa Events Center's signature 17,000-seat arena is struggling in its early months to attract big events, run them smoothly and meet budget projections, leading to a change in top management.

Global Spectrum, the private firm hired by Polk County to manage the Events Center, sacked three managers Wednesday, four months after the venue opened. The company wants more income from the Wells Fargo Arena, despite recent capacity crowds for Paul McCartney, Bon Jovi and Mannheim Steamroller.

Reports filed with the county show that Global Spectrum's share from the arena was $166,000 less than projected through Oct. 31 , and attendance at arena events was about 34,000 below expectations . Global Spectrum assumed the financial risk of the arena in its contract with the county.

"Wells Fargo Arena's a bottom-line thing," Andy Long, the outgoing general manager, said Thursday. "Global Spectrum has a responsibility for the bottom line. . . . Numbers can always be better. The question was, how much more can I push myself to make sure that it's doing everything that it's supposed to be doing?"

John Page, Global Spectrum's chief operating officer, who flew to Des Moines from the company's Philadelphia headquarters to deliver the news to employees, said, "We do have high expectations."

Page said Global Spectrum's goal is to turn Des Moines into a "must-play" city for concert tours and other major events.

Currently, nearby Omaha is more of a must-play, with U2 and the Rolling Stones stopping at Qwest Center there, but not in Des Moines, in the weeks ahead. The Dave Matthews Band played Minneapolis and Omaha last weekend.

Word of the Events Center's management shake-up rippled through the concert industry.

"It's kind of shocking," said Don Sullivan, a talent buyer with Chicago-based concert promoter Jam Productions who brought Tom Petty and Green Day to the arena this year. Neither show was a sellout, a disappointment in the case of Green Day, one of today's hottest arena tickets.

In addition to sluggish attendance at some shows, technical snafus tripped up the sale of Bon Jovi tickets. There were logistical problems with shepherding crowds into the arena in a timely manner at a couple of concerts. A power surge in November knocked out a compressor at the arena, leading to melting hockey ice and a suspended game.

Holly Kjeldgaard , the Events Center's assistant general manager, became interim general manager on Wednesday.

Page said staffers from Kansas City's Kemper Arena, also managed by Global Spectrum, have been called in to smooth the transition. A new general manager could be in place as soon as next week, pending approval of the Polk County Board of Supervisors.

Long said one of the challenges he faced was his staff's culture shift from a "county work environment to a private work environment" and "the whole different mindset from the county-managed style to how aggressive we get on the marketing and sales end and the deals you cut."

County employees

County workers ran Veterans Memorial Auditorium, which became part of the Iowa Events Center along with the new Wells Fargo Arena and the Hy-Vee Hall convention facility.

"The staff down there are killing themselves," Long said.

Long, who had worked at arenas in other cities, characterized his exit as the result of a "mutual conversation" with Page, and a renewed desire for the sort of family time he hasn't had since he was hired in June 2004.

"About a month and a half ago, I realized I didn't know where my (4-year-old) son goes to preschool," said Long, a Melbourne, Ia., native who hasn't planned his next career move.

The two other managers who were fired Tuesday didn't characterize their departures as mutual decisions.

Ed Larsen, who started working at the auditorium in 1974, was the Events Center director of operations and managed 25 full-time employees. He said he had been lobbying unsuccessfully to fill two open positions.

"We were understaffed, as far as I was concerned," Larsen said. "Andy was doing the best he could. I think he knew we needed more. He tried to follow the company line as long as he could."

Joy Giudicessi , former manager of event services who worked hand-in-hand with event promoters, echoed Larsen's concerns.

"Those of us that were in the business of delivering events, Ed's and my division, were quite accustomed to working 70 to 90 hours a week," she said. "If that's being understaffed, I'll let you be the judge of that."

Page responded: "We're not understaffed at all. There are different ways you can achieve and maximize your full-time staff, with part-time, sporadic support for events, temporary staffing companies."

Culture clash?

Larsen and Giudicessi previously were county employees, along with several other Events Center managers who have resigned or been fired in recent months. Page downplayed any notion of a culture clash between veteran county employees and his firm.

"A lot of these people had an opportunity to stay with the county," Page said. "They chose to come over to the private management. . . . We need to be able to have people who are progressive and innovative."

Supervisor E.J. Giovannetti said it's still too early to evaluate Wells Fargo Arena's performance despite the managerial housecleaning. Supervisor Tom Hockensmith says he's "really happy" with events so far.

"Just from a general standpoint, there's a difference between the public sector and the private sector," Hockensmith said. "I think that Global Spectrum, with this new facility there was a big culture change with the pace. It's a real fast-paced organization."'..

..Ciao..LiO....Peace

MTO · Post by **MTO** » Sat Dec 03, 2005 7:44 am

Ewwwwwh snap!

DTO Luv · Post by **DTO Luv** » Sat Dec 03, 2005 9:53 pm

I don't think it has so much to do with the running of the arena as it does the area it's in. Des Moines only has a metro of over around 580,000. If you do a 60 mile sweep around DM there are still only 750,000. Not even Omaha's MSA. Wells Fargo arena isn't to large for DM but they don't have the drawing power they thought they did.

Plus with the Qwest Center 2 hours away, promoters are going to go where the money is. It doesn't help DM either that they are surrounded by signifigantly larger cities that have been traditional stop. Minneapolis/St.Paul, Chicago, KC, STL, Omaha, and even the arena in the Quad Cities.

I don't see their situation improving much. One thing that baffles me about this arena is that quite a few sections in the upper bowl have obstructed view seats. How do you expcet people to spend money on a seat where they will miss out on what they paid to see? Obstructed view seats are what goes on sale after all the good seats are taken. To quote a line from one of my favorite movies, Spinal Tap, I think this sums up DM?WFA situation,"...and the show in Des Moines...I don't know. I think it's in Indiana or something."

DTO Luv · Post by **DTO Luv** » Sat Dec 03, 2005 10:10 pm

If none of you have ever been to the DM site, here's an example of the extreme lunacy you will find there.

dmluvr wrote:This is a blessing in disguise people!!

I completley disagree with your dissertation mister.

While the exterior of the arena doesn't have the 'wow' factor--step inside and it's a whole different story. This arena is big enough and does have the facilities to be competable.

I called this out from the beggining gang. Don't believe me--check out the posts from the WFA thread.

They had the wrong leadership running it.
Nothing agaisnt Andy Long or Ed Larson, but the reality is---they just didn't have what it took. Ed Larson had a small time county mentality.
I said it from the get go--these people just didn't have the gusto and progressive thinking to make WFA more successful.

This article was actually written pretty well and it nailed it.
Global Spectrum is big time, there not going to d**k around.

They just need a bold marketing plan and balls to get these concerts. We've sold out 3 out of our first 5 concerts. And the two that didn't sell out--Green Day and Tom Petty, while great shows---were definitaly saturated with tours.

WFA just had way way too weak of a management staff.
And we all know that in the arena biz---weak and visionless management are going to net poor results.

Oh where to begin.

- Even if the outside won't wow them they can't be wowed by the inside if they don't have an event to go to.

- The Green Day tour should have sold out. Even in Des Moines. They've become so popular now that it's hard to imagine how they couldn't sell this show out. As far as Tom Petty goes; I like Tom Petty but he doesn't have the appeal of Green Day. When he played in Omaha he sold out the MAC. But when Tom Petty's in DM he's in the premier arena. I think that will indicate how the future of WFA will be.

- They've sold out 3 of the first 5 concerts? Name one show at the Qwest Center that hasn't been a sellout or near sellout?

I hope this goes to further show people that the differances between Omaha and Des Moines are widening. Des Moines isn't on the level of Omaha and I'm sick to death of hearing how they are. If you feel that way fine. But don't think anything you say is going to change my mind.

MTO · Post by **MTO** » Sat Dec 03, 2005 10:38 pm

DTO Luv wrote:If none of you have ever been to the DM site, here's an example of the extreme lunacy you will find there.

dmluvr wrote:This is a blessing in disguise people!!

I completley disagree with your dissertation mister.

While the exterior of the arena doesn't have the 'wow' factor--step inside and it's a whole different story. This arena is big enough and does have the facilities to be competable.

I called this out from the beggining gang. Don't believe me--check out the posts from the WFA thread.

They had the wrong leadership running it.
Nothing agaisnt Andy Long or Ed Larson, but the reality is---they just didn't have what it took. Ed Larson had a small time county mentality.
I said it from the get go--these people just didn't have the gusto and progressive thinking to make WFA more successful.

This article was actually written pretty well and it nailed it.
Global Spectrum is big time, there not going to d**k around.

They just need a bold marketing plan and balls to get these concerts. We've sold out 3 out of our first 5 concerts. And the two that didn't sell out--Green Day and Tom Petty, while great shows---were definitaly saturated with tours.

WFA just had way way too weak of a management staff.
And we all know that in the arena biz---weak and visionless management are going to net poor results.
Oh where to begin.

- Even if the outside won't wow them they can't be wowed by the inside if they don't have an event to go to.

- The Green Day tour should have sold out. Even in Des Moines. They've become so popular now that it's hard to imagine how they couldn't sell this show out. As far as Tom Petty goes; I like Tom Petty but he doesn't have the appeal of Green Day. When he played in Omaha he sold out the MAC. But when Tom Petty's in DM he's in the premier arena. I think that will indicate how the future of WFA will be.

- They've sold out 3 of the first 5 concerts? Name one show at the Qwest Center that hasn't been a sellout or near sellout?

I hope this goes to further show people that the differances between Omaha and Des Moines are widening. Des Moines isn't on the level of Omaha and I'm sick to death of hearing how they are. If you feel that way fine. But don't think anything you say is going to change my mind.

Whoa, that’s pretty pathetic!

MTO · Post by **MTO** » Sat Dec 03, 2005 10:52 pm

I wonder if WFA’s management is going to turn around and blame it on the kids who went back to college.....

eomaha · Post by **eomaha** » Sat Dec 03, 2005 11:26 pm

I am jealous of one thing that WFA can boast... they have a professional hockey team that is drawing better than average attendance (as opposed to being dead least in the league). I've come to the conclusion, as much as anything... people don't want to watch hockey in the old Civic. I wish they could get the Knights into the Qwest Center. We'll get a couple of more season in the Civic I'm sure... but after that I suspect it will be off to Kansas City (or worse yet, Wichita) for the Calgary Flames affiliate.

Back on concert attendance, keep in mind too... WFA has only been open since summer. I don't recall the Qwest Center having any huge acts in that short of timeframe after it's opening (Cher?). I don't doubt either... that the region hadn't been "Green Day'd" out. I'd have to assume there were a fair number of Des Moines are people who came to Omaha to see them.

That said, I'm sure we do have an advantage over the WFA arena in our market area. But by the same token, we may find ourselves in a similar situation when the Sprint Center opens up.

DTO Luv · Post by **DTO Luv** » Sat Dec 03, 2005 11:48 pm

I'll have to diagree with you about the Qwest going by the wayside post-Sprint Center. Omaha has established itself as a profitable concert market. By the time the Sprint Center even opens we will have another 3-4 years of proving ourselves. More concerts will come, more sporting events will come, and Omaha will have established itsel among the main stops for events not unlike the other big cities around us.

eomaha · Post by **eomaha** » Sun Dec 04, 2005 3:35 am

Iowa's drawing better than half the teams in the league (oh, and Des Moines' USHL team is still drawing a good 2,000+ a game as well).

I hear all these people around here carry on about how Omaha could/should have an NHL franchise. This was supposed to be our time to show what a great hockey city we were. Regardless of what you think about the AHL (which is as good as it gets short of the NHL)... it's never going to happen unless Omaha gets behind one hockey team... and the team to get behind is the Knights. That said, I'm a little disappointed with the Knights management (how about our city 'fathers' ... all these shakers with the Knights of Aksarben)... they've thrown up plenty of bill boards and tv spots to be sure... but how about making some partnerships with the local media/corporate sponsors/etc (geez, just look at what WOWT is doing for UNO hockey with their hourly Dave Weber spots). Can you tell I'm frustrated?

Team / Last game / Total / Games / Average
-- -- ------------------------------------------------
Chicago 5,613 58,063 7 8,295
Manchester 6,914 90,962 11 8,269
W-B/Scranton 0 73,377 9 8,153
Providence 6,601 59,400 8 7,425
Hershey 0 78,808 11 7,164
Manitoba 7,412 76,987 11 6,999
Rochester 0 83,958 12 6,997
Philadelphia 4,261 62,810 10 6,281
Grand Rapids 0 59,309 10 5,931
Syracuse 0 49,021 9 5,447
Toronto 0 51,095 10 5,110
Iowa 0 54,761 11 4,978
Hartford 0 48,486 10 4,849
Peoria 4,094 60,415 13 4,647
Houston 0 60,311 13 4,639
Hamilton 7,047 60,080 13 4,622
Portland 0 58,293 14 4,164
Milwaukee 0 32,877 8 4,110
Binghamton 0 36,638 9 4,071
San Antonio 5,376 60,421 15 4,028
Albany 2,776 49,607 13 3,816
Norfolk 4,505 55,562 15 3,704
Bridgeport 0 34,485 10 3,449
Springfield 0 41,801 13 3,215
Lowell 2,119 41,234 13 3,172
Cleveland 0 33,205 11 3,019
Omaha 2,684 42,725 15 2,848

DTO Luv · Post by **DTO Luv** » Sun Dec 04, 2005 4:18 am

10,000 at one hockey game would be good. Omaha will always have two though. UNO isn't going anywhere unless they build their own arena on campus after their lease at the Qwest is up. The Lancers will probably be the one to go out, but they are in an arena with better amenities than the Civic.

Jeff, look at Omaha's total attendance though. It's not last. So far we've still had more people come to our games than others.

eomaha · Post by **eomaha** » Sun Dec 04, 2005 5:53 am

The fact remains... Iowa is at least averaging more than most of the AHL franchises (which are on average in larger markets as well)... they are not going to lose their franchise. Omaha's is in serious jeapardy... and actually that average attendance counts season ticket holders... past games have seen as little as 500 people actually in the seats. It is an absolute embarassment. I sure hope something happens to rectify the situation.. although I don't know what that may be.

Post by **Omaha Cowboy** » Sun Dec 04, 2005 6:54 am

From Tom Shatel's column this past Wednesday:

'But I wonder, too, if the Knights and UNO, in particular, shouldn't make a request to their respective leagues - AHL and CCHA - to give them more road games before Christmas and more home games after New Year's Day. Why?

Because hockey season in Omaha usually starts after Christmas.

There's football. There's more football. And in December there's a Christmas party every night and shopping and cold weather and any other excuse for Joe Fan. Bottom line: The casual/bandwagon/walk-up fan does not think hockey until January.'..

The complete link:

http://www.omaha.com/index.php?u_pg=38&u_sid=2074121

There is truth to what Shatel is referencing about Hockey season really getting started in 'football crazy' Omaha after Christmas..I'll hold out some hope that Knights attendance will really start to pick up by then..

Regarding the potential of the Qwest Center getting hurt once KC finally opens their Sprint Center..Qwest Center Omaha has 1 really LARGE thing going for it that Wells Fargo does not (albiet WF did open only 5 months ago). And that is: Reputation..The Qwest Center, over the past 2 years, has ranked in the top 15 in concert ticket sales world-wide (8th so far this year)..Big name acts absolutely cannot overlook that money-making fact Sprint Center or not..Des Moines will be hard pressed to match the QC accomplishments over the course of the next 2 years..

But I will say this, ultimately I believe Des Moines will end up landing their share of acts..Selling them out will be the 'measure of the tape' as to whether they can build a reputation as solid as the Qwest Center..Time will tell. I wish them well..

..Ciao..LiO....Peace

CountOfMC · Post by **CountOfMC** » Mon Dec 05, 2005 12:03 am

The fact remains... Iowa is at least averaging more than most of the AHL franchises (which are on average in larger markets as well)

Simple isn't it? Too many other things to do in the larger markets, including Omaha. What other games are you going to check out in Des Moines during the winter? Drake basketball? C'mon. Is Des Moines' situation not similar to Green Bay's? We're going to write off our AHL team after a year with 2 already well established teams? Think about fiscal policy/time lag. It'll be adaptive for us.. you can't expect everyone to jump shark and make the switch. Chicago with all it's 9 million people can only pack 8,000? Statistically speaking, that's even less impressive. Is anyone unique to this situation? I'm just not buying the argument that the Knights are headed to KC.. moreover, if KC picks up a 3rd pro team it'll be a slap in the face.

Let's not put the cart before the horse quite yet.....

Ingersoll1978 · Post by **Ingersoll1978** » Mon Dec 05, 2005 1:27 am

Remember all the bitching about the Qwest after it opened? You guys have got to be kidding me. Remember crying over your first Mary Kay convention and Cher? Des Moines has invested in this thing and will do everything possible to ensure we have a successful venue. If that means new management...So what? It's great you guys take pleasure in our "failure" of an arena. I'll use MC's line here... Let's not put the cart before horse yet.

It's also too bad some of your attitudes toward neighboring cities (including KC) are so judgemental, but when the shoe is on the other foot, you have excuses for everything (bad attendance at AHL-it's in the civic, AAA baseball-Rosenblatt is too big, not having some shopping-we were overlooked...etc.). This forum is really getting very unwelcoming to outsiders to the point where it's getting to be a turnoff to visit here.

Also, does the AHL Knights have billboards up or radio spots promoting this thing? None of my family over there had even heard of it. Des Moines does have another hockey team (the Bucs) other than the Stars and has Drake (same league as Creighton) in the heart of the city. We also have Division I basketball about 30 minutes away at ISU (and Iowa up the road too). We also have a great broadway series this year (including Lion King for 6 weeks and Hairspray) and a great lecture series that includes Whoopi and Fergie. Heck, Robb Thomas and Anna Nalick are playing down at the Civic Center right now as I type this. We have lots to do...don't worry about us.

OmahaRules · Post by **OmahaRules** » Mon Dec 05, 2005 2:02 am

I've been to 7 of the Knights home hockey games and usually they don't attract much more than 1,500 MAX a night. If you think that's going to keep this team in Omaha for more than a few years you are joking. Omaha is the 138th best sports city in the US for a reason, its pathetic some people on this forum say that they think we should have a pro team yet we can't support the teams we have? Give me a break when you see the Knights management giving away free tickets at every game just to get people in their seats. 3 teams is not our problem in Omaha I think its the fact that some people just get so closed minded and hate everything new that comes along and challenges what they enjoy instead of embracing it for something new and exciting. And if you dont believe me check out mavpuck.com and see the Knights bashing that goes on there daily. I guess Omaha deserves to be ranked the 138th in the nation for their sports and I can guarantee you we wont be seeing any pro teams any time soon.

MTO · Post by **MTO** » Mon Dec 05, 2005 2:48 am

Well now if your talking about pro teams yes it looks like Omaha may not fill up the seats BUT that also has to do with the view market. Which is a kind of soar spot, for some reason Omaha is grouped by itself wile Lincoln is left out. Witch is a huge mistake, if Omaha and Lincoln and more counties where re allocated to our market it would help the chances of a pro team out. Unfortunately this is the main reason (it seams) Omaha Is out of the radar.
I would have to agree with those making the point of all the other sporting events that have to draw attendance from each other.
I guess with every down there’s and up, since we suck at a sports town we sure don’t have a problem selling out concerts.

CountOfMC · Post by **CountOfMC** » Mon Dec 05, 2005 2:57 am

Ingersoll1978 wrote:This forum is really getting very unwelcoming to outsiders to the point where it's getting to be a turnoff to visit here.

Hmmm. I'm not sure where you're getting this?? It's no different than the DSM site. I sense tension in people's posts towards Omaha as well. It's a two-sided affair, and most compliments Omaha gets on KC's board are back-handed. There is a select group who I feel are genuine in their sayings towards us, but they're completely different sites. Omaha's often hit with a double-edged sword being the middleman b/t both cities; if we're not fighting with KC, it's DM. Most people here like DM, but I think you already know this. And you're not letting DTO's post about DSM upset you are you? It's his opinion and shouldn't be a surprise to you.

We also have a great broadway series this year (including Lion King for 6 weeks and Hairspray) and a great lecture series that includes Whoopi and Fergie. Heck, Robb Thomas and Anna Nalick are playing down at the Civic Center right now as I type this. We have lots to do...don't worry about us.

I wasn't proclaiming there's nothing to do in Des Moines, I was referring to sporting events during the winter. In college, I was always able to find things to do... it's what you make of it.

Ingersoll1978 · Post by **Ingersoll1978** » Mon Dec 05, 2005 3:24 am

DTO doesn't bother me at all. That's ok.

Count---sorry...comparing us to the livelyhood of Green Bay is all that much better!

CountOfMC · Post by **CountOfMC** » Mon Dec 05, 2005 5:36 am

Well no doubt I'd rather be in DM than GB. What I was getting at was Green Bay has one winter sports event that I know of, and obviously they support the heck out of the Pack. DM's situation is similar, and you look to be supporting your tema pretty well. Comparably, we've got 3 hockey teams on top of CU which is supported wildly. I think we need to let our AHL tema evolve a little...

jsheets · Post by **jsheets** » Mon Dec 05, 2005 3:12 pm

jhuston wrote: Just as someone pointed out that there are 3 NBA and 1 NHL franchise playing concurrently at the Staples Center...

3 NBA teams, really? Did the Kings or Warriors move to LA and I missed it?

Post by **Admin** » Mon Dec 05, 2005 5:12 pm

Lakers, Clippers, and Sparks (WNBA... guess they play in the summer though, huh) all play at Staples... along with the Kings (hockey that is). That's (even without the Sparks) a far more busy plate than what the Qwest Center has to juggle.

Bob from Omaha · Post by **Bob from Omaha** » Mon Dec 05, 2005 6:28 pm

Look, it's a market thing. The sports market in Omaha is skewed toward college teams. Creighton, UNO, UNL. I'm going to be lonely here but I just don't see the harm in Omaha losing the Royals or Knights. Sure there are some here who would think its bad without a minor league team, but don't count me as one of them. The city either supports the teams or it doesn't. Take away the Knights and you have UNO and the Lancers. Would I rather have the Knights than the Lancers? Perhaps, but I'd rather have UNO hockey than either of the other two.

I'd really rather have the Qwest host a few NBA and NHL games a year, in addition to UNO hockey and Creighton Basketball. In my opinion, THAT is the future of sports in Omaha. You want more? Better cough up the cash for a ticket.

The city of Omaha has pretty well shown its stripes, sports-wise.

Just my opinion...

Post by **Admin** » Mon Dec 05, 2005 6:55 pm

Alone? Hardly. I'd say most of the hockey following fans of Omaha are with you and the Mavericks (if not, the Lancers).

I just don't understand why you'd all rather follow collegiate hockey... than professional hockey?

As far as NBA/NHL... about the best you could hope for would be one exhibition game per season at most... I'm not sure where we're going to get 'a few'. I'm fairly certain KC isn't going to share a franchise with us again.

Bob from Omaha · Post by **Bob from Omaha** » Mon Dec 05, 2005 7:06 pm

admin wrote:Alone? Hardly. I'd say most of the hockey following fans of Omaha are with you and the Mavericks (if not, the Lancers).

I just don't understand why you'd all rather follow collegiate hockey... than professional hockey?

As far as NBA/NHL... about the best you could hope for would be one exhibition game per season at most... I'm not sure where we're going to get 'a few'. I'm fairly certain KC isn't going to share a franchise with us again.

Well, "admin", I actually do follow pro hockey. Saw the Red Wings a while ago. They call it Hockeytown for a reason. Of course, they have a few million people there as well. I've just come to the realization that Omaha aint gonna have an NHL team for quite a while, and the old Omaha Knights are dead.

As for KC sharing a team with Omaha...the reason, the ONLY reason they did before was that Kemper wasn't done yet. It wasn't for any altruistic reason. They had a chance to move the Cincinnati Royals and if they didn't do it the Royals would have gone somewhere else.

Anyway, you do what you can do.

DTO Luv · Post by **DTO Luv** » Mon Dec 05, 2005 11:52 pm

Ingersoll1978 wrote:DTO doesn't bother me at all. I know he's a kid and doesn't know any better. That's ok.

This is complete BS. As controversial as I might be sometimes, I have never made a personal attack on someone. Ever. I say something about how I don't like a city, and the post is edited, deleted, or the thread locked. But somehow I'm fair game for personal critisisms? I've never said,"Oh so and so is a whatever." I might criticize the idea but not the person. I do not appreciate being called "a kid". I take deep offense to that. In my personal life I've supported my own family working mulitple jobs as a teen and even had to quit school to do so. That's some "kid".

So if this site does have a zero-tolerance policy against me, than I want the same enforced on others. Why not ban Ingersoll?

eomaha · Post by **eomaha** » Tue Dec 06, 2005 2:23 am

Most people I know who live in NFL/NBA/NHL/MLB markets... would rather go to these professional sporting event offerings over their local university athletics.

I have always enjoyed our collegiate sports ... but when I see the opportunity presented before me to go watch their professional counterparts, I'm going to jump on it. I guess most folks in this town are content just to 'the hockey game', perhaps watching the 'big rivalry' with Lincoln or Kearney ... rather than pursuing the highest quality sports entertainment offering.

I went without the Knights until now, I guess I can go without them ultimately again. I'm not sure if Creighton Bluejay baseball is going to do it for me though (should the Royals pull up stakes in the absence of community support).

If I hear anyone carry on about how Omaha can support an NHL or NBA franchise again though... I'm just going to remove the thread.

Post by **Omaha Cowboy** » Tue Dec 06, 2005 6:19 am

I've stated this numerous times before..AAA baseball, AHL, etc etc..We tend to appreciate these things more ONCE they are taken away from us..Although I do think we've being a bit premature with the Knights moving away talk (I still believe attendance will spike up after Christmas)..

It would be a BLACK EYE in Omaha sports history to lose AAA baseball especially..Omaha has a 50+ year tradition of AAA level baseball and it is a great form of summertime recreational entertainment (minus the fireworks)..This would not be a healthy reflection of Omaha if this were to happen..Other cities without AAA ball would covet a AAA team (see Tulsa as an example)..

..Ciao..LiO....Peace

OmahaJaysCU · Post by **OmahaJaysCU** » Tue Dec 06, 2005 9:26 pm

I agree about losing the Royals. People always take the arguement that if the Royals build a new stadium than who will play at Rosenblatt becasue "no one cares about the royals." Well, who is going to play in Rosenblatt when the Royals leave Omaha becaue no one will let them build a new park.

Bob from Omaha · Post by **Bob from Omaha** » Tue Dec 06, 2005 10:14 pm

Omaha Cowboy wrote:It would be a BLACK EYE in Omaha sports history to lose AAA baseball especially..Omaha has a 50+ year tradition of AAA level baseball and it is a great form of summertime recreational entertainment (minus the fireworks)..This would not be a healthy reflection of Omaha if this were to happen..Other cities without AAA ball would covet a AAA team (see Tulsa as an example)..

..Ciao..LiO....Peace

It may be a black eye, but life would go on...by the way, Omaha does have a tradition of minor league baseball, but it isn't a continuous line. We were with the Cardinal organization for a while. These things come and go. I'm not suggesting that anyone is leaving. My whole point is that these things are market driven. The city can't just "get one" and put it in a case. Without support...good bye. It is what it is, and right now Omaha doesn't have a basketball team. Anyone noticed?

Omaha is a great city...whichever ammenities we havve are the ones we support...or are the ones that those with the cash want Omaha to have, i.e. the Holland Center, the zoo, the Qwest Center, etc.

Post by **Omaha Cowboy** » Wed Dec 07, 2005 5:25 am

Bob from Omaha wrote: Omaha is a great city...whichever ammenities we havve are the ones we support...or are the ones that those with the cash want Omaha to have, i.e. the Holland Center, the zoo, the Qwest Center, etc.

Yet Omaha would be less great without AAA basball of which for most of the last 50+ years, Omaha has been a part of (the last 37 years straight with the Royals organization)..

Yes life would go on for Omaha..Just not as rich if this entertainment option were to go 'poof' IMO..

..Ciao..LiO....Peace

Finn · Post by **Finn** » Wed Dec 07, 2005 4:23 pm

Not as rich for a mere few thousand people.

Post by **Omaha Cowboy** » Wed Dec 07, 2005 4:54 pm

Finn wrote:Not as rich for a mere few thousand people.

Oh please

..If Omaha were to lose AAA baseball, it would be one less summertime entertainment option for the family and fans of baseball in general..And for a metro of over 800,000 people, that would be a complete shame..Further, the Royals do draw in excess of 300,000 fans per season (they should draw around 400-450,000) and keeps Rosenblatt occupied for 5 months out of the year..Yep, just 'a mere few thousand people'..No problem if the Royals were to just disappear from the Omaha sports-scene..Poof!..

Some may not care one way or the other..But to play off the potential loss of a AAA baseball franchise in our community as a loss for 'a mere few thousand people' is quite short-sighted and missing the big picture point if you ask me..

But to each his own..

..Ciao..LiO....Peace

Finn · Post by **Finn** » Wed Dec 07, 2005 6:58 pm

That is not 300,000 out of the metro's 800,000. It represents a high percentage of repeat customers (look at attendance per game). If it were not for the CWS, the Royals would probably have left a while ago. It is just not a well-supported sporting event.

Ingersoll1978 · Post by **Ingersoll1978** » Wed Dec 07, 2005 7:31 pm

What can the Royals (and the Knights) do to get better support?

OmahaRules · Post by **OmahaRules** » Wed Dec 07, 2005 8:39 pm

Move......I mean Omaha has predominately been ranked a really low sports city for years. Not just because we dont have a Pro team but also because we don't support the teams we get. Kind of pathetic if you ask me but maybe its a testament to the many choices we have in this city that we don't have to go to sports games because we have many other things to do.
I doubt a high percentage of the 300k are repeat because there are many different company nights and promotions that bring people in. I guess if that were true that they were all repeat we'd have one heck of a loyal fan base and I just dont see that.
Just a question how does the Omaha Beef indoor team do for attendence?

OmahaJaysCU · Post by **OmahaJaysCU** » Wed Dec 07, 2005 9:35 pm

Those rankings aren't really based so much as to how well we support our teams, but weird things like little league baseball fields, parks, and a ton of other nit picky stuff.

Back to the point

Kind of pathetic if you ask me but maybe its a testament to the many choices we have in this city that we don't have to go to sports games because we have many other things to do.

Why do cities like New York or Chicago which has tons more things to do than in Omaha still support their teams?

As for the beef, I think they do pretty well. They have lots of cool features they add to the Civic such as the 'party box' in one of the endzones and the 'butchers block.' this really helps to make the atmosphere more fun and helps bring in more fans. Maybe the Knights should take note of this.