Jobbers Canyon Research

[Garrett]

Hey everyone! I'm currently in my first semester of my urban planning grad program in NYC, and I'm doing a project/paper on the history, destruction, and multiple redevelopments of Jobbers Canyon. I have the book Lost Omaha, a few historic documents and a bunch of pictures from the library, and various articles in the last 5 years from the World Herald, but I would appreciate any other sources any of you could offer.

Also, if some of you who were around back in the day to experience Jobbers Canyon and see the process and discourse around it's destruction, I would love to be able to ask some questions and pick your brains a little bit.

Thank you!
Garrett

[bigredmed1]

The biggest information sources for me were my father who worked Jobbers Canyon and in ConAgra and a real estate agent who specialized in the old market area.

Dad described these buildings as large brick boxes that were basically built to hold stuff and not much else. He described the meetings with Omaha leadership as we will build on the river or we will build in St Louis, even though they owned Lonergan lake and were also considering building there, outside of city limits.

The agent described these buildings similarly. They had wiring for freight elevators and doors and enough plumbing to support the washrooms for the office staff and workers (basically the equivalent to a modern 3 bed home in terms of water and sewer). I had thought about buying one of the surviving buildings back in 1992, but was discouraged in this endeavor based on two factors:

1. They all needed massive improvements in water and sewer. (To say nothing about fire/safety.)

2. Their support beams and flooring were soaked in creosote and once a fire blew out a window on a lower level, the buildings burned like candles. A couple of them burned later and she was definitely correct.

[GetUrban]

Hey everyone! I'm currently in my first semester of my urban planning grad program in NYC, and I'm doing a project/paper on the history, destruction, and multiple redevelopments of Jobbers Canyon. I have the book Lost Omaha, a few historic documents and a bunch of pictures from the library, and various articles in the last 5 years from the World Herald, but I would appreciate any other sources any of you could offer.

Also, if some of you who were around back in the day to experience Jobbers Canyon and see the process and discourse around it's destruction, I would love to be able to ask some questions and pick your brains a little bit.

Thank you!
Garrett

As an architect, this is one of my favorite areas of interest in the history of Omaha’s architecture.

One of the best sources I’ve found is the Landmarks Heritage Preservation Commision, Meyers Jobber’s Canyon Collection of hundreds of photos. which you might have already discovered.

https://landmark.cityofomaha.org/meyer ... ers-canyon

In fact, my avatar was made from one of the photos from the collection.

There are also Microfilm Image files of the original building drawings you can download. I pretty much downloaded them all so I could start building a 3D model of each canyon building to recreate a virtual canyon. I have a placeholder for each block and building roughed-out in SketchUp, but still have to go back and model each building in greater detail based on the original drawings. https://landmark.cityofomaha.org/colle ... m-drawings

Yes, you could say I’m somewhat of a Jobber’s Canyon fanatic and defender.

Parts of Items 1 and 2 from Bigredmed’s comments are actually false. The building’s fire protection features were state-of the art for buildings of the era. Many were built with heavy timber construction which is still allowed in today’s IBC codes. They were not coated in creosote, but were such large timber columns and beams, that in a fire the outer top layer of wood would char enough to basically act as a fire proof layer protecting the integrity of the structure long enough for people to exit the buildings safely before the fire advanced enough to cause collapse or to allow time for the fire to hopefully be extinguished. Many of the later Jobbers buildings were built out of concrete structure, and all were protected by thick brick or concrete exterior walls. PM me if you want some other people sources of info.

[bones]

Hey everyone! I'm currently in my first semester of my urban planning grad program in NYC, and I'm doing a project/paper on the history, destruction, and multiple redevelopments of Jobbers Canyon. I have the book Lost Omaha, a few historic documents and a bunch of pictures from the library, and various articles in the last 5 years from the World Herald, but I would appreciate any other sources any of you could offer.

Also, if some of you who were around back in the day to experience Jobbers Canyon and see the process and discourse around it's destruction, I would love to be able to ask some questions and pick your brains a little bit.

Thank you!
Garrett

I actually did an undergraduate research paper on urban development and did some extensive research on Jobbers Canyon as a part of that. I will have to dig through my files to find some of the documents, images, and articles that I had some other time but I did find this one in my brief search tonight.
https://history.nebraska.gov/sites/hist ... Canyon.pdf
Was not around back then, but find it to be an incredibly interesting part of Omaha's history that most young people (or people new to Omaha) are completely unaware of, which is unfortunate.

[GetUrban]

Hey everyone! I'm currently in my first semester of my urban planning grad program in NYC, and I'm doing a project/paper on the history, destruction, and multiple redevelopments of Jobbers Canyon. I have the book Lost Omaha, a few historic documents and a bunch of pictures from the library, and various articles in the last 5 years from the World Herald, but I would appreciate any other sources any of you could offer.

Also, if some of you who were around back in the day to experience Jobbers Canyon and see the process and discourse around it's destruction, I would love to be able to ask some questions and pick your brains a little bit.

Thank you!
Garrett

I actually did an undergraduate research paper on urban development and did some extensive research on Jobbers Canyon as a part of that. I will have to dig through my files to find some of the documents, images, and articles that I had some other time but I did find this one in my brief search tonight.
https://history.nebraska.gov/sites/hist ... Canyon.pdf
Was not around back then, but find it to be an incredibly interesting part of Omaha's history that most young people (or people new to Omaha) are completely unaware of, which is unfortunate.

Great article. I think I’ve downloaded it before a while back, but thanks for posting. It does make me sad to read it again, especially since ConAgra moved their headquarters anyway only approx. 30 years after the destruction of JC. But in a way, I think the GLM acted as an unintended precursor to show what was possible if large expanses of building stock were cleared to make way for more green space and less-dense development. The earlier Marina City concept plans sparked interest too in remaking the riverfront.

[bigredmed1]

Hey everyone! I'm currently in my first semester of my urban planning grad program in NYC, and I'm doing a project/paper on the history, destruction, and multiple redevelopments of Jobbers Canyon. I have the book Lost Omaha, a few historic documents and a bunch of pictures from the library, and various articles in the last 5 years from the World Herald, but I would appreciate any other sources any of you could offer.

Also, if some of you who were around back in the day to experience Jobbers Canyon and see the process and discourse around it's destruction, I would love to be able to ask some questions and pick your brains a little bit.

Thank you!
Garrett

As an architect, this is one of my favorite areas of interest in the history of Omaha’s architecture.

One of the best sources I’ve found is the Landmarks Heritage Preservation Commision, Meyers Jobber’s Canyon Collection of hundreds of photos. which you might have already discovered.

https://landmark.cityofomaha.org/meyer ... ers-canyon

In fact, my avatar was made from one of the photos from the collection.

There are also Microfilm Image files of the original building drawings you can download. I pretty much downloaded them all so I could start building a 3D model of each canyon building to recreate a virtual canyon. I have a placeholder for each block and building roughed-out in SketchUp, but still have to go back and model each building in greater detail based on the original drawings. https://landmark.cityofomaha.org/colle ... m-drawings

Yes, you could say I’m somewhat of a Jobber’s Canyon fanatic and defender.

Parts of Items 1 and 2 from Bigredmed’s comments are actually false. The building’s fire protection features were state-of the art for buildings of the era. Many were built with heavy timber construction which is still allowed in today’s IBC codes. They were not coated in creosote, but were such large timber columns and beams, that in a fire the outer top layer of wood would char enough to basically act as a fire proof layer protecting the integrity of the structure long enough for people to exit the buildings safely before the fire advanced enough to cause collapse or to allow time for the fire to hopefully be extinguished. Many of the later Jobbers buildings were built out of concrete structure, and all were protected by thick brick or concrete exterior walls. PM me if you want some other people sources of info.

Could you explain the intense fires in the Butternut Coffee building and the others?

[GetUrban]

Hey everyone! I'm currently in my first semester of my urban planning grad program in NYC, and I'm doing a project/paper on the history, destruction, and multiple redevelopments of Jobbers Canyon. I have the book Lost Omaha, a few historic documents and a bunch of pictures from the library, and various articles in the last 5 years from the World Herald, but I would appreciate any other sources any of you could offer.

Also, if some of you who were around back in the day to experience Jobbers Canyon and see the process and discourse around it's destruction, I would love to be able to ask some questions and pick your brains a little bit.

Thank you!
Garrett

As an architect, this is one of my favorite areas of interest in the history of Omaha’s architecture.

One of the best sources I’ve found is the Landmarks Heritage Preservation Commision, Meyers Jobber’s Canyon Collection of hundreds of photos. which you might have already discovered.

https://landmark.cityofomaha.org/meyer ... ers-canyon

In fact, my avatar was made from one of the photos from the collection.

There are also Microfilm Image files of the original building drawings you can download. I pretty much downloaded them all so I could start building a 3D model of each canyon building to recreate a virtual canyon. I have a placeholder for each block and building roughed-out in SketchUp, but still have to go back and model each building in greater detail based on the original drawings. https://landmark.cityofomaha.org/colle ... m-drawings

Yes, you could say I’m somewhat of a Jobber’s Canyon fanatic and defender.

Parts of Items 1 and 2 from Bigredmed’s comments are actually false. The building’s fire protection features were state-of the art for buildings of the era. Many were built with heavy timber construction which is still allowed in today’s IBC codes. They were not coated in creosote, but were such large timber columns and beams, that in a fire the outer top layer of wood would char enough to basically act as a fire proof layer protecting the integrity of the structure long enough for people to exit the buildings safely before the fire advanced enough to cause collapse or to allow time for the fire to hopefully be extinguished. Many of the later Jobbers buildings were built out of concrete structure, and all were protected by thick brick or concrete exterior walls. PM me if you want some other people sources of info.

Could you explain the intense fires in the Butternut Coffee building and the others?

The Butternut building was indeed a very intense fire and a huge loss for the developer and/or their insurer, and Omaha. The fire started from demolition activities on the upper floors during the final weeks of the project and was not discovered until several hours after the fire initially started. I just found this account of the fire written from the firefighters point of view.

https://www.firehouse.com/home/news/10 ... a-landmark

I don’t deny that the old wood structures can be very vulnerable to fires, especially if the fires get a head start before they are discovered or extinguished early on, which was the case for Butternut. It burned for several hours before the fire was discovered. The Bemis building, Egg building, and M’s Pub fire are good examples of what can happen, although M’s had the misfortune of a severed gas line feeding the fire. But I still stand by my earlier post that they were designed to be as fire-resistant as possible for their era, and to the best of my knowledge, weren’t built out of creosote soaked wood columns and beams. Creosote was mainly used to protect wood from rot and termite infestation, especially for wood in contact with the ground or buried. Had the Butternut renovation been completed and if the newly installed automatic fire suppression system had been operational, the building would still be standing and occupied.

[Big E]

Could you explain the intense fires in the Butternut Coffee building and the others?

There's also the still very persistent rumor of "Omaha lightning" at play in that one...

Anecdotally, I was living in Old Market Lofts the night it tried its darnedest to burn down (late 2005?). The roof deck caught on fire and the alarms didn't go off until several hours after the all clear had been given in the middle of the night.

[GetUrban]

Here’s some more info about Heavy Timber construction:

https://www.awc.org/pdf/codes-standard ... y-0402.pdf

And to be fair to Bigredmed, here is an article from Firehouse that supports some of his points too:

https://www.firehouse.com/home/news/10 ... ed-to-know

[Omahacritic]

To be fair to Bigred ... as you say, fire suppression/safety was “state of the art” for their time. And purpose! They weren’t built for heavy manufacturing. Or electronics. Or other intensive hazards. They were warehouses. Older buildings would have had sections for Ice storage.

Large parts were used for cold storage. Back in the day, they was one section used for summer storage of furs.
Streets were narrow. Loading docks outdated.

Garret should look into railroad archives. Harriman Building was a freight office.
Without railroads, the concentration of warehouses would not exist.

[Omaha Cowboy]

Hey everyone! I'm currently in my first semester of my urban planning grad program in NYC, and I'm doing a project/paper on the history, destruction, and multiple redevelopments of Jobbers Canyon. I have the book Lost Omaha, a few historic documents and a bunch of pictures from the library, and various articles in the last 5 years from the World Herald, but I would appreciate any other sources any of you could offer.

Also, if some of you who were around back in the day to experience Jobbers Canyon and see the process and discourse around it's destruction, I would love to be able to ask some questions and pick your brains a little bit.

Thank you!
Garrett

I actually did an undergraduate research paper on urban development and did some extensive research on Jobbers Canyon as a part of that. I will have to dig through my files to find some of the documents, images, and articles that I had some other time but I did find this one in my brief search tonight.
https://history.nebraska.gov/sites/hist ... Canyon.pdf
Was not around back then, but find it to be an incredibly interesting part of Omaha's history that most young people (or people new to Omaha) are completely unaware of, which is unfortunate.

Thank you for providing that essay link. I had read it before years back, but had forgotten about it..

After a re-read, it sure takes me back to those times when preservationist groups were fighting Omaha big business and city hall to preserve Jobbers Canyon.. Regrettably, I watched with my very eyes, those buildings get taken down in 1989 in the name of “progress”..

Their demolition remains a black eye in Omaha development history...

Ciao..LiO...Peace

[S.O.Boy]

Here is my recollection.
Where I was working sent me to I believe Carpenter Paper on a warm April day. There was ice on the cobblestone streets, which was good because there were depressions that came close to bottoming out my car. Those streets rival some of the worst in town now.

The office had 14' ceilings with cords hanging down everywhere. There were many 3' across round pillars in a row.

[Cermak]

Even with Jobbers Canyon gone Omaha still has a sizable amount of old Warehouses downtown. And I think most of the remaining ones are safe from demolition. It was a mistake to tear the canyon down but what’s done is done. It was very unique to Omaha, and was torn down during a time when old building preservation wasn’t always thought of as highly as it is now. The 80’s was all about shiny and new glass buildings.

[GetUrban]

The remaining warehouses that have been remodeled and upgraded over the last 30 years proves that it could have successfully been done to the JC building stock too. There have been a few bumps along the way, some with devastating results from fires, but once the buildings undergo adding the necessary life safety features such as automatic fire suppression and alarms, and addition of modern HVAC, Electrical, Plumbing, and Comm systems, they become well worth the effort to rehab and repurpose. The construction period is the most risky and dangerous time even for completely new construction projects, especially when constructed with wood. A while back, there seems to have been a rash of new large apartment buildings burning to the ground while all of the wood framing was still exposed during construction. Now it’s fairly common to have A 24/7 fire watch during construction.

[Omahacritic]

The remaining warehouses that have been remodeled and upgraded over the last 30 years proves that it could have successfully been done to the JC building stock too. There have been a few bumps along the way, some with devastating results from fires, but once the buildings undergo adding the necessary life safety features such as automatic fire suppression and alarms, and addition of modern HVAC, Electrical, Plumbing, and Comm systems, they become well worth the effort to rehab and repurpose. The construction period is the most risky and dangerous time even for completely new construction projects, especially when constructed with wood. A while back, there seems to have been a rash of new large apartment buildings burning to the ground while all of the wood framing was still exposed during construction. Now it’s fairly common to have A 24/7 fire watch during construction.

It proves nothing. The existing conversions were remodeled but there was still only so much capacity over the past 30 years.

It can be equally argued that without the demolition, the current existing conversions would not have occurred. The demolition released an urgency, and, helped to create a market. It is doubtful the demand has existed to have absorbed the vacancy.

[GetUrban]

The remaining warehouses that have been remodeled and upgraded over the last 30 years proves that it could have successfully been done to the JC building stock too. There have been a few bumps along the way, some with devastating results from fires, but once the buildings undergo adding the necessary life safety features such as automatic fire suppression and alarms, and addition of modern HVAC, Electrical, Plumbing, and Comm systems, they become well worth the effort to rehab and repurpose. The construction period is the most risky and dangerous time even for completely new construction projects, especially when constructed with wood. A while back, there seems to have been a rash of new large apartment buildings burning to the ground while all of the wood framing was still exposed during construction. Now it’s fairly common to have A 24/7 fire watch during construction.

It proves nothing. The existing conversions were remodeled but there was still only so much capacity over the past 30 years.

It can be equally argued that without the demolition, the current existing conversions would not have occurred. The demolition released an urgency, and, helped to create a market. It is doubtful the demand has existed to have absorbed the vacancy.

Well, Ok whatever. I guess we’ll never be able to find out, will we? A few renovations were already underway when the city leaders bowed-down to Charles M. “Mike” Harper and pulled the plug and forced the sale of the land the buildings were sitting on to ConAgra for their lush green lawns. Based on your assumptions of demand, you can’t prove they wouldn’t have all been rehabbed by now either

Edit: To clarify, I meant that time has taught us it has been proven to be feasible to Rehab the same type of warehouse buildings as JC had. The earlier success of the Old Market taught us that.

[Omahacritic]

The remaining warehouses that have been remodeled and upgraded over the last 30 years proves that it could have successfully been done to the JC building stock too. There have been a few bumps along the way, some with devastating results from fires, but once the buildings undergo adding the necessary life safety features such as automatic fire suppression and alarms, and addition of modern HVAC, Electrical, Plumbing, and Comm systems, they become well worth the effort to rehab and repurpose. The construction period is the most risky and dangerous time even for completely new construction projects, especially when constructed with wood. A while back, there seems to have been a rash of new large apartment buildings burning to the ground while all of the wood framing was still exposed during construction. Now it’s fairly common to have A 24/7 fire watch during construction.

It proves nothing. The existing conversions were remodeled but there was still only so much capacity over the past 30 years.

It can be equally argued that without the demolition, the current existing conversions would not have occurred. The demolition released an urgency, and, helped to create a market. It is doubtful the demand has existed to have absorbed the vacancy.

Well, Ok whatever. I guess we’ll never be able to find out, will we? A few renovations were already underway when the city leaders bowed-down to Charles M. “Mike” Harper and pulled the plug and forced the sale of the land the buildings were sitting on to ConAgra for their lush green lawns. Based on your assumptions of demand, you can’t prove they wouldn’t have all been rehabbed by now either

Edit: To clarify, I meant that time has taught us it has been proven to be feasible to Rehab the same type of warehouse buildings as JC had. The earlier success of the Old Market taught us that.

Actually, my argument probably could be proven. Or disproven. It would interesting to find research documents from property developers of the time.

Supply, Demand, Willing buyers at a price developers are willing to accept, and Developers spending an amount of money that can be recovered at an amount demand is willing to pay.

[Omahacritic]

The remaining warehouses that have been remodeled and upgraded over the last 30 years proves that it could have successfully been done to the JC building stock too. There have been a few bumps along the way, some with devastating results from fires, but once the buildings undergo adding the necessary life safety features such as automatic fire suppression and alarms, and addition of modern HVAC, Electrical, Plumbing, and Comm systems, they become well worth the effort to rehab and repurpose. The construction period is the most risky and dangerous time even for completely new construction projects, especially when constructed with wood. A while back, there seems to have been a rash of new large apartment buildings burning to the ground while all of the wood framing was still exposed during construction. Now it’s fairly common to have A 24/7 fire watch during construction.

It proves nothing. The existing conversions were remodeled but there was still only so much capacity over the past 30 years.

It can be equally argued that without the demolition, the current existing conversions would not have occurred. The demolition released an urgency, and, helped to create a market. It is doubtful the demand has existed to have absorbed the vacancy.

Well, Ok whatever. I guess we’ll never be able to find out, will we? A few renovations were already underway when the city leaders bowed-down to Charles M. “Mike” Harper and pulled the plug and forced the sale of the land the buildings were sitting on to ConAgra for their lush green lawns. Based on your assumptions of demand, you can’t prove they wouldn’t have all been rehabbed by now either

Edit: To clarify, I meant that time has taught us it has been proven to be feasible to Rehab the same type of warehouse buildings as JC had. The earlier success of the Old Market taught us that.

Actually, my argument probably could be proven. Or disproven. It would interesting to find research documents from property developers of the time.

Supply, Demand, Willing buyers at a price developers are willing to accept, and Developers spending an amount of money that can be recovered at an amount demand is willing to pay.

Would demand for Paxton have been usurped by Jobbers? Skinner building? Barker? Brandeis? Any proof?

Here’s hoping your research is objective realism and not romantic nostalgia. And perhaps you can share what you find.

[Omaha Cowboy]

The remaining warehouses that have been remodeled and upgraded over the last 30 years proves that it could have successfully been done to the JC building stock too.
Well, Ok whatever. I guess we’ll never be able to find out, will we? A few renovations were already underway when the city leaders bowed-down to Charles M. “Mike” Harper and pulled the plug and forced the sale of the land the buildings were sitting on to ConAgra for their lush green lawns. Based on your assumptions of demand, you can’t prove they wouldn’t have all been rehabbed by now either

Edit: To clarify, I meant that time has taught us it has been proven to be feasible to Rehab the same type of warehouse buildings as JC had. The earlier success of the Old Market taught us that.

Having seen the demolition first hand, I can attest to the business climate which created the city to cow tow to anything Mike Harper wanted.. in the mid 80’s, the city was reeling. Enron moving in 1986 to Houston and taking 1000+ jobs with them- was quite a blow for a (at the time) 600,000 population Omaha metro. The prospect of ConAgra following suit several years later caused Omaha and this state to switch into panic mode, pass LB775 in 1987..and do whatever it took to make sure Harper’s threats to relocate to another city would never happen. It was a perfect storm, and unfortunately, Harper got his way and those “big ugly red buildings” got bulldozed..It was inevitable..

This all said, I agree with you..and have always thought Omaha missed out on an opportunity to transform the JC building cluster into a progressive mixed residential/entertainment area a la what the Mercer family was able to accomplish transforming the Old Market District in the early-mid 70’s.. I also believe a JC renovation cluster would have been a fantastic compliment to ConAgra’s new HQ’s area and would have co-existed quite nicely with it..

But..stodgy big business ruled the day in the late 80’s..combined with some good old fashioned fear..Had a more measured, visionary mind set ruled the brain trusts at that time, I believe today, things might look much different along Omaha’s Riverfront..

Anywho, discussing what could have been (or not) can be a pretty frustrating exercise if you allow yourself to be dragged down a contrarian rabbit hole. I know you’re smart enough to realize this moving forward...

Ciao..LiO...Peace

[GetUrban]

Yes it can be frustrating to get dragged into pro and con discussions about the destruction of JC. An exercise in speculating on demand which may or may not have materialized had it survived for the last 30 years would be futile and is not the main point. You also have to factor-in the nationally recognized historical significance of Jobbers Canyon and the achievement of the prominent architects who contributed their design excellence to the district along with their other works in Omaha. That’s what makes it seem like such a waste to me. You would also need to factor-in the uniqueness and coolness factor of what the overall district could have become once it was fully redeveloped. They were more than just warehouses made out of big stacks of red bricks.

[Omahacritic]

Ah yes, the Almighty can say “if only” and then it would have been so. No room for critical thought on this thread.

Oh .. the Canyon didn’t receive its designation until 1987. So, until the proposal to tear it down came along, it wasn’t quite “nationally recognized”. How many in Omaha even had an idea what was below 10th Street in the 1970’s and 1980’s?

My God, if only Jobbers Canyon has been saved, Cowboy would be driving on streets paved with gold, shiny baubles lighting our streets, Finest restaurants in America and living with world peace. A real Harlequin existence.

[Big E]

FüCK YEA LAWNS THOUGH

[Omaha Cowboy]

One thing that is true, our resident contrarian does have a “critical imagination”..

...

Ciao..LiO...Peace

[GetUrban]

Oh .. the Canyon didn’t receive its designation until 1987. So, until the proposal to tear it down came along, it wasn’t quite “nationally recognized”. How many in Omaha even had an idea what was below 10th Street in the 1970’s and 1980’s?

The official NHRP designation of Jobber’s Canyon was made on December 4, 1986 by the National Park Service. The push to get it designated started earlier in 1986. See the earlier article posted by Bones. My god, get your facts straight!

The preservation movement in Omaha began in 1966, after the loss of the old US post Office, and has kept building momentum ever since.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Post_ ... _Nebraska)

[Omahacritic]

OMG. I was wrong by 27days.

But you get the point. ‘Nuff said!

[GetUrban]

OMG. I was wrong by 27days.

But you get the point. ‘Nuff said!

I probably should leave it well enough alone, but the proposal to destroy JC didn’t come until roughly 6 months later in mid 1987 after many failed attempts by planners and architects to convince King Harper they should stay. The truth will set you free. But the buildings are gone, so I lost...we all lost that battle.

[Omaha Cowboy]

I probably should leave it well enough alone, but the proposal to destroy JC didn’t come until roughly 6 months later in mid 1987 after many failed attempts by planners and architects to convince King Harper they should stay. The truth will set you free. But the buildings are gone, so I lost...we all lost that battle.

Remember- Contrarian+Rabbithole= Hard Pass ..

The remaining truth is- the buildings got bulldozed and Omaha lost out..The “what could have been” violin concerto leads at almost certain heartburn with headache..As it relates to JC, I try not to let my mind wander down that path too often these days...

Ciao..LiO...Peace

[GetUrban]

I probably should leave it well enough alone, but the proposal to destroy JC didn’t come until roughly 6 months later in mid 1987 after many failed attempts by planners and architects to convince King Harper they should stay. The truth will set you free. But the buildings are gone, so I lost...we all lost that battle.

Remember- Contrarian+Rabbithole= Hard Pass ..

The remaining truth is- the buildings got bulldozed and Omaha lost out..The “what could have been” violin concerto leads at almost certain heartburn with headache..As it relates to JC, I try not to let my mind wander down that path too often these days...

Ciao..LiO...Peace

Nevertheless, I’m glad Garrett brought up the Jobber’s Canyon topic again and found it an important enough topic to do more research for his graduate level planning class work. Maybe the planners of the future will help influence and guide the decision makers to not repeat the same type of mistakes again.

Another thought to ponder just crossed my mind. What if the 1.7 million square feet of JC space was still available for Dino’s Storage to use so they wouldn’t have to build all of those self-storage buildings all over town for people to store all of their junk in? That would be enough justification to save JC right there.

[Omaha Cowboy]

Indeed it is interesting to take a trip down memory lane from time to time..and revisit a significant event such as this..if for anything else, to refresh the memory...

Ciao..LiO...Peace

[GetUrban]

Indeed it is interesting to take a trip down memory lane from time to time..and revisit a significant event such as this..if for anything else, to refresh the memory...

Ciao..LiO...Peace

Yes it is!

I was just joking about Dino’s, if it wasn’t obvious.

[Omaha Cowboy]

Indeed it is interesting to take a trip down memory lane from time to time..and revisit a significant event such as this..if for anything else, to refresh the memory...

Ciao..LiO...Peace

Yes it is!

I was just joking about Dino’s, if it wasn’t obvious.

Oh don’t worry.. That humor was noted, lol...

Ciao..LiO...Peace

[Omahacritic]

“He is a dreamer; let us leave him: pass.”

Caesar, Julius Caesar

[Big E]

https://omaha.com/business/local/big-bu ... -top-story

[Omaha Cowboy]

I posted this in the “what’s missing in downtown” thread..This is a really detailed piece in the W-H chronicling how former ConAgra CEO Mike Harper strong-armed his way to getting his downtown campus built and destroying the historic Jobbers canyon district in the process. It also highlights city/state leaders and businesses leaders, out of fear, caving to Harper’s desire and getting LB 775 passed..which then created the path for the JC demolition and ConAgra’s downtown campus. Ironically, as we all know, ConAgra ended up bailing on Omaha some 26 years later moving its HQ’s into a histrionic district in Chicago.. The light at the end of the tunnel today, is Omaha has the ability to course correct that debacle from the late 1980’s with our 3 phased Riverfront Redevelopment plan..Here are some highlights from the W-H article-

“Big ugly red brick buildings.

When Conagra's chief executive dismissed a historic Omaha warehouse district as such, he ignited preservation rallies, local division and a national spotlight. But none of that could stop demolition of the six-block Jobbers Canyon to clear the way for the company's global headquarters.

Charles "Mike" Harper would say later that only a handful of people wanted to preserve the century-old warehouses — "probably as a home for the rats."

Indeed, tension over the largest-ever wipeout of a designated U.S. historic district grew much larger. Arguably, no other local real estate project in the last half-century created more community conflict and change in landscape and policy than the Conagra-anchored riverfront development.

Omaha already was reeling from a series of unrelated misfortunes when Harper made it known that Nebraska was not a shoo-in for the company's new worldwide headquarters.

Enron in 1986 had just relocated its national headquarters to Houston, taking with it an eventual 2,000 well-paying jobs and long history of civic contributions.

Meanwhile, farmers across the state were in crisis. Banks were failing. Omaha's mayor was being ousted in a recall election. People were worried about job security, said former State Sen. Vard Johnson.

“You could cut the anxiety with a knife,” Johnson said.

As then-Omaha Planning Director Marty Shukert recalled, a city team met on Conagra's turf to present what he thought was a slam dunk design for a new downtown headquarters. The plan featured a glassy corporate high-rise and other new facilities near the Missouri River. It would have saved much of Jobbers Canyon, so named for its dense corridor of buildings for wholesalers, or jobbers. The district had just earned national historic status.

Instead, Harper balked at sharing a site with what he considered unsightly warehouses that he thought would wall off the company from the rest of downtown.“

The complete W-H story link:

https://omaha.com/business/local/big-bu ... -top-story

Ciao..LiO…Peace

[Bob from Omaha]

First off, whatever the Mercantile is it's better than conagra simply abandoning the property.

But I've been reading here and elsewhere about Jobbers Canyon and what might have been. I don't know how many here remember Jobbers Canyon when it was standing, or for that matter how many here were even alive then. Anyway, a few thoughts:

I did business with some companies there and didn't really give the area much thought at the time. Some of the businesses there had been there for quite a long time. After five at night the area was dead. Some people parked there to go to the old market but otherwise it was left to the street people and drug dealers. In addition, there was the battery plant behind jobbers canyon next to the railroad tracks by the river. It was a mess. Absent workers nobody got near it.

Now, what might have been. It would have been a massive effort to save all of the buildings...think the old market without the Mercers. I'm not saying it couldn't have been done but when conagra's campus happened it took a huge behind the scenes effort and a lot of money to move the businesses and collect all the property. Nogg Brothers got land and a new building near the airport. Had to be millions. Similar with others.
IF it could have been done think of how it would have complemented the old market. Huge buildings converted to residential, retail, restaurant, office, etc. Loading docks could have been reimagined for outdoor dining, that kind of thing. Alleys converted into usable space. On and on.

I'm including some pics. Take a look at the couple of buildings with curved sides that were for railroad cars that could have had the upper floors with curved bedrooms or living rooms. Interesting possibilities.

Think about this: Conagra could have maybe built taller office buildings on the battery plant land and jobbers canyon renovated. THAT is what might have been.


Take a look at the second pic in the owh article.
https://omaha.com/business/omahans-weigh-cost-of-destroying-jobbers-canyon-to-make-way-for-conagra-campus/article_0e3988ef-6324-5e3a-a23f-8b1b16c01a9b.html

https://www.moderncities.com/article/2017-oct-5-disastrous-urban-renewal-failures

[Vitruvius]

There's never been an argument for demolishing JC that had any real substance, including any argument that the riverfront development was a responsible use of resources or intelligent design. And nothing will to put an end to the delusions of those who think the Canyon was nothing or that ConAgra saved downtown. But Jobbers Canyon should always be remembered, and redevelopment in the present should always be considered in the context of the past.
I remember asking elected officials then, what will you do with this campus when ConAgra decides to leave Omaha? I guess now we know.

[GetUrban]

Unfortunately, there will always be some people who think keeping ConAgra in downtown Omaha was worth the cost of destroying even 1.7 million square feet of Historic National Register-designated architecture. They are terribly mistaken. If anything, the loss of J.C. makes the erasure of a few of ConAgra’s suburban-style low-rise office buildings seem minuscule and more plausible now, especially if canyon-like higher density development can replace the Ill-fated campus.

[Bob from Omaha]

Not that I was ever in favor of destroying jobbers canyon but there were any number of efforts to save it. In the end no one stepped up with the cash to do it. I don't remember anyone saying that Conagra saved downtown, although their other two alternatives (moving to a new campus next to Lonergan Lake & moving to Knoxville) would have done nothing for downtown Omaha. What they did do was keep or bring hundreds if not thousands of employees downtown. They also contributed to Heartland of America Park's construction. AND with their campus was a remarkable reuse of the battery plant site. When Heartland of America Park opened it brought actual people and a lot of them to an area that prior to it was not suitable for anything (the battery plant). It brought people, including families, back downtown during the day and especially at night.

I am NOT saying it was worth destroying jobbers canyon. What I AM saying is that in the over 30 years since the construction of the campus and now the resulting additions & changes to the campus employees and residents came/stayed/relocated to an area that may otherwise have never been utilized.

You don't have to like what happened to jobbers canyon but I think even the most hard core jobbers canyon lovers could admit that there were even minor positive outcomes.

By the way, I never heard the area referred to as jobbers canyon until conagra came forward with their plan.

This all begs the question. If opponents of the conagra proposal had been successful, what then? As I said no one stepped forward with the cash to do anything. Should it have simply sat there waiting? Yes, some of the companies may have stayed put. If your answer is yes I can accept that but if some or all of the occupants would have left and the buildings sat empty or only partially used and deteriorating, then what?

[Busguy2010]

I think I would have really liked the Lonergan Lake option. Those buildings would have looked good up there in basically a prairie setting. That would have had potential to totally change the direction Omaha grew, and I think the boom in construction that happened in the 90's and 2000's in mostly a straight west on Dodge direction, I think we might have seen that development follow more of a HWY 133 path. I think that would have been cool. I am still surprised the Northern Hills are still as underdeveloped as they are... I digress. If either option happened, I'm sure they would have left Omaha when they did anyway.

[GetUrban]

Not that I was ever in favor of destroying jobbers canyon but there were any number of efforts to save it. In the end no one stepped up with the cash to do it. I don't remember anyone saying that Conagra saved downtown, although their other two alternatives (moving to a new campus next to Lonergan Lake & moving to Knoxville) would have done nothing for downtown Omaha. What they did do was keep or bring hundreds if not thousands of employees downtown. They also contributed to Heartland of America Park's construction. AND with their campus was a remarkable reuse of the battery plant site. When Heartland of America Park opened it brought actual people and a lot of them to an area that prior to it was not suitable for anything (the battery plant). It brought people, including families, back downtown during the day and especially at night.

I am NOT saying it was worth destroying jobbers canyon. What I AM saying is that in the over 30 years since the construction of the campus and now the resulting additions & changes to the campus employees and residents came/stayed/relocated to an area that may otherwise have never been utilized.

You don't have to like what happened to jobbers canyon but I think even the most hard core jobbers canyon lovers could admit that there were even minor positive outcomes.

By the way, I never heard the area referred to as jobbers canyon until conagra came forward with their plan.

This all begs the question. If opponents of the conagra proposal had been successful, what then? As I said no one stepped forward with the cash to do anything. Should it have simply sat there waiting? Yes, some of the companies may have stayed put. If your answer is yes I can accept that but if some or all of the occupants would have left and the buildings sat empty or only partially used and deteriorating, then what?

I would agree there were some minor positive outcomes such as 2000 people to keep working downtown. Despite growing up in Omaha, I too had not heard of the area referred to as Jobbers Canyon, until ConAgra put it on the chopping block.

If ConAgra would have adopted some of the earlier options presented to them for their new riverfront office complex, JC could have remained intact and the warehouses could have slowly been redeveloped over the next 20-30 years much like the rest of the warehouses close to the area were naturally redeveloped over the years. The existing companies could have cashed-in as the demand for warehouse type loft development slowly increased over time. JC didn’t really need a single big development entity to come in and buy-up everything at once.

Mike Harper couldn’t overcome his thoughts of JC as being an eyesore in the way of his corporate vision for his company.