Avenue One (192nd & Dodge)

[PWL73316]

Aksarben would be a best case scenario for these suburban "walkable" developments. Like it or not, everyone who doesn't live there has to drive there, which means lots of parking. And if you are already driving there, the temptation is just to make it a strip mall, which is what basically all of these end up becoming, except Aksarben (sort of). If any of these suburban projects end up half as dense or walkable as Aksarben I will be amazed.

[ita]

Aksarben would be a best case scenario for these suburban "walkable" developments. Like it or not, everyone who doesn't live there has to drive there, which means lots of parking. And if you are already driving there, the temptation is just to make it a strip mall, which is what basically all of these end up becoming, except Aksarben (sort of). If any of these suburban projects end up half as dense or walkable as Aksarben I will be amazed.

I would like Aksarben to be the base line for what these suburban projects achieve, not the aspiration.

Edit: I think my expectations are unrealistic. Part of having walkable neighborhoods is a heavy dose of public transit. That's not happening in western Omaha, so I shouldn't have any expectation of more than what we're getting.

[PWL73316]

Sure, so would I, but just being realistic, it's their land, they are going to do whatever costs the least and makes the most. Out in the boonies, that is a strip mall and subdivisions. "It would be neat" only takes you so far.

[Garrett]

One could argue that they use a fancy vision to help get through the permitting process and/or attract capital without ever having a real intention of creating little urban neighborhoods?

It's pretty obvious at this point. Even Aksarben did a bait and switch.

Looking at original renderings, it looks largely comparable to what we ended up getting. The project ended up with more surface parking, particularly to the north side of the development, which is disappointing, but they landed a few taller buildings like Green Plains HQ, BCBS HQ, and the HDR HQ. Plus, South of Center saw residual development with Baxter, baseball/softball fields, and other commercial and residential uses. I would like to see these urban developments do the core first, than build out from there. I don't know all the details of financing and investing, so maybe it just can't work like that, but it's disappointing to have to wait and see if the somewhat interesting parts of these big suburban projects actual come about.

I'd say at least Aksarben made good strides towards their original intentions.

Aksarben also isn’t at full build out quite yet. When HDR built they said there would be room for another tower north of them. There are other empty lots that are marked for residential still iirc.

[Louie]

One could argue that they use a fancy vision to help get through the permitting process and/or attract capital without ever having a real intention of creating little urban neighborhoods?

It's pretty obvious at this point. Even Aksarben did a bait and switch.

Looking at original renderings, it looks largely comparable to what we ended up getting. The project ended up with more surface parking, particularly to the north side of the development, which is disappointing, but they landed a few taller buildings like Green Plains HQ, BCBS HQ, and the HDR HQ. Plus, South of Center saw residual development with Baxter, baseball/softball fields, and other commercial and residential uses. I would like to see these urban developments do the core first, than build out from there. I don't know all the details of financing and investing, so maybe it just can't work like that, but it's disappointing to have to wait and see if the somewhat interesting parts of these big suburban projects actual come about.

I'd say at least Aksarben made good strides towards their original intentions.

Aksarben also isn’t at full build out quite yet. When HDR built they said there would be room for another tower north of them. There are other empty lots that are marked for residential still iirc.

Very true, still a number of development lots available.

[ita]

Replatting for more office buildings and parking for our other new suburban "downtown" neighborhood:

https://planning.cityofomaha.org/images ... May/17.pdf

[Louie]

Downtown feels for sure...

[TransitOriented]

At least there's a building with 6 floors.
Land must be so incredibly cheap that they can afford just to pave it all.

My new theory on all these new developments out west is that they are building them as cheaply as possible so in 50 years the land will be worth many millions and it will be easy to tear them down and build actual good structures. These have to just be temporary/short-term.

[Brad]

Site Plan for a mixed use area:
https://planning.cityofomaha.org/images ... une/18.pdf

[Brad]

They started grading on the west side of 192nd street, north of the retirement center, south of MD West One.

[Athomsfere]

Downtown feels for sure...

Man, I see things like this and wonder if these people have ever been to a downtown

[PWL73316]

From nouveau small town to strip mall in record time.

[Garrett]

Honestly at this point I don't trust any local developers of master planned communities like this beyond maybe Noddle. Legacy, TriBeDo, the master plan for Millard from back in the day, all are disappointments.

[ita]

https://planning.cityofomaha.org/images ... uly/12.pdf

More auto dealership space planned for west Omaha.

[TransitOriented]

Honestly at this point I don't trust any local developers of master planned communities like this beyond maybe Noddle. Legacy, TriBeDo, the master plan for Millard from back in the day, all are disappointments.

Heartwood/Boys Town started as a Noddle development, so he basically did a bait/switch.

[almighty_tuna]

Heartwood/Boys Town started as a Noddle development, so he basically did a bait/switch.

I wouldn't characterize it as a bait/switch in the least. To paraphrase, IIRC Noddle wasn't moving fast enough for the project's stakeholders, they agreed to disagree and Noddle was no longer with the project.

[TitosBuritoBarn]

It says four auto dealerships will be there, but there doesn't seem to be space to store product for that many dealerships, at least not in front of the buildings I assume are the dealerships. Hmmm..

[mcarch]

At one point, there was talk that Borsheims was going to move out there... Also, I would not want to live in those row houses next to all those retail buildings and commercial offices. Its not mixed use enough, nor are there any other residential components to it for it to feel like a row house type of neighborhood. Its like its just a thrown together plat for the sake of "doing something." And here we go again... wasting expensive land on wasteful buildings.

On the west side, are those building even big enough for dealerships? They look more like restaurant building sizes. And what dealerships even need to move - who already doesn't have a new building/already wasted perfectly good land on industrial low-rise warehouse car dealerships?

[ita]

At one point, there was talk that Borsheims was going to move out there... Also, I would not want to live in those row houses next to all those retail buildings and commercial offices. Its not mixed use enough, nor are there any other residential components to it for it to feel like a row house type of neighborhood. Its like its just a thrown together plat for the sake of "doing something." And here we go again... wasting expensive land on wasteful buildings.

On the west side, are those building even big enough for dealerships? They look more like restaurant building sizes. And what dealerships even need to move - who already doesn't have a new building/already wasted perfectly good land on industrial low-rise warehouse car dealerships?

Those are good points. Looking at the plan again, the auto sales buildings are composed of four adjacent buildings, all relatively small for most traditional dealerships. I wonder if Bentley Omaha/Woodhouse Select will be moving from Village Pointe.

[TransitOriented]

I wonder if Bentley Omaha/Woodhouse Select will be moving from Village Pointe.

What about Barnato?

[ita]

I wonder if Bentley Omaha/Woodhouse Select will be moving from Village Pointe.

What about Barnato?

Yeah, maybe one of those buildings will house Barnato. With very little traditional lot space around those buildings marked for auto sales, I think it might be that business. If they do move, that would mean that retail area would be completely empty with BBB closing up shop by then.

[Trips1]

The Ford Model E dealers all need to build new buildings. They have to be separate from the ICE part of the company. The only vehicles they have will be for test drives. All vehicles will be ordered so they will have have inventory.

Woodhouse never did open a Lamborghini dealership.

[ita]

Apparently, this is one of two Good Life Districts approved by the State so far. I thought that 20% of revenue needs to come from out of state customers since it's located in a large county? This does not seem like that kind of development, but I also haven't seen what their plans are on the retail side of things. What happens when the development doesn't meet that metric, or the other metrics, total development value or jobs created? Does the developer have to pay back those taxes used to fund the development?

[Garrett]

Apparently, this is one of two Good Life Districts approved by the State so far. I thought that 20% of revenue needs to come from out of state customers since it's located in a large county? This does not seem like that kind of development, but I also haven't seen what their plans are on the retail side of things. What happens when the development doesn't meet that metric, or the other metrics, total development value or jobs created? Does the developer have to pay back those taxes used to fund the development?

From the sounds of the article it sounds like they’re make a lot of stuff up on the fly, so I would not be surprised if they didn’t have an out of some sort planned out

[Garrett]

Another update, 7 years after ground breaking

https://www.wowt.com/2024/10/17/develop ... est-omaha/

[almighty_tuna]

I will be voting no on this particular GLD. The website reads like so many buzzwords and the developer's biggest sell as to what he's going to do with his tax kickback is a $20M pedestrian bridge over Dodge to pretend like the sparse park on the other side is somehow a part of this "district." Nope.

[Garrett]

I will be voting no on this particular GLD. The website reads like so many buzzwords and the developer's biggest sell as to what he's going to do with his tax kickback is a $20M pedestrian bridge over Dodge to pretend like the sparse park on the other side is somehow a part of this "district." Nope.

Seriously. $1.2 billion total budget and we're supposed to be wowed by a $20 million bridge? This guy is trying to compete with Yates for the region's biggest snake oil salesman.

[Louie]

7 years on and the 'district' looks like any other West Omaha commercial zone.

[djc311]

I will be voting no on this particular GLD. The website reads like so many buzzwords and the developer's biggest sell as to what he's going to do with his tax kickback is a $20M pedestrian bridge over Dodge to pretend like the sparse park on the other side is somehow a part of this "district." Nope.

Seriously. $1.2 billion total budget and we're supposed to be wowed by a $20 million bridge? This guy is trying to compete with Yates for the region's biggest snake oil salesman.

LOLOL - I'm surprised they're not in kohoots together on projects.

[skinzfan23]

Maybe they can build the pedestrian bridge to go over the top of the arena and you could purchase tickets to sit on it and look straight down into it.

[Habits76]

I worked for Curt many years ago and he's an honest man and has as far as I know always lead with integrity. Most projects of this type seem to be over the top and rarely come to full fruition, so I guess we'll have to wait and see how this one pans out.

[TitosBuritoBarn]

I'd vote 'no' too. The style of development proposed does not make much sense there and will end up being 'drive-to' urbanism. I don't believe that we need to invest in regional centers this far away from the population center and the downtown core. And with the Elkhorn River being the boundary where Omaha westward expansion would likely end, I don't see this area becoming a population center. Plus I fail to see how it would attract tourists.

It's also funny to me how they didn't want to include car dealerships with the plan because they want something really special. But the original plan included four car dealerships.

[NEDodger]

I’m voting no on this as well. There’s nothing special about this that necessitates cutting into tax revenues.

[Athomsfere]

will end up being 'drive-to' urbanism. I don't believe that we need to invest in regional centers this far away from the population center and the downtown core.

This is my biggest issue too. If you want to build some density, build this better. If you can't afford to build this monstrous pseudo-urbanist car dependent wreck, then pick some smaller brownfields that you can make actually better...

100% voting no.

[nativeomahan]

This was the only ballot issue I took a pause to ponder how I would vote (I voted early). I won’t say which oval I filled in.

[Cup of Cheese]

None of what is there now looks "unique" as stated by the developer when plans first came out.

[Brad]

The 192 & Dodge area is a mix of projects are technically in the "AVENUE ONE" Development and which projects are in the "FOUNTAIN RIDGE WEST" and "FOUNTAIN RIDGE EAST". Not sure I have ever seen anything like it.

So one project that's in a lot platted at "AVENUE ONE", is a new Primrose School 19401 S HWS CLEVELAND BD, OMAHA NE 68022. You can see the roof sticking up as you drive down 192nd Street.

[Brad]

Planning board item for a 13,500 SF Retail building. Its the size of a Walgreens, but doesn't have a drive through. Has a loading dock with 3 dumpsters and a lot of parking for a building that size. Too small for a fairway or Aldi.

Avenue One Retail Building:
https://planning.cityofomaha.org/images ... ber/21.pdf

[Ryan j]

Planning board item for a 13,500 SF Retail building. Its the size of a Walgreens, but doesn't have a drive through. Has a loading dock with 3 dumpsters and a lot of parking for a building that size. Too small for a fairway or Aldi.

Avenue One Retail Building:
https://planning.cityofomaha.org/images ... ber/21.pdf

Trader Joe's? looks to me like the other location in Omaha is just under 13,000 sq ft

[nebport5]

Lots of parking should eliminate TJ’s