Road Diets?

[Garrett]

I mean, we can dream Omaha one day decides to make the city more hospitable to people.

Sure, but pushing to remove lanes from one of the city's busiest streets is very unrealistic and will turn many against the concept of road diets in general.

It's better to focus on less major thoroughfares with excess capacity. Streets like Leavenworth and other undivided four lane roads for example.

Yeah I think there need to be more tangible successes before the city pushes for Dodge. While Dodge is very much seen as the core of the city, it's mostly seen that way because it's built for cars. In my opinion, there are strong candidates that are more ripe to turn into pedestrian oriented, transit focus corridors. After 24th Street is done in whatever form, you could get another solid BRT line out of a route running between Downtown and Bergan Mercy via Leavenworth, 42nd, Center, and 78th. I think all of these streets could give varying amounts of space for transit priority and increased pedestrian space, with a good combination of existing major destinations and development potential.

[Athomsfere]

Sure, but pushing to remove lanes from one of the city's busiest streets is very unrealistic

That is exactly what The Netherlands did, and it worked amazingly well. A city not much different in population than Omaha able to accommodate over 20 million tourists a year with ease.

and will turn many against the concept of road diets in general.

A very different problem, Yes most American's are utterly awful at understanding what a city should look like. Until they experience it.

I'm also not saying we should start with Dodge, but this should be goal. Instead we keep moving backwards and doing stupid stuff like the expressway, adding lanes at 72nd and on 680.

[Louie]

Sure, but pushing to remove lanes from one of the city's busiest streets is very unrealistic

That is exactly what The Netherlands did, and it worked amazingly well. A city not much different in population than Omaha able to accommodate over 20 million tourists a year with ease.

Really? I just assumed the roads were already narrow thanks to the original timeframe that they were built.

[halgy]

A road diet would be 2 months of readjustment, and then traffic would be back to normal. If the downtown construction has proven anything to me, it is that we don't need that many lanes downtown. The first trip through after a change takes some relearning, but as long as there's one lane open it is usually fine. That is unless there's a big event downtown, but that backs up traffic regardless of how many lanes are open.

[Athomsfere]

Sure, but pushing to remove lanes from one of the city's busiest streets is very unrealistic

That is exactly what The Netherlands did, and it worked amazingly well. A city not much different in population than Omaha able to accommodate over 20 million tourists a year with ease.

Really? I just assumed the roads were already narrow thanks to the original timeframe that they were built.

World War 2 might have helped there, before Canada went and liberated the Netherlands. But for a while after the war, American road design was huge there, and resulted in even the old Amsterdam getting very clogged with cars:




It even got so far that Amsterdam began considering things like the Jokinen Plan, tearing out historical areas to build highways and ring roads through exactly what people go to see now.

Like Paris' similar plans, luckily it went the other way. Car lanes and parking removed, sidewalks extended and bike lanes added.

And it's continuous and iterative. Amsterdam is still removing parking every year and building new and better bike infrastructure every year.

I like to think on few places a lot on transit. Rotterdam and Utrecht are other interesting stories. Here is what Utrecht did with a highway they built:




And Seoul has another famous one



I think if you compare Tokyo, Seoul, Amsterdam, Utrecht and Rotterdam long enough with their decisions post WWII (Or Korean war for Seoul specifically) you can see pretty starkly where each city took the advice of the US for road design, and then realized it was actually the worst possible way of building a city, and changed course.

Tokyo went full send, nearly the other way. As did Amsterdam. And Tokyo the exceptions are equally interesting. Like coming out of a subway, to see businesses built under a highway.

Rotterdam seems to be 80% the way Amsterdam is, but all new construction as the destruction from the war was much more complete.

Utrecht is somewhere in the middle. And it is jarring to leave the city center to where its more car-centric and then the drastic drop in third places and vibrancy.

And then there is Seoul. Which seems to have not fully committed even now to one direction over the other. It's a perfectly odd hybrid of Los Angeles and Tokyo. For every Hongdae there is another area with a 6 lane stroad running through it where the fastest way to cross the street is to go into a train station, walk a block or two, go under the road, then leave the train station to continue your walk.

[Dusty]

Dodge Street won't change anytime soon. Yes, it's the main street for cars to travel East-West. This also means it's the spine to the entire transit network. It comes with massive backlash over taking car access away. You need to prove transit ridership has increased so much that it has caused a significant reduction in car traffic. The problem is the ORBT just gets stuck in traffic. This makes it impossible to make strides in ridership. They designed curbside stations because center lane stations would have taken away car capacity. Drop below a certain level of capacity and you lose federal funding as a highway. This is why light rail will never happen on Dodge either. The best bet is to continue building strong density along Dodge St. Let the current BRT system run its lifespan or possibly 2 lifespans. Most buses only last 12-15 years. At that point plan to leapfrog from BRT lite to Metro rail. Elevated above Dodge or below grade. At that point, you could do a road diet, make left turn lanes, protected bikeway, etc.

None of that will happen unless you build trust with the community about transit. Focusing on other corridors to get ridership up. The city and Metro Transit has a lot of work to get there.

Side note: I would rather focus energy on decommissioning NW Radial HWY before 7-8 roundabouts show up. This area would be incredible as a multi-modal corridor.

[Busguy2010]

I'm tellin' ya, giving that westbound curb lane between Turner Blvd and 69th to bus only would double ridership. Just what it needs is an advantage.

I say give the bus the westbound curb lane only. Stripe it and put some bollards wherever you can. Watch the buses fill up and fly by. I love to envision how quickly they could then travel between 33rd and 69th, flying by the line of cars that usually forms down the hill from UNO. Probably would reduce the travel time by a few minutes or more. Add this would have the least impact on traffic, as probably half the people out there dont use the middle third lane as it is. Eastbound lanes would stay as is, but half is better than nothing.

[Athomsfere]

Dodge Street won't change anytime soon. Yes, it's the main street for cars to travel East-West. This also means it's the spine to the entire transit network. It comes with massive backlash over taking car access away. You need to prove transit ridership has increased so much that it has caused a significant reduction in car traffic. The problem is the ORBT just gets stuck in traffic.

I call that upside down thinking. I mean you are right about the ORBT getting stuck in traffic, it can bunch badly. I missed a bus by 1 minute one time, another didn't show up for 30 minutes, at which time there were 3 basically 1 minute apart.

But as long as we prioritize cars, ridership won't improve because we aren't putting the work in to make transit viable. If Dodge is the backbone, it should be a priority for making it functional.

I'm not saying its easy to do, especially with the Midwest American brain rot we have going on...

[nebugeater]

Dodge Street won't change anytime soon. Yes, it's the main street for cars to travel East-West. This also means it's the spine to the entire transit network. It comes with massive backlash over taking car access away. You need to prove transit ridership has increased so much that it has caused a significant reduction in car traffic. The problem is the ORBT just gets stuck in traffic.

I call that upside down thinking. I mean you are right about the ORBT getting stuck in traffic, it can bunch badly. I missed a bus by 1 minute one time, another didn't show up for 30 minutes, at which time there were 3 basically 1 minute apart.

But as long as we prioritize cars, ridership won't improve because we aren't putting the work in to make transit viable. If Dodge is the backbone, it should be a priority for making it functional.

I'm not saying its easy to do, especially with the Midwest American brain rot we have going on...

That's insulting to the backbone on mid America

[Athomsfere]

Dodge Street won't change anytime soon. Yes, it's the main street for cars to travel East-West. This also means it's the spine to the entire transit network. It comes with massive backlash over taking car access away. You need to prove transit ridership has increased so much that it has caused a significant reduction in car traffic. The problem is the ORBT just gets stuck in traffic.

I call that upside down thinking. I mean you are right about the ORBT getting stuck in traffic, it can bunch badly. I missed a bus by 1 minute one time, another didn't show up for 30 minutes, at which time there were 3 basically 1 minute apart.

But as long as we prioritize cars, ridership won't improve because we aren't putting the work in to make transit viable. If Dodge is the backbone, it should be a priority for making it functional.

I'm not saying its easy to do, especially with the Midwest American brain rot we have going on...

That's insulting to the backbone on mid America

Maybe we need to hear it more. We keep doing everything wrong and then complaining about the obvious repercussions when they come to fruit.

[Louie]

Been driving on leavenworth and they are in the process of converting it from 2 lane each way to one lane each way and a turn lane from 48th to 60th. Step one has been stripping the top layer of pavement and its exposing parts the old brick road. Pretty cool looking.

[meliketrains]

Dodge Street won't change anytime soon. Yes, it's the main street for cars to travel East-West. This also means it's the spine to the entire transit network. It comes with massive backlash over taking car access away. You need to prove transit ridership has increased so much that it has caused a significant reduction in car traffic. The problem is the ORBT just gets stuck in traffic.

I call that upside down thinking. I mean you are right about the ORBT getting stuck in traffic, it can bunch badly. I missed a bus by 1 minute one time, another didn't show up for 30 minutes, at which time there were 3 basically 1 minute apart.

But as long as we prioritize cars, ridership won't improve because we aren't putting the work in to make transit viable. If Dodge is the backbone, it should be a priority for making it functional.

I'm not saying its easy to do, especially with the Midwest American brain rot we have going on...

Agree with this. Expecting the cart to come before the horse will never bear fruit. NYC was buililding subway extensions out to the middle of nowhere because they knew development would eventually come. China did the same. Granted, these are not identical comparisons, but transit doesn't happen "organically" because the barriers to entry are so high. The long-term costs are massively discounted compared to roads, but when the majority of your infrastructure is already roads, the path of least resistance is to continue building more of the same.

If Omaha, and midwest cities broadly, want to become liveable, walkable, transit-oriented, healthy, safe, affordable, connected communities, we have to bite the bullet and rip off the car-brained thinking first. Give dedicated lanes to transit, buy Dodge from the Feds, rework the corridor from UNO down to downtown with a true road diet and light rail, and force people to either take public transit and infill east or use the highway for their cars. In time, younger generations will throw away the ball and chain that is their second mortgage on wheels and opt for a leaner, cleaner, safer life. It happened in Europe and there's no reason it can't happen here.

[S.O.Boy]

Been driving on leavenworth and they are in the process of converting it from 2 lane each way to one lane each way and a turn lane from 48th to 60th. Step one has been stripping the top layer of pavement and its exposing parts the old brick road. Pretty cool looking.

And it is getting a bike lane.

[locoluke]

I think the Leavenworth diet/re-surfacing is substantially complete at this point, but I'm not sure b/c I haven't driven the full length of it in a few days.

[nativeomahan]

I think the Leavenworth diet/re-surfacing is substantially complete at this point, but I'm not sure b/c I haven't driven the full length of it in a few days.

As of yesterday it is still a work in progress, especially west of 50th Street.

[nativeomahan]

I don’t believe in bashing people because they are not on the same development wavelength as me. I do agree that the US is largely out of step with much of the rest of the developed world when it comes to designing urban areas to appeal to automobile owners. Having spent a month in Europe this past year, visiting 7 countries, I see that the emphasis for many decades has been on development of public transportation, while at the same time having streets and highways accessible (at least most days of the week, but often not on weekends) to private motor vehicles. It seems to work, as public transportation modes (plus bicycles, electric bikes, scooters and just plain walking) account for the majority of how people get around. That is also true to a greater extent in Mexico, where we maintain an home, although motorcycles are also a very popular means of transportation. The problem is that U.S. cities aren’t designed like an Etch-a-Sketch, that you can just shake and start all over from nothing. We are pretty much stuck with the development decisions made in the Postwar decades of the 20th Century, where GM, Ford and Chrysler called the shots and convinced America that owning a car somehow equaled freedom. Suburbs flourished, where there was no easy way to walk to all of the places people needed to visit in a typical week. My husband and I don’t own or use a car in Mexico, and 99% of the time we don’t miss having one, as we walk or take Ubers or public busses everywhere we need to go. Mostly we walk. When we feel the need to venture out of our neighborhood busses are close by, and run every 5-10 minutes from pre-dawn until at least 10 or 11 pm, when they run maybe every 20 minutes. They certainly aren’t glamorous, and we can’t turn up our stereo and listen to our favorite music or radio station, but we don’t really miss that, as busses are great people watching venues. In larger Mexican (and European) cities public transportation options include trolleys and subways, which speed you along much more efficiently than a car, which can be impossible to park as parking lots and garages are virtually unheard of. Not having expenses related to vehicle ownership (purchase price, licensing, insurance, parking costs, repairs and maintenance) means we could take multiple uber or taxi trips every day and still come out far ahead, cost wise.
But here in the US most mid sized and larger cities are destined to remain car centric for many years to come, until future generations change their mindset and urban redesign catches up with our neighbors in other nations. It is what it is. Omaha is taking baby steps, but that is all that they are.

[Louie]

I think the Leavenworth diet/re-surfacing is substantially complete at this point, but I'm not sure b/c I haven't driven the full length of it in a few days.

As of yesterday it is still a work in progress, especially west of 50th Street.

I just drove the length of it, appears complete.