Omaha/Nebraska Smoking Ban

Linkin5 · Post by **Linkin5** » Thu Jun 22, 2006 3:15 pm

Ummm well aside from the health risks, if I'm not going to smoke the cigarette, why the |expletive| do I have to smell like a musty version of one for the next couple days? DTO have you ever been to a bar?

DTO Luv · Post by **DTO Luv** » Thu Jun 22, 2006 3:23 pm

Yes. And I have a question for you. If you don't like smoking why the |expletive| would go to someplace that allows it. It seems to me that even though you all don't like smoking you sure seem to tolerate it an awful lot.

Even beyond the smoking the bigger picture is the government telling a private business how to be run. (Communism) You all are complaining about something that doesn't HAVE to have an affect on you but you choose to let it. That's as stupid as going to the north pole in shorts and being shocked to find the weather is cold. If you want warm weather, go to Florida. If you don't want smoking go some place else.

Big E · Post by **Big E** » Thu Jun 22, 2006 3:37 pm

Yeah, I'd hate to have the government be able to tell me where and when I can serve alcohol, how much, to whom, what age my employees have to be, how cold my refrigerator has to be, how hot my oven has to be, where I can store cleaners (and what kind of cleaners), how my toilets have to run, when my employees have to wash their hands, what sanitizers I have to use in my sinks and how hot AND cold the water has to be, how much I have to pay my employees, how much I have to charge my guests for alcohol, how many exits I have to have, how many people can come in, where I have to post signs for the exits (and what color), and, of course, how old the naked dancing girls have to be.

Anyone that uses the "I hate the government telling me how to run my business" argument has OBVIOUSLY never run a business.

As soon as you start fighting against all the other Communist health and safety codes, I'll buy your anti-anti-smoking libertarian stance. Until then, your analogies are irrelevant to me.

-Big E

Linkin5 · Post by **Linkin5** » Thu Jun 22, 2006 4:03 pm

DTO Luv wrote:Even beyond the smoking the bigger picture is the government telling a private business how to be run. (Communism)

Wll if this was anything like communism then there would be no privately owned bar just a government owned pub....so no its nothing like communism, marx would be very upset with you. Why do I go to bars? To see live music, to hang out with friends, if this smoke ban doesn't pass its not gonna keep me from going to bars in Omaha, it just won't be as enjoyable of a time versus if it did pass. But seriously, if you are so addicted to smoking that you can't put that cancer stick down for a couple hours while you're at a bar then go get the patch or some help.

MTO · Post by **MTO** » Thu Jun 22, 2006 4:30 pm

Thats just it DShawn! It effects our lives already!

I think you pro smokers first need to admit that it is harmful to our health and yours. Once you truly admit that you may start to understand.

Finn · Post by **Finn** » Thu Jun 22, 2006 4:32 pm

Well you do have these things growing from your |expletive| called legs.

Right, so walk your as$ outside and have a smoke.

Maybe the smokers can pool their money together and open a little smokers club -- like a cigar bar. That way you can smoke and others don't HAVE to deal with it.

Big E · Post by **Big E** » Thu Jun 22, 2006 4:37 pm

Actually, if it was Communism, they'd be standing in line for 6 hours for the smokes while I was at the bar enjoying some Vodka. Glasnost, sucka.

And, for the record, if the non-smokers actually had their way, the sticks would be regulated by the FDA and off the market 50 years ago.

Finn- Maybe I'll actually hit the bars with you next time you're in town!

-Big E

MTO · Post by **MTO** » Thu Jun 22, 2006 5:07 pm

I cant' even conceive what people will do when this goes through... But i really don't give a |expletive| because now their cancer is their own problem.

Big E · Post by **Big E** » Thu Jun 22, 2006 5:49 pm

I'll tell you what they'll do:

They'll stay home for a couple of months and sulk and whine about the liberals. Then they'll realize they live in Nebraska. Then they'll head back to the bars and restaurants and not smoke or go smoke outside like they do in every other city. Then when winter comes around they'll cry about going outside in the cold and go outside and smoke like they do in every other city.

And then life will go on and they can concentrate their efforts on removing all forms of government controls from places of business, like allowing owners to hire all the illegal immigrants they want.

-Big E

(I am SO obviously teasing DTO here, so calm down, Joe.) ;)

MTO · Post by **MTO** » Thu Jun 22, 2006 5:52 pm

They would be better off just dedicating these remaining years on kicking their addiction.

DTO Luv · Post by **DTO Luv** » Thu Jun 22, 2006 6:08 pm

For the record I don't smoke. I'm with you all there about it being bad for you and not appealing.

Big E-

All of that stuff you mentioned about the government regulating things like washing hands is common sense. Common sense tells you if you took a upset, wash your hands. Common sense says don't leave meat out in the open, put it in the cold. Common sence says if you don't want to be around smoking, don't hang around people that smoke. Common sense also says if you don't have a non-smoking alternative, START ONE.

Big E · Post by **Big E** » Thu Jun 22, 2006 7:02 pm

But somehow common sense doesn't dictate that you shouldn't smoke?

And in turn, if you can pass legislation about all of those common sense issues, why can't you pass legislation about this one? ie, if they're common sense, why do they need laws?

Furthermore, sense has NEVER been common.

-Big E

Finn · Post by **Finn** » Thu Jun 22, 2006 7:30 pm

Let's just flip that around:

If you don't have a SMOKING alternative, START ONE! (Majority rules)

omahahawk · Post by **omahahawk** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 9:05 am

I'm with MTO, Finn and Big E completely. I really also hope that the stand alone bars see how sucessfull the bar and grills do under the ban and decide to go non smoking themselves before the 5 year deadline. IMHO, I seriously think that the bar and grills won't see that dramatic of a decline in business, or at least not for long. Soon enough they'll be back to where they were before the ban and quite possibly doing better business. Last time I checked the online poll at OWH, it looked like the pro smoking ban people ahead by about a 3 to 1 margin.

loyalomahan · Post by **loyalomahan** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 9:15 am

If you don't have a SMOKING alternative, START ONE! (Majority rules)

I'm for the smoking ban, but on behalf of smokers, how COULD you start a smoking alternative? It would have to be like a smoking 'speak easy'.

praymojo420 · Post by **praymojo420** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 9:22 am

Finn wrote:
Well you do have these things growing from your |expletive| called legs.
Right, so walk your as$ outside and have a smoke.

Maybe the smokers can pool their money together and open a little smokers club -- like a cigar bar. That way you can smoke and others don't HAVE to deal with it.

No wait, I've got a better idea. I'll open a place where I can serve alcohol. Yeah. Oh and I'll allow smoking at my discretion. Yeah. I'll call it a bar.

Others not having to deal with it eh? How about DONT GO WHERE PEOPLE SMOKE!

MTO · Post by **MTO** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 9:27 am

Oh yeah thats fair all 5 of them or so? Then you addicts have hundreds and hundreds to go to....

praymojo420 · Post by **praymojo420** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 9:32 am

5 is a bigger number than zero. There probably should be more, but that should be the proprietor 's discretion.

Big E · Post by **Big E** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 9:38 am

omahahawk wrote:IMHO, I seriously think that the bar and grills won't see that dramatic of a decline in business, or at least not for long. Soon enough they'll be back to where they were before the ban and quite possibly doing better business.

That is pretty much exactly what has played out in every jurisdiction that has implemented a smoking ban, and evidence supports it. I'm not going to claim that this won't affect some businesses more than others, but let's face it: if you close because people can't smoke, you didn't have much of a product.

mojo wrote:No wait, I've got a better idea. I'll open a place where I can serve alcohol. Yeah. Oh and I'll allow smoking at my discretion. Yeah. I'll call it a bar.

No wait, I've got a better idea. I'll open a place where I can serve food. Yeah. Oh and I'll follow health codes at my discretion. Yeah. I'll call it an ecoli and salmonella factory.

Or try this one:

No wait, I've got a better idea. I'll open a place where I can serve food and alcohol. Yeah. Oh and I'll allow people in at my discretion. Yeah. I'll call it a diner in Alabama in 1956. And if people don't like the way I choose who gets to come in, they can go somewhere else. Smoking now, smoking tomorrow, smoking forever! (OK, that one might be a stretch, but I think you get my point.)

-Big E

MTO · Post by **MTO** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 9:38 am

Well we gave them plenty of time so now it's to the point where our government to tell them what to do. Since they yes are to stupid to do it on their own.

praymojo420 · Post by **praymojo420** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 9:43 am

No wait, I've got a better idea. I'll open a place where I can serve food. Yeah. Oh and I'll follow health codes at my discretion. Yeah. I'll call it an ecoli and salmonella factory.

But you're not serving poison to begin with. You're not advertising foul food. Bars just happen to advertise foul liquid. Strange coincidence.

No wait, I've got a better idea. I'll open a place where I can serve food and alcohol. Yeah. Oh and I'll allow people in at my discretion. Yeah. I'll call it a diner in Alabama in 1956. And if people don't like the way I choose who gets to come in, they can go somewhere else. Smoking now, smoking tomorrow, smoking forever! (OK, that one might be a stretch, but I think you get my point.)

Bad analogy. Huge difference. Smoking is a choice and so is allowed to be selective.

MTO · Post by **MTO** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 9:49 am

Smoking is not a choice its an addiction. And people should not have to breathe it if they want to go to their favorite restaurant or bar. I don't care how much smoking is embedded into the bar culture. If you want to smoke do it in your car or outside or in your house.

praymojo420 · Post by **praymojo420** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 9:53 am

And how do you get addicted? It's not in the drinking water!

MTO · Post by **MTO** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 9:55 am

Try it out but and keep it outside. Hey in the end my side won so stop wasting your energy.

praymojo420 · Post by **praymojo420** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 9:58 am

Bah, I'll still stand by my opinion. And this won't stand long.

Though I must say, for being the wrong way to do it, this is a good blow to smoking.

MTO · Post by **MTO** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 10:16 am

Sure it will. It passed in Lincoln and many other cities around the country. What makes us any different? Clean air clean air clean air clean air

Big E · Post by **Big E** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 10:26 am

Do you have any idea how many people there are that started out as the "I only smoke at the bars when I'm drinking" demographic, and are now in the pack a day for 30 years category?

My bad analogy is just as relevant as your bad alcohol analogy (and every other BS anaolgy the pro-cancer crowd coughs up), but I at least acknowledged it as such. As I've said before, as soon as your drinking makes me drunk or ruins my liver, I'll be passing that petition around as well.

Too bad there's not a non-secondhand-smoke-producing tobacco product on the market... oh wait, but chew is dirty and the health effects are immediately apparent on the outside, so I won't do that one, but I'm totally OK with destroying others' insides with my second-hand smoke...

Smoking is incosiderate, selfish, dangerous, lethal behavior. Period. But as soon as smoking affects ONLY THE SMOKER, I shut up.

-Big E

MTO · Post by **MTO** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 10:32 am

You're"" pro smoking redirect is the most conceded argument I have ever seen. Are you that selfish about everything? Blindly defending your inner addict with total neglect for others.

DTO Luv · Post by **DTO Luv** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 11:02 am

SECOND HAND DRINKING.

You're not drinking but someone else is. If you're around them on the road they are likely to injure or kill you. The negative consequences of the drinker (crashing, killing, injury) are also felt by the second hand drinker who isn't drinking. Just like second-hand smokers don't smoke but are negatively affected by the smoker.

F*CKING GENIUS!!

MTO · Post by **MTO** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 11:06 am

DRINKING AND DRIVING IS ALREADY AGAINST THE LAW! What a stupid comparison!

Why do you smokers keep comparing this to other stuff? If you sit next to me at a bar and have a beer your not putting my health at risk. Or making me smell and burning my eyes.

DTO Luv · Post by **DTO Luv** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 11:08 am

Yes I am putting your health at risk by drinking. You could look at me the wrong way and that alcohol could tell me to break a bottle over your head.

MTO · Post by **MTO** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 11:13 am

D'Shawn that is called assault and yes that is against the law as well. See all this other stuff is against the law already and your not bitching about them. What is just one more health regulation gonna do? Other then to help protect the health of many many many people. Oh yeah and it will smell so much better in bars. I could decide to break a bat over your head.. we can do this all day.

HskrFanMike · Post by **HskrFanMike** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 11:20 am

Here's the solution. Make it legal to smoke anywhere you want to.

Make it illegal to emit any fumes.

Same practical effect, unless smokers start wearing scuba gear. And even then, since I won't be inhaling it, it's not my business.

Your right to smoke ends at my nose and mouth.

MTO · Post by **MTO** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 11:28 am

Hey I said it before. If they had bubbles over their heads and kept all that |expletive| from my cloths and lungs then smoke away.

MTO · Post by **MTO** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 11:31 am

It's unfair that you think you have every right to make my lung look like yours.

praymojo420 · Post by **praymojo420** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 11:43 am

Do you have any idea how many people there are that started out as the "I only smoke at the bars when I'm drinking" demographic, and are now in the pack a day for 30 years category?

Who cares? They picked up the cigarette. It's their fault.

My bad analogy is just as relevant as your bad alcohol analogy (and every other BS anaolgy the pro-cancer crowd coughs up), but I at least acknowledged it as such. As I've said before, as soon as your drinking makes me drunk or ruins my liver, I'll be passing that petition around as well.

You're waining from the point. I'm not 'pro-cancer'. I just think it's the discretion of whoever owns the bar(or whatever estabishment for that matter) what legal things go on in THEIR PLACE. Look man, if you don't like two poisons at once don't go to smoking bars.

Too bad there's not a non-secondhand-smoke-producing tobacco product on the market... oh wait, but chew is dirty and the health effects are immediately apparent on the outside, so I won't do that one, but I'm totally OK with destroying others' insides with my second-hand smoke...

Smoking is incosiderate, selfish, dangerous, lethal behavior. Period. But as soon as smoking affects ONLY THE SMOKER, I shut up

I'm not sure if this is a sidebar or part of your argument.

But yeah, tobacco is bad for you. Even smokers know that. But so are emisions coming from your car. You gonna stop driving so I don't breathe that in?

MTO · Post by **MTO** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 11:59 am

Actually every year the emission regulations get tuffer and tuffer. In fact diesel is about to be changed completely to eliminate the carcinogens it produces. So the government is already working on that.
And back to establishments doing what they want. THEY ALREADY CANT DO WHAT THEY WANT. Didn't you read what big e said? about all the regulations in place to benefit you in the first place. To help prevent you from getting ecoli etc.. I don't see you crying out saying that is too controlling to a business owner.

MTO · Post by **MTO** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 12:03 pm

Oh and we don't drive in bars like you wont be able to smoke in bars!

praymojo420 · Post by **praymojo420** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 12:08 pm

Because getting ecoli isn't a choice. You can't see that it's there. You can see smoke can you not?

But we do allow driving in cities.

MTO · Post by **MTO** » Fri Jun 23, 2006 12:18 pm

So driving in cities means its in doors?
What does not seeing ecoli mean? It is still deadly. Maybe we should have a totally unregulated place for you to go get AIDS and stuff at since you hate control so much.