The Crossroads (72 & Dodge)

[nebport5]

The weird mental hold I read too often is the "this is Omaha" complex. The "we're not good enough" for xyz nonsense. I can't think of much in terms of a retail development in Denver to envy, or even Chicago save Michigan Ave. (I'm not a disciple of the crappy Swedish furniture worship). Ita is right about Heritage and the city pushing the "crown jewel" notion but I'd argue the developer is as well. In the latter case, all the more justification for us to call b.s. And, true we may not care for the surface lots and overall design aesthetic but this could still turn out to be a relatively nice development. It should be an upgrade(hopefully)from the last version of Crossroads. Oracle, I hope you're right about the MoO space because Midtown Crossing needs help.

[Dusty]

I think when you have a parcel of land this large in the center of the city, it becomes crucial to get it right. We have been very critical of the design because of the potential ripple effect. It sets the tone for other projects in the area to follow.

While many of us are disappointed, it does have some good elements and has the potential to grow. If Nebraska Crossing can grow way beyond the original plan, so can Crossroads. If the surface lots were developed into more density it becomes closer to what we wanted all along.

I agree with dropping the "This is Omaha" complex. We are no longer a small city. We can be anything we want. We don't need to chase bigger cities. It's like we are an awkward teen growing into adulthood. Our identity is what we make of it.

[Athomsfere]

On the "we aren't City X, y, or z".

Great cities don't get there by accident. And there is no minimum nor maximum size. Madison get's so many mentions for how livable and awesome it is, despite being the size of, or close to, Lincoln. Portland, Amsterdam: Each isn't outside of where Omaha will likely be in the not so distant future. It would be a shame if we reached that point and looked more like KC or OKC.

[mrsticka]

When Crossroads was extended and renovated in the mid-to-late 80's, they should have extended the upper level above the original east-west wing. I edited a picture of the exterior of what Crossroads might have looked like had they done so along with a potential interior directory. I even created a hypothetical list of choices for the food court in both 1987 and today.

These things probably wouldn't have saved Crossroads from being demolished, but I still think it would've made sense to do it.

[Athomsfere]

FYI. Still seeing dirt moved around here. They had they big hoes, or back claws, or whatever moving dirt piles around last night.

[bbinks]

We need a new sub forum.

" Projects eventually built ".

[TransitOriented]

We need a new sub forum.

" Projects eventually built ".

I would prefer a chit-chat thread and a "just the facts ma'am" thread

[Brad]

We need a new sub forum.

" Projects eventually built ".

I would prefer a chit-chat thread and a "just the facts ma'am" thread

We had to to that with the Downtown Ballpark Thread... "Construction Only Thread" and "Discussion Only thread" because some of us were super tired of all the debate and just wanted to see construction updates...

[ita]

https://m.facebook.com/photo.php/?fbid=677761627686822

I can across this photo from MCL Construction's FB page. Tour for some budding architects, I think. Anyway, ok eof the stops was crossroads and looked here, I think this is an updated layout of the project. You can kind of zoom in to decipher the key.

[TransitOriented]

Just in case they are taken down

[ita]

Thanks for posting them. I didn't see that straight on shot last night. It kind of looks like the office building will have at least 10 stories, if that top list gives the number of floors in the third column. Also, the senior living building might also be 10. Based on the square footage of multifamily and senior living, they might have added 1-200 more units from the last update, which would be nice. Also, they added some buildings alongside Dodge on the west side and maybe pedestrian access from Dodge. Anyway, I see some positives with this recent render.

[NEDodger]

Thanks for posting them. I didn't see that straight on shot last night. It kind of looks like the office building will have at least 10 stories, if that top list gives the number of floors in the third column. Also, the senior living building might also be 10. Based on the square footage of multifamily and senior living, they might have added 1-200 more units from the last update, which would be nice. Also, they added some buildings alongside Dodge on the west side and maybe pedestrian access from Dodge. Anyway, I see some positives with this recent render.

Agree. Considering there was nothing you could do about the lot in front of Target, this map at least makes it look/feel like there is less surface lot for the development?

[Louie]

Thanks for posting them. I didn't see that straight on shot last night. It kind of looks like the office building will have at least 10 stories, if that top list gives the number of floors in the third column. Also, the senior living building might also be 10. Based on the square footage of multifamily and senior living, they might have added 1-200 more units from the last update, which would be nice. Also, they added some buildings alongside Dodge on the west side and maybe pedestrian access from Dodge. Anyway, I see some positives with this recent render.

Agree. Considering there was nothing you could do about the lot in front of Target, this map at least makes it look/feel like there is less surface lot for the development?

Having buildings front Dodge is a better visual for sure.

[nebport5]

Thanks for posting them. I didn't see that straight on shot last night. It kind of looks like the office building will have at least 10 stories, if that top list gives the number of floors in the third column. Also, the senior living building might also be 10. Based on the square footage of multifamily and senior living, they might have added 1-200 more units from the last update, which would be nice. Also, they added some buildings alongside Dodge on the west side and maybe pedestrian access from Dodge. Anyway, I see some positives with this recent render.

Agree. Considering there was nothing you could do about the lot in front of Target, this map at least makes it look/feel like there is less surface lot for the development?

The additional green space is a welcome sight. It's also nice how the parking is hidden on the western side adjacent to Dodge. It would be nice to see more of that on the eastern portion Target doesn't own. I suppose that could still be possible in due time.

[Brad]

[Brad]

Here is a zoom in on the site statistics.

20700-Crossroads colored site plan 2021-1227V7-1b.jpg

[Louie]

Some decent height on several buildings proposed…

[SpecificPacific]

Curious if there are future plans for the Target parking lot. Would love to some of that space reclaimed for building or even some more robust landscaping to soften that corner up a little bit. Especially considering the development of the library across the street.

Also hoping to see some imaginative ways to get across Dodge more safely. The library, the Swivel, and this development should be safely accessible to eat other. Maybe a sister to the Green Bridge at Memorial?

[ita]

Brad FTW. Haha, here I was trying to squint to figure out the details. 12 story office is nice. While I kind of hate that all the retail on the SW corner is one story, I am glad there is pedestrian entry from Dodge on that corner now.

[skip]

Curious if there are future plans for the Target parking lot. Would love to some of that space reclaimed for building or even some more robust landscaping to soften that corner up a little bit. Especially considering the development of the library across the street.

Also hoping to see some imaginative ways to get across Dodge more safely. The library, the Swivel, and this development should be safely accessible to eat other. Maybe a sister to the Green Bridge at Memorial?

Yep a pedestrian bridge across dodge and across 72nd would be huge and I’m hoping the city is considering this being built before the crossroads is completed.

[skip]

I am very pleased to see the amount of levels of residential units planned. My excitement has definitely increased for this project seeing the density and height it will bring to this intersection.

[Dusty]

I feel sorry for building 12. It's so tiny and all alone in the parking lot. LOL! They should just scrap that and leave that parking lot empty. Overall, this is a major improvement. The parking lots mapped out have great potential for infill developments in the future.

The biggest complaint from many of us was addressed. We all wanted buildings along Dodge Street to give it a fuller and denser feel from the street. I just wish they went with taller buildings here. if they build these one story buildings strong enough, could they add 2-4 stories to them later? I sure hope so!

I disagree with building a pedestrian bridge. We need to change the culture of drivers interacting with pedestrians and cyclists. We need safer intersections, not encouragement to drive like a speedway. I think getting the development done will be huge step forward. At that point, we can address the landscaping and street design in the area to enhance it to the next level.

[Garrett]

Am I wrong or isn’t this just the plan that’s been around for years? Some of the comments seem to be under the impression it’s a new thing

[S.O.Boy]

Am I wrong or isn’t this just the plan that’s been around for years? Some of the comments seem to be under the impression it’s a new thing

Remember some people get up in the morning and say "Since when did the sun rise in the East?"

[Brad]

Am I wrong or isn’t this just the plan that’s been around for years? Some of the comments seem to be under the impression it’s a new thing

Its been around since 12/2021, but Trenton checked this morning and its still the current plan.

[Athomsfere]

Also hoping to see some imaginative ways to get across Dodge more safely. The library, the Swivel, and this development should be safely accessible to eat other. Maybe a sister to the Green Bridge at Memorial?

I'm hoping for something more creative. As someone who can walk, a pedestrian bridge is OK. But pedestrian bridges are still car infrastructure. I'd prefer something even easier for those who have mobility issues.

[nebport5]

Am I wrong or isn’t this just the plan that’s been around for years? Some of the comments seem to be under the impression it’s a new thing

Its been around since 12/2021, but Trenton checked this morning and its still the current plan.

While not a new plan this new bird's eye view looks more optimistic vs the high angle rendering on the Crossroads site that emphasizes the surface lots. It's not uncommon on this site for opinions to alter with different renderings.

[Xxtro]

Is there a reason the two graphics from Grow Omaha's Twitter don't match? Building/Zone 7 & 10 are different.

[bldgengineer2015]

Is there a reason the two graphics from Grow Omaha's Twitter don't match? Building/Zone 7 & 10 are different.

One is a ground floor plan and the other is a second floor plan. The ground floor of those buildings have a larger footprint than the upper floors.

[OmahaRedWing]

The more residential the better. I think it's the key to the whole project and really helps the surrounding area as well, including the mass transit and new library.

[TitosBuritoBarn]

It's a little bizarre to me how it's a mix of mixed-use urban-ish buildings and traditional suburban. It's like the developer was sitting their drawing it out make it relatively dense, walkable, and connected, when they thought "well, we can't make this TOO good. Let's throw in some spots for fast food joints, mattress stores, and cell phone stores too, and orient them in a way that doesn't flow with the rest of the development and kind of works against it... yes, yes, there it is."

[Dusty]

It's a little bizarre to me how it's a mix of mixed-use urban-ish buildings and traditional suburban. It's like the developer was sitting their drawing it out make it relatively dense, walkable, and connected, when they thought "well, we can't make this TOO good. Let's throw in some spots for fast food joints, mattress stores, and cell phone stores too, and orient them in a way that doesn't flow with the rest of the development and kind of works against it... yes, yes, there it is."

I think that's why so many of us have been so vocal about getting it right. We don't want strip mall vibe in the front by Dodge.
BUT it has the potential to be a gateway leading into the complex if done right. The front section I would enclose the perimeter with buildings and make the center a courtyard/public space.

I tried to make a mock drawing. Please excuse my bad drawing. Also, recently visited Celebration Pointe in Gainesville, FL. They had a public space in the center with one story buildings surrounding it. It made me think of what this could be.

[Athomsfere]

It's a little bizarre to me how it's a mix of mixed-use urban-ish buildings and traditional suburban. It's like the developer was sitting their drawing it out make it relatively dense, walkable, and connected, when they thought "well, we can't make this TOO good. Let's throw in some spots for fast food joints, mattress stores, and cell phone stores too, and orient them in a way that doesn't flow with the rest of the development and kind of works against it... yes, yes, there it is."

I think that's why so many of us have been so vocal about getting it right. We don't want strip mall vibe in the front by Dodge.
BUT it has the potential to be a gateway leading into the complex if done right. The front section I would enclose the perimeter with buildings and make the center a courtyard/public space.

That, and the Heritage wants to call this area some some of "city center" and build the library across the street.

So if we can't fix that idea, getting this better would at least be some consolation.

At present, this, while a small improvement from Crossroads... Is still feeling a little like the waste of land we call Village Pointe.

[Dusty]

It's not the development I would have built. The plans are in motion at this point. I know I was critical of the plan, but there comes a point where we shift our energy on what tweaks can we do to enhance this. This is why I asked in a previous post if buildings 14-18 were structurally sound enough to add additional floors later. I doubt it, but it could change our perspective.

Let's say we can't make any changes to the current plan. Then what minor changes can we do to the remaining parking lots to make it better in the future? This is why I suggested filling in the front corner and add public space it. Add more aesthetics to it.

[Athomsfere]

I suspect not as well. And even if possible, its done so rarely anymore. I suspect we are mostly stuck with what gets built, with some hopeful infill later. Although, likely minor as well.

[iamjacobm]

I'd imagine the "boring" retail on Dodge gets the highest retail rent/SF in this development. Gotta pay the bills.

[TransitOriented]

It's not the development I would have built. The plans are in motion at this point. I know I was critical of the plan, but there comes a point where we shift our energy on what tweaks can we do to enhance this. This is why I asked in a previous post if buildings 14-18 were structurally sound enough to add additional floors later. I doubt it, but it could change our perspective.

Let's say we can't make any changes to the current plan. Then what minor changes can we do to the remaining parking lots to make it better in the future? This is why I suggested filling in the front corner and add public space it. Add more aesthetics to it.

There's nothing we can do. We don't own the development.
Have a bunch of people posting on a website ever brought change to a development in Omaha?

I know actual people speaking at meetings and doing protest marches have sparked change.

[ita]

It's not the development I would have built. The plans are in motion at this point. I know I was critical of the plan, but there comes a point where we shift our energy on what tweaks can we do to enhance this. This is why I asked in a previous post if buildings 14-18 were structurally sound enough to add additional floors later. I doubt it, but it could change our perspective.

Let's say we can't make any changes to the current plan. Then what minor changes can we do to the remaining parking lots to make it better in the future? This is why I suggested filling in the front corner and add public space it. Add more aesthetics to it.

There's nothing we can do. We don't own the development.
Have a bunch of people posting on a website ever brought change to a development in Omaha?

I know actual people speaking at meetings and doing protest marches have sparked change.

I've spoken at meetings and I don't think I've actually affected anything.

[Dusty]

It's not the development I would have built. The plans are in motion at this point. I know I was critical of the plan, but there comes a point where we shift our energy on what tweaks can we do to enhance this. This is why I asked in a previous post if buildings 14-18 were structurally sound enough to add additional floors later. I doubt it, but it could change our perspective.

Let's say we can't make any changes to the current plan. Then what minor changes can we do to the remaining parking lots to make it better in the future? This is why I suggested filling in the front corner and add public space it. Add more aesthetics to it.

There's nothing we can do. We don't own the development.
Have a bunch of people posting on a website ever brought change to a development in Omaha?

I know actual people speaking at meetings and doing protest marches have sparked change.

I will answer this playing both sides of the argument:

I agree...it definitely feels like the community is shut out from public engagement. It was evident from day 1 when Stothert took over. Engage Omaha was shut down immediately. The city runs on a "Good Ole Boy" network. If you are not in that circle, your comments don't matter. We tend to have many close door meetings and then a big reveal to the media. I get your frustration that none of this matters.

I disagree...I'ts important to speak up and share your ideas and feedback. You never know who is reading these forums. It could be an investor or developer looking for community insight. I'm fine with throwing out big and bold ideas. I don't care if people call them unrealistic and absurd. You never know what ideas stick and resonate with people. if you care about your community, then speak up even if you feel no one is listening or cares.

Suggestions for making real change:
Continue to network and share your ideas. That person next to you could be someone that matters and can inspire leaders with your ideas. Work with Omaha by Design to improve design standards. Change the criteria to match the city we want to build. If all else fails, then find a way to be part of that "good ole boy" network. Start a community based organization that talks about building a better city. Make the city more accountable with a good mission/agenda.

[GenX]

It’s also worth pointing out the plan includes lots of underground parking too. Kind of easy to miss in all the details.