Omaha Streetcar Discussion

[skinzfan23]

They have mentioned the start date a few times. Originally they were thinking fall/winter of 2026, but I think that they are going the more conservative route and also planning on Spring 2027 so they don't start service in the bad winter weather months and have to work out those kinks too.

[Garrett]

5 vehicles; is that 2 cars or 3?

They mention in the doc that they don't anticipate linking vehicles together unless another vehicle breaks down on the track and needs to be towed. So that's 6 independently functioning units that will look something like this.

ah ok, yea that's what i was wondering. I guess I should have said '2 or 3 sections' like, front/middle/back. Do they call each piece a car or what do they call them?

Ah yes, those would be modules. Usually in transit parlance, car implies a degree of independence, whereas modules are put together to create a single car. The Urbos3 that KC uses can actually be up to 9 modules long, as seen in Budapest.

[ita]

5 vehicles; is that 2 cars or 3?

They mention in the doc that they don't anticipate linking vehicles together unless another vehicle breaks down on the track and needs to be towed. So that's 6 independently functioning units that will look something like this.

ah ok, yea that's what i was wondering. I guess I should have said '2 or 3 sections' like, front/middle/back. Do they call each piece a car or what do they call them?

Ah yes, those would be modules. Usually in transit parlance, car implies a degree of independence, whereas modules are put together to create a single car. The Urbos3 that KC uses can actually be up to 9 modules long, as seen in Budapest.

Thanks for the clarification. On the Vehicle Specs sheet (https://www.cityofomaha.org/images/omah ... l-2023.pdf), it states vehicles/cars will consist of 2-5 modules.

[thenewguy]

indeed, thank you! I like the expandability of them. Seems like you could increase ridership relatively easily

[TransitOriented]

indeed, thank you! I like the expandability of them. Seems like you could increase ridership relatively easily

Potentially. Some cities just replace them with another system due to the original age of the carriages.

[Coyote]

Omaha streetcar service planned to open spring 2027



Before the Omaha streetcar can start running downtown, officials plan to test its stability with items like 50-gallon drums filled with water and sandbags. The Omaha Streetcar Authority president says passengers will be able to board after extensive testing. The opening is now scheduled for spring 2027.

For now, streetcar officials adopted their first operations and maintenance plan, which is a state-required document. "We needed to take this first step and adopt that plan so that everyone knows what their tasks will be going forward," Noddle said of different teams involved in the design process. The document details staff size, passenger load, and frequency of stops.

[strangerthings]

20-minute headways are atrocious. Weekends are multiples busier than week days on the KC Streetcar and I expect the same to happen in Omaha.

[Garrett]

20-minute headways are atrocious. Weekends are multiples busier than week days on the KC Streetcar and I expect the same to happen in Omaha.

Still a few years to adjust the schedule based on what we're seeing in other cities.

[thenewguy]

20-minute headways are atrocious. Weekends are multiples busier than week days on the KC Streetcar and I expect the same to happen in Omaha.

is it 20 minutes per train? Like, since there are going to be multiples running, does that mean that you would have an opportunity to board one every few minutes (though not the same exact train), or is it measured by how many minutes between a train stopping at a given stop?

[NEDodger]

20-minute headways are atrocious. Weekends are multiples busier than week days on the KC Streetcar and I expect the same to happen in Omaha.

is it 20 minutes per train? Like, since there are going to be multiples running, does that mean that you would have an opportunity to board one every few minutes (though not the same exact train), or is it measured by how many minutes between a train stopping at a given stop?

Train will come to a specific spot once every twenty minutes.

[TransitOriented]

20-minute headways are atrocious. Weekends are multiples busier than week days on the KC Streetcar and I expect the same to happen in Omaha.

Yeah, 20 minutes is pretty bad. Almost faster to walk, which I've definitely done before.

[Athomsfere]

20-minute headways are atrocious. Weekends are multiples busier than week days on the KC Streetcar and I expect the same to happen in Omaha.

Still a few years to adjust the schedule based on what we're seeing in other cities.

I think that's the practical, NA planner perspective wrought with compromise.

I'd love to see those headways come down, the EU/ Asian perspective of "if you build it" applies to lower headways too, IMO.

[Garrett]

20-minute headways are atrocious. Weekends are multiples busier than week days on the KC Streetcar and I expect the same to happen in Omaha.

Still a few years to adjust the schedule based on what we're seeing in other cities.

I think that's the practical, NA planner perspective wrought with compromise.

I'd love to see those headways come down, the EU/ Asian perspective of "if you build it" applies to lower headways too, IMO.

Right, I agree. I'm saying transit has changed drastically even in the time since the streetcar was first announced, and there have already been changes to the operating schedule. Having 10 minute headways on the weekend from 12-7 to begin with is a huge step forward and I think has a higher frequency than any peer system, including KC which does 12-18 on the weekend and shuts down at 1 am. I would hope for better schedules before the line even opens with good advocacy work. We still have about 3.5 years to push for good changes just based on our own experiences and the data we are seeing from peer systems.

heck, I think the time is also ripe right now to try to push for transit only lanes along the line. KC is already pushing for it, and Omaha is constantly pointing to them as a model.

Edit: That said, I don't think a late night 20 minute headway is terrible. If you're say, at a bar with some friends in Blackstone and you're ready to ride the streetcar home to the Old Market, or somewhere else downtown, you can simply check your phone to look at the schedule and just wait for a few more minutes inside if you need to. I've spent longer times waiting for ubers in Omaha than a 20 minute headway.

[skinzfan23]

I know that we have already discussed this but people on the Facebook comments don't understand (or care to understand) how things work. They are all complaining about their taxes getting raised to fund the streetcar that "no one" is going to use.

If they actually did a little research, the organization and city has stated very clearly how it will be funded.

[Coyote]

Omaha streetcar route work beginning this week



The Omaha streetcar project is set to get underway this week, with utility work scheduled to start along the planned route.

[TransitOriented]

That said, I don't think a late night 20 minute headway is terrible. If you're say, at a bar with some friends in Blackstone and you're ready to ride the streetcar home to the Old Market, or somewhere else downtown, you can simply check your phone to look at the schedule and just wait for a few more minutes inside if you need to. I've spent longer times waiting for ubers in Omaha than a 20 minute headway.

Unless the car is full, and now you have to wait 20 more minutes.

[Garrett]

That said, I don't think a late night 20 minute headway is terrible. If you're say, at a bar with some friends in Blackstone and you're ready to ride the streetcar home to the Old Market, or somewhere else downtown, you can simply check your phone to look at the schedule and just wait for a few more minutes inside if you need to. I've spent longer times waiting for ubers in Omaha than a 20 minute headway.

Unless the car is full, and now you have to wait 20 more minutes.

I cannot foresee a full car past midnight. I take the subway at 2 am a lot, and even with 20 minute headways, cars are basically empty.

[halgy]

That said, I don't think a late night 20 minute headway is terrible. If you're say, at a bar with some friends in Blackstone and you're ready to ride the streetcar home to the Old Market, or somewhere else downtown, you can simply check your phone to look at the schedule and just wait for a few more minutes inside if you need to. I've spent longer times waiting for ubers in Omaha than a 20 minute headway.

Unless the car is full, and now you have to wait 20 more minutes.

If the car is full at 10pm, I believe that is an unequivocal success for the system. I think the streetcar will be pretty popular, but that would be outstanding. And it would be (relatively) simple to keep the 10-minute headways going later if riders are demanding it.

Regardless, a 20 minute wait (which is really a 10 minute wait on average) will be perfectly workable. I find it unlikely that dealing with parking would be faster or easier (though I do hate parking in Blackstone).

[TransitOriented]

Totally read the chart wrong. I'm okay with 10 min headway during the day.

[Coyote]

Omaha Streetcar Authority took another step toward a future streetcar



The Omaha Streetcar Authority took another step toward a future streetcar in downtown Omaha on Monday. It approved a resolution for an initial version of the Operations and Maintenance plan. The document is intended to include details like how many cars there will be, staffing, the schedule, the route and even the stops and the desired frequency.

[Renovator2559]

I know that we have already discussed this but people on the Facebook comments don't understand (or care to understand) how things work. They are all complaining about their taxes getting raised to fund the streetcar that "no one" is going to use.

If they actually did a little research, the organization and city has stated very clearly how it will be funded.

It takes time to unbrainwash the public, after being brainwashed (via ads, propaganda) and nudged by Big Auto for decades and Big Auto taking control of public transport, making it inferior on purpose, dismantling the electric streetcar networks; so they could sell more cars.
Only through time, will people get accustomed to the idea that streetcars are not a new idea, were part of tradition and the streetcars are a way to return to the time when cities were truly vibrant, economically viable.

On a sidenote, they have pushed back the opening date of the streetcar to the spring of 2017; due to testing with sandbags, water containers to simulate passengers. Haven't streetcars been tested in so many cities for decades, to warrant additional testing for months in testing? Is it really necessary to test for many months?

[Athomsfere]

It only makes sense to me. A final round of QA on materials and construction that can also identify where any variables causes unexpected behaviors when fully loaded.

Engineering, experience, and simulations are great. Nothing beats the real world though.

[ita]

Engineering, experience, and simulations are great. Nothing beats the real world though.

It's true; watched it play out in the 2016 film Sully when I viewed it for the first time a couple weeks ago.

[Garrett]

It only makes sense to me. A final round of QA on materials and construction that can also identify where any variables causes unexpected behaviors when fully loaded.

Engineering, experience, and simulations are great. Nothing beats the real world though.

Yep, gotta account for a bunch of different possibilities of things people could bring on the streetcar, and how they end up handling around turns and hills. The operators will need training too of course.

[Athomsfere]

Yep, gotta account for a bunch of different possibilities of things people could bring on the streetcar, and how they end up handling around turns and hills. The operators will need training too of course.

Thanks on that point on training. I thought about throwing in that too, but I really wasn't sure how much that played into it.

[Renovator2559]

This is the brutal truth of it all. And it doesn't even mention the insane lobbying that the big 3 pushed to reduce trains and make roads even more necessary.

Not only that, most of the big 3 American car companies (except F150, good truck) are made to break down often and are in the profit of continual service repairs. Its sad how many times these companies have turned the back to the American public in many insidious ways, including tax payers bailing out General Motors and Chrysler...

That's why I like Lexus' and even Toyota and Honda, which create reliable cars that are dependable and are made by engineers that care about the customer over stakeholders.

Its called planned obsolesence. Back when the light bulb came out, they would last a really long time (think of that famous old light bulb in the fire station). That was a problem for the company since they were selling less and less of them. Then they came up with the idea that the bulb should only last about 1000 hours, and required anyone using their patent to produce bulbs this way.

Planned obsolescence is just an excuse to make products inferior, so that people constantly discard and buy the next thing because of its short lifespan. How much waste ends up in the landfills due to the disposable mindset? Most American cars tend to break much more than Japanese cars.
We need to do our part in not creating unnessary waste and not polluting the environment by building products that last as in the past, if we care of the environment.

However, when a product is more advanced in features, that's an exception, of course buying makes sense.

Funding the streetcar and public transportation is a means to reduce our carbon footprint and have cleaner air. Also its important to remember the history as to why many people oppose of the streetcar and how we got to where we are in the big 3 auto, taking control of the streetcar networks in the past, only to dismantle them.

[skinzfan23]

Omaha's $440 million streetcar project kicks off with digging, lane closures on Farnam

Rowser said construction on the streetcar lines could start in the spring. During the next six weeks of work, he said drivers can expect temporary road closures and detours.

[almighty_tuna]

[ita]

Omaha's $440 million streetcar project kicks off with digging, lane closures on Farnam

Rowser said construction on the streetcar lines could start in the spring. During the next six weeks of work, he said drivers can expect temporary road closures and detours.

Rowser said construction on the streetcar lines could start in the spring. During the next six weeks of work, he said drivers can expect temporary road closures and detours.

[Louie]

I did see partial street closure yesterday on the stretch indicated in Step 1, so it's legit happening!

[Dusty]

On the KC streetcar thread we were talking about their expansion having protected ROW lane. Hopefully, we will build ours so we can upgrade to a dedicated lane one day. One thought....what if we painted the streetcar lane a color like red. It would create a false sense of dedicated without the barrier. Maybe cars would be more cautious jumping in that lane knowing the streetcar uses it. Any thoughts?

[strangerthings]

On the KC streetcar thread we were talking about their expansion having protected ROW lane. Hopefully, we will build ours so we can upgrade to a dedicated lane one day. One thought....what if we painted the streetcar lane a color like red. It would create a false sense of dedicated without the barrier. Maybe cars would be more cautious jumping in that lane knowing the streetcar uses it. Any thoughts?

Don't paint, pour colored concrete. KC is pouring red concrete at Crosswalks.

[Dusty]

On the KC streetcar thread we were talking about their expansion having protected ROW lane. Hopefully, we will build ours so we can upgrade to a dedicated lane one day. One thought....what if we painted the streetcar lane a color like red. It would create a false sense of dedicated without the barrier. Maybe cars would be more cautious jumping in that lane knowing the streetcar uses it. Any thoughts?

Don't paint, pour colored concrete. KC is pouring red concrete at Crosswalks.

Yes, in an ideal world we would use colored concrete from the get go when installing the rails. My point was asking if having a"red" lane would help reduce collisions since it will be shared lane for now. Maybe in time we can upgrade the streetcar line to be protected and separate from car traffic.

[Athomsfere]

On the KC streetcar thread we were talking about their expansion having protected ROW lane. Hopefully, we will build ours so we can upgrade to a dedicated lane one day. One thought....what if we painted the streetcar lane a color like red. It would create a false sense of dedicated without the barrier. Maybe cars would be more cautious jumping in that lane knowing the streetcar uses it. Any thoughts?

Don't paint, pour colored concrete. KC is pouring red concrete at Crosswalks.

And make them continuous sidewalks!!! Please!

[MetcalfeHarrison]

I wouldn't expect much extra stuff outside of what is necessary to get the tracks installed at this point. The rumblings I've heard out of the Public Works people I know make it seem like the first round of pricing came in pretty high and they are trying to streamline the design. It sounds like they can get there but some of the bells and whistles they were hoping for might get cut out for now.

[Louie]

I wouldn't expect much extra stuff outside of what is necessary to get the tracks installed at this point. The rumblings I've heard out of the Public Works people I know make it seem like the first round of pricing came in pretty high and they are trying to streamline the design. It sounds like they can get there but some of the bells and whistles they were hoping for might get cut out for now.

Any idea what would fall under bells and whistles?

[MetcalfeHarrison]

I wouldn't expect much extra stuff outside of what is necessary to get the tracks installed at this point. The rumblings I've heard out of the Public Works people I know make it seem like the first round of pricing came in pretty high and they are trying to streamline the design. It sounds like they can get there but some of the bells and whistles they were hoping for might get cut out for now.

Any idea what would fall under bells and whistles?

I haven't asked but I'm assuming things like streetscape and maybe simplifying stop designs. There may have to be money that comes from other places to try to beautify the route.

[TransitOriented]

On the KC streetcar thread we were talking about their expansion having protected ROW lane. Hopefully, we will build ours so we can upgrade to a dedicated lane one day. One thought....what if we painted the streetcar lane a color like red. It would create a false sense of dedicated without the barrier. Maybe cars would be more cautious jumping in that lane knowing the streetcar uses it. Any thoughts?

You can read more about them here : https://nacto.org/publication/urban-bik ... -guidance/

[thenewguy]

https://www.ketv.com/article/omaha-mayo ... l/45419821

some people...

[Dusty]

There is a term for people who reject any and every project because of fear of change.

BANANA- Build Absolutely Nothing Anywhere Near Anything