Crossroads Mall Discussion

joeglow · Post by **joeglow** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 9:33 am

Brad wrote: Crossroads Has 3 Major Tenants, Dillard's, Sears, and Target
Crossroads still Has Old Navy, Gap, Barns an Nobel
Crossroads Has A Parking Structure the other Malls Dream of
Crossroads Has High Visibility at a Major intersection.
Crossroads is more accessible than any other mall.

-Then, why has it continued it's downward trend in occupancy? I do not WANT to see this happen. However, ignoring the trends will NOT stop it from happening. I agree that these are GREAT things about the mall. I love the parking garage and always park there. However, there are issues that should be addressed:

1. If the parking garage is such an attraction, why the whole North end of the mall essentially dead?
2. Given they have probably the most visible location in town, why is it 40-50% empty?

I would think most rational people who also agree that these types of questions should be addressed on a board about economic development.

Post by **Brad** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 9:41 am

Honestly, I think its poor management.

They need to attract some more retailers, the right kind of retailers, that will draw people in. The Pimp Store and the Goth store drive people away. Sometimes its better to turn down a possible tenant than bring in one that almost scares people. I saw a bunch of goth kids in there once and a little kid goes... "mommy look at that monster". With that said, make some deals to attract the right kind of shops to the mall, then go on a big public relations campaign and bring the people back. The mall is a little down right now, but with the right management it can get better.

joeglow · Post by **joeglow** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 9:48 am

Brad wrote:Honestly, I think its poor management.

They need to attract some more retailers, the right kind of retailers, that will draw people in. The Pimp Store and the Goth store drive people away. Sometimes its better to turn down a possible tenant than bring in one that almost scares people. I saw a bunch of goth kids in there once and a little kid goes... "mommy look at that monster". With that said, make some deals to attract the right kind of shops to the mall, then go on a big public relations campaign and bring the people back. The mall is a little down right now, but with the right management it can get better.

Thank you for the honest answer. Is that really all that different from when I said, IN THIS THREAD?:

"What I would like to see is Simon find a big name chain restaurant (ideally, it would have been Cheesecake Factory). Tell them they will convert a few of the stores (all the empty ones by the North walkway to the parking garage) on SIMON's dime. Then, get the restaurant to sign a long term lease and give them a STEEP discount for the first half of the lease.

If they get something like a Cheesecake Factory IN the mall, they will have guaranteed shoppers almost nightly who are waiting to eat there. This would then give some stores a reason to open up there.

Essentially, the mall needs momentum one way or the other. Right now, that momentum is VERY negative. Each shop closing brings fewer people to the mall, hurting the other stores, causing some of them to close.

Investing in something like this would bring people in and hopefully add a shop or 2, which would further increase demand for more businesses, etc."

Post by **Brad** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 10:01 am

joeglow wrote:Thank you for the honest answer. Is that really all that different from when I said, IN THIS THREAD?:

What set me off to post in this thread was this comment:

Target is going to do NOTHING to save the mall. Other steps need to be taken if we are to see this mall thrive once again.

While other steps need to be taken.

Target, is good for the mall, but it is only one pice of the puzzle.

joeglow · Post by **joeglow** » Fri Dec 22, 2006 10:16 am

Brad wrote:
joeglow wrote:Thank you for the honest answer. Is that really all that different from when I said, IN THIS THREAD?:
What set me off to post in this thread was this comment:

Target is going to do NOTHING to save the mall. Other steps need to be taken if we are to see this mall thrive once again.
While other steps need to be taken.

Target, is good for the mall, but it is only one pice of the puzzle.

Which is fine. We can agree to disagree. I like the additional traffic Target brings to the mall. My only concern is they (much like other retailers like Walmart, Shopko, etc.) almost offer too much. For example, most malls still have movie and music shops. Obviously, these are threatened, as a whole, because of new technology and mediums for delivering them. However, a discount retailer in the mall offering the same product for 20-25% less is going to hurt them even more.

As a whole, I do agree with you that a Target there is better than nothing. I am just worried about the idea of a store like Target selling so many different types of items (clothes, food, electronics, toys, music, movies, decorations, greeting cards, etc., etc., etc.) that it will make it difficult for niche store (the bread and butter of most malls) to compete.

Asten · Post by **Asten** » Sat Dec 23, 2006 11:49 pm

joeglow wrote:Which is fine. We can agree to disagree. I like the additional traffic Target brings to the mall. My only concern is they (much like other retailers like Walmart, Shopko, etc.) almost offer too much. For example, most malls still have movie and music shops. Obviously, these are threatened, as a whole, because of new technology and mediums for delivering them. However, a discount retailer in the mall offering the same product for 20-25% less is going to hurt them even more.

As a whole, I do agree with you that a Target there is better than nothing. I am just worried about the idea of a store like Target selling so many different types of items (clothes, food, electronics, toys, music, movies, decorations, greeting cards, etc., etc., etc.) that it will make it difficult for niche store (the bread and butter of most malls) to compete.

Interestingly in two towns I have relatives in... Scottsbluff and Casper, WY. Both have malls with Target as an anchor store.

Admittedly, they each only really have one mall, but commenting on variety of stores being hurt by having target as an anchor - I don't think that's necessarily true.

Post by **Brad** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 9:14 pm

Story comming up on KPTM Fox 42 news at 9 about Crossroad's future!

Post by **Brad** » Mon Jan 22, 2007 9:19 pm

2 More stores closed today, A clothing Store, which is moving to another local mall and Hallmark.

Simon said they are not worried and they are exploring other avenues other than shopping like retail...

Stargazer · Post by **Stargazer** » Tue Jan 23, 2007 5:02 am

My wife and I went to Crossroads for the first time in ages over the weekend (to go to Dillards) It appears to me that Simon is virtually giving up on the mall. We found it rather intimidating, walking through the parking garage, which had only about 1 in 8 lights working... it was incredibly dark. Inside, the mall itself appears relatively clean and updated. As for the new Target, we weren't too impressed.

I find it astonishing that this location cannot be successful (when you look at the success of all of the other businesses in the immediate area)... I mean what IS the population of Omaha east of 72nd alone? I can't help but feel that this is less about demographics and more about the failure of a property owner.

OPlaya · Post by **OPlaya** » Tue Jan 23, 2007 12:59 pm

I agree Simon has let the mall go to heck. I think that if General Growth or someone else were to come in and do a major transformation of the mall as well as convince Sears to update in exterior to the store by doing more then just putting up new signs every few decades it would do alot for the mall.

Post by **Brad** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 2:56 am

Dillard's changing one store in Omaha

http://www.omaha.com/index.php?u_page=1 ... d=10219541

The Dillard's store at Crossroads Mall will become one of nine Dillard's Clearance Centers nationwide, with the transition beginning next month, a spokeswoman for the Arkansas-based chain said Friday.

Julie Bull of Dillard's said managers at the Crossroads store were notified of the change Friday.

As a Dillard's Clearance Center, it will carry lower-priced and sale merchandise and receive clearance items from other stores the company operates in the area, Bull said.

Asked if the move was an attempt to differentiate among the stores at Crossroads, Oak View and Mall of the Bluffs, Bull said that Crossroads just seemed like "a good place for Dillard's to operate a clearance center."

Clearance centers have been well-received in other cities, Bull said.

"It will provide Omaha with some shopping excitement."

Some clearance items will appear in January, but the transition probably will not be complete until spring, Bull said.

The local manager of Crossroads was out of the office Friday and unavailable for comment. A spokeswoman for Simon Property Group of Indianapolis, which owns Crossroads, referred questions to Dillard's.

Coyote · Post by **Coyote** » Sat Dec 29, 2007 8:26 am

Clearance centers have been well-received in other cities, Bull said.

Yeah - remember how the JC Penny outlet was received at the Southroads. Is this finally the death nail?

NDizona · Post by **NDizona** » Sun Dec 30, 2007 3:18 pm

Yeah - remember how the JC Penny outlet was received at the Southroads. Is this finally the death nail?

Xroads has about 30X the traffic - The mall failed because the traffic moved after the road changed. You can't possibly compare one of the top intersections in the metro to a bypassed street. In fact - 13th Street/Fort Crook is a joke because of Kennedy as well...but the area desperately needed a highway.

The biggest problem they face is the image of being the ghetto mall...for which it has earned.

apples

oranges

Coyote · Post by **Coyote** » Sun Dec 30, 2007 3:46 pm

My comments were geared more towards the acceptance of outlet malls. Going from a JC Penny to an outlet - going from a Dillards to an outlet changes your clientele and the opinions others have. It is easier to draw new establishments around Macy's than it is to TJ Maxx.

On last Saturday's Grow Omaha show Jeff Beals said he thought 5 years ago that the Crossroads would have changed in 5 years. He still thinks it will change in 5 years. The Target and parking garage are valuable resources that would stay, but he could see the rest changed into a village lifestyle center.

Big E · Post by **Big E** » Sun Dec 30, 2007 7:48 pm

Coyote wrote:village lifestyle center

Fancy term for "mall".

The only difference between Village Point and Crossroads is the amount of money the people spend there.

-Big E

Coyote · Post by **Coyote** » Sun Dec 30, 2007 7:55 pm

Big E wrote:Fancy term for "mall".

The only difference between Village Point and Crossroads is the amount of money the people spend there.

Outdoor Mall if you please.

Desirable location? With a MAT hub at Xrds I have been approached by transients for an alternative. Traffic volume - yes. Would I as a former Heavenly Acres resident go to XR or VP - you know where I would go.

Here you go - Has the XR become the GLM of MTO? Just a thought.

thenewguy · Post by **thenewguy** » Sun Dec 30, 2007 8:22 pm

we were at NFM today and decided to get a bite to eat; on our way down dodge, we noticed how shotty and dilapidated the area seems. The old bag 'n save, the terrible parking lot surfaces, unattractive store fronts, etc. I don't necessarily think that it should be torn down, but it definately needs work. For being at the corner of one of the busiest intersections of Omaha, a lot of people pass it by. Maybe a nice make-over, some big name stores coming back in, idk? I mean, i'd remodel the exterior of sears, tear down bag 'n save, resurface the lot, etc. That would do a lot...

NDizona · Post by **NDizona** » Mon Dec 31, 2007 12:59 am

Coyote wrote:My comments were geared more towards the acceptance of outlet malls. Going from a JC Penny to an outlet - going from a Dillards to an outlet changes your clientele and the opinions others have. It is easier to draw new establishments around Macy's than it is to TJ Maxx.

On last Saturday's Grow Omaha show Jeff Beals said he thought 5 years ago that the Crossroads would have changed in 5 years. He still thinks it will change in 5 years. The Target and parking garage are valuable resources that would stay, but he could see the rest changed into a village lifestyle center.

You miss the point - nothing could save Southroads.

Variables cannot be determined unless there is a constant - and there is no constant between Crossroads and Southroads. They are total opposites.

Crossroads is located on one of the busiest intersections in Omaha - Southroads is located on a bypassed street. Saying anything that failed in Southroads was the cause of the mall's demise is short sighted. Southroads failed because of traffic and access - and had nothing to do with any one tenant.

Crossroads will fail because it has become a ghetto mall (perception is reality to customers)

It may survive a while longer but my guess is in 20 years it will be one giant Starbuck's....

I hate beating up retail when they are down - truth is the entire industry is down - its just that the crappiest malls suffer the most because they are the worst...

As for Jeff Beals - he knows more than I do. But he doesn't seem to understand what really is happening to this mall. This mall is thug central...and its been that way for a long time - and really what has been done to stop it?

thenewguy · Post by **thenewguy** » Mon Dec 31, 2007 8:29 am

I know that I, personally, don't shop there only because there just aren't many/any good stores. I'm not much of the mall going type anyway, but if i want to get something, and I'm over in Omaha, i just drive down the road to west roads. They have a much better food court, better restaurants surrounding it and it doesn't seem like no one gives a |expletive| about it. there just seems to be a lack of worth-while shopping, and an over-abundance of shifty characters there.

NDizona · Post by **NDizona** » Mon Dec 31, 2007 12:50 pm

Omababe wrote:
(I would think that a savvy management team would lease that space at below market to keep the occupancy up and the cash flowing, but I'm not in that business so I don't really know.) Anyway ...

Having dealt with commercial property for about a decade now - this is probably the most misunderstood concept that the general public has regarding real estate. I feel like its my duty to inform the public - and so I shall.

Generally speaking - when valuing property in the fee simple (meaning the property with all inherent rights free of liens and leases and anything else that might infringe on your ability to enjoy the property) it is better to have a building that is vacant than one that is leased under market. If it sits vacant for a number of years - chances are the market has changed the property is worth less. (not worthless but worth less than it did before the market went south)

to quantify - lets say you have a space that is worth $100 per month but you lease it out at $70 per month (5 year contract)

5x12x70=$4,200

Next - lets say you spend a year to find the right tenant for $95 per month

4x12x95=$4,560

That is the basis for a property becoming less valuable to a potential buyer and to the owner once they secure below market leases. There is no worse way to destroy property values than to secure below market leases. Potential buyers of your property will demand a discount because of the lower rent.

This is actually much more complex...but we will save that discussion for a rainy day.

Happy New Years

Bob from Omaha · Post by **Bob from Omaha** » Mon Dec 31, 2007 5:52 pm

We were at Crossroads on Sunday, 12/30. Two things struck me.

One, you have stores like Old Navy, Victorias Secret, Chilis, Dillards, Sears, Barnes & Noble, Target, Etc. Some pretty good mall stores. They should bring traffic. You have a location at 72md & Dodge.

You have the entire upstairs on the Dillards wing vacant, along with a ton of empty space on the main level. You have some pretty marginal independent stores in other spaces.

I have to put a large portion of the blame on Melvin Simon for the empty space, but not all of it. There is huge competition from the new malls and new developments. A cursory look at the Simon web site tells you that they have some pretty successful malls, so they do know how to market and attract stores. I just dont know what they want from this mall.

It is very confusing.

Big E · Post by **Big E** » Mon Dec 31, 2007 6:42 pm

Coyote wrote:Desirable location? With a MAT hub at Xrds I have been approached by transients for an alternative. Traffic volume - yes. Would I as a former Heavenly Acres resident go to XR or VP - you know where I would go.

Here you go - Has the XR become the GLM of MTO? Just a thought.

What's a short way to spell "acronym"?

What's another word for Thesaurus?

How come there's no mention of the dinosaurs in the Bible?

-Big E

joeglow · Post by **joeglow** » Tue Jan 01, 2008 10:09 pm

Bob from Omaha wrote: I have to put a large portion of the blame on Melvin Simon for the empty space, but not all of it. There is huge competition from the new malls and new developments. A cursory look at the Simon web site tells you that they have some pretty successful malls, so they do know how to market and attract stores. I just dont know what they want from this mall.

It is very confusing.

-Crossroads has a bad image of being a gang mall (true or not, it does not matter). It has had this image for 15-20 years, so it is pretty well instilled in people's minds. I think MANY of those with money around Crossroads (Regency, Mid-town, etc.) would rather just spend the extra 5 minutes and go 3 miles to Westroads. While it is a GREAT location, it has been fully cannibalized by Westroads. I can honestly say I don't know what could succeed there, because as someone else pointed out, there is already a lot of vacant buildings around there.

NDizona · Post by **NDizona** » Wed Jan 02, 2008 12:52 am

-Crossroads has a bad image of being a gang mall (true or not, it does not matter). It has had this image for 15-20 years, so it is pretty well instilled in people's minds. I think MANY of those with money around Crossroads (Regency, Mid-town, etc.) would rather just spend the extra 5 minutes and go 3 miles to Westroads. While it is a GREAT location, it has been fully cannibalized by Westroads. I can honestly say I don't know what could succeed there, because as someone else pointed out, there is already a lot of vacant buildings around there.

Problem is - its older, closer to the lower income homes than to the middle to upper income neighborhoods, and is not differentiated to deal with its demographics. They are still trying to get the same customers as Westroads when they should be focusing on the lower income customers.

There is an example in Atlanta where an older mall was transformed into a Mexican flavor mall that resembled more of a antique mall. I am not saying its time for that but its time for them to come to grips that their current plan is failing...miserably.

Maverick · Post by **Maverick** » Wed Jan 02, 2008 4:50 pm

Interesting article on a similar topic to the in the Economist, which I usually find to be a pretty good periodical.

Birth, death and shopping
The rise and fall of the shopping mall

http://www.economist.com/world/na/displ ... A6C73FEEDA

Post by **Omaha Cowboy** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 5:29 am

Omaha Cowboy wrote:All I'll say is Crossroads continues to survive 16 months after this cantankerous thread was created..

I still bet on mall survival..And for the same reasons I outlined here 16 months ago..

..Ciao..LiO....Peace

Make that 29 months now..And counting..

..Ciao..LiO....Peace

joeglow · Post by **joeglow** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 7:43 am

Omaha Cowboy wrote:
Omaha Cowboy wrote:All I'll say is Crossroads continues to survive 16 months after this cantankerous thread was created..

I still bet on mall survival..And for the same reasons I outlined here 16 months ago..

..Ciao..LiO....Peace
Make that 29 months now..And counting..

..Ciao..LiO....Peace

You could say the same thing for Southroads or the Center Mall, as there are still some shops there. I would hardly call those great examples of mall that "continue to survive."

joeglow · Post by **joeglow** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 7:45 am

Maverick wrote:Interesting article on a similar topic to the in the Economist, which I usually find to be a pretty good periodical.

Birth, death and shopping
The rise and fall of the shopping mall
http://www.economist.com/world/na/displ ... A6C73FEEDA

-Very good read. It is interesting to see what they lay out happen exactly to the Southroads and Crossroads. However, I am surprised to read that so few, in any, new indoor malls are going up anywhere in the country. I enjoy the indoor malls MUCH more than the Village Point's of the world.

Post by **Brad** » Sat Jan 05, 2008 3:30 am

joeglow wrote:I enjoy the indoor malls MUCH more than the Village Point's of the world.

Really... I mean it was all of +5 degrees the other day. I really don't see the point of the outdoor mall except that lazy people can park closer to the door.

MTO · Post by **MTO** » Sat Jan 05, 2008 11:25 am

Only reason I can see is they are trying to copy places like the old market and mag mile...

Uffda · Post by **Uffda** » Sun Jan 06, 2008 12:06 am

I really don't see the point of the outdoor mall except that lazy people can park closer to the door.

I think when i have been at VP I have had to park as far from the stores as I would when I go to Westroads or Oakview. Although you can park on the main street at VP --- there aren't a lot of spots. I like VP --- it is something different compared to the indoor malls.

NDizona · Post by **NDizona** » Sun Jan 06, 2008 1:50 am

My wife says she likes the flowers - so thats worth the markup...pretty flowers...

Honestly - considering the rent those tenants pay - Im amazed some of the businesses stay afloat.

hockeyfan · Post by **hockeyfan** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 10:01 am

I don't think that anything can save the Crossroads. Their best bet would be to tear it down, and build some bigger free standing stores. Don't make it like a VP just a big box shopping center.Leave Target, maybe add a Gordmans, tear down the Best Buy / Bag and Save building and let Best Buy build a free standing store. Sears, Barnes and Noble and even Dillards could stay if they want. As long as the demo company doesn't pull a Frankie Pane's on them. :;):

NDizona · Post by **NDizona** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 11:33 am

tearing down the Xroads will cost alot more than you might think. This isn't like imploding a high rise building downtown - we are talking about millions - it could cost $15-25/SF just to get it ready for new construction.

Office space!

im drinking the koolaid!

cdub · Post by **cdub** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 3:39 pm

Not like VP? Just build freestanding stores? Where have you been, we don't like that anymore... Aside from the fact that it just isn't taking best advantage of the location. Go build that |expletive| on cornfields in Kearny

Linkin5 · Post by **Linkin5** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 3:51 pm

Tear down Crossroads, build a sports/health destination with a pool, ice rink, indoor tennis, and wellness center. Compensate the lost retail space by building a new shopping destination in North Downtown by the new Baseball Stadium and pedestrian bridge. :)

Post by **Brad** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 3:59 pm

You know with 2 acres available from family fun center being for sale, and crossroads in the tank, we are almost 1/2 way to this omaha by design concept:

Big E · Post by **Big E** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 4:08 pm

Brad wrote:You know with 2 acres available from family fun center being for sale, and crossroads in the tank, we are almost 1/2 way to this omaha by design concept:

Anyone here familiar with Towson, MD? That design always reminds me of that.

See, THIS is the type of development (along with the Leytham 'Hood, etc.) that should be happening all over, and connected as light rail stops, with big ol' density incentives. You can still have your nasty-|expletive| sprawlboxes in between, but you can pay for your own infrastructure.

-Big E

thenewguy · Post by **thenewguy** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 6:31 pm

That's pretty sweet looking. I don't know whether that would ever happen or not, but then again a few years ago no one thought Aksarben or the MoFo development (i had to say that at least once :P ) would be around either. I wonder how tall the buildings would be? I wonder if they'd be offices or condos? Where can i read more about it...or do you have details of this concept off the top of your head? I'm not familiar with it.

Post by **Brad** » Tue Jan 22, 2008 11:07 pm

thenewguy wrote:Where can i read more about it...or do you have details of this concept off the top of your head? I'm not familiar with it.

Have fun reading the Omaha by Design Manual, 71 Pages(lots of pictures)

http://www.omahabydesign.org/Urban_Desi ... lement.pdf