Rumors - Soccer Stadium - Large Office - Parking Garage

[omaha79]

The best soccer stadiums are intimate with seats close to the field. Kansas City's MSL team did not draw well when they played in Arrowhead but fill their soccer stadium. I would like to see a 8,000 seat stadium that is designed to be expanded with an additional 10-12,000 seats in the future

It was a long journey for the Kansas City Wizards/Sporting KC. They did a great job rebranding. They started to push to ingratiate themselves to those on the Kansas side when they moved out to the Legends area and built a tight knit group, but they still weren't drawing well. Many forget, they spent several seasons playing at the KC T-Bones ballpark in a situation very similar to what Union Omaha has now. They almost lost the team, actually. But, they got the stadium built, and it's fantastic. And, they totally rebranded from Wizards to Sporting, in part to look more like a real soccer team, but also in part to get rid of the minor league feel they had as the Wizards playing in empty ballparks and football stadiums.

To stir the pot on multiple issues...

1. Sporting KC certainly isn't in downtown. They play essentially in a stadium next to an outlet mall that has a mousetrap similar to Oak View. It doesn't seem to hurt them too much. Their street credibility doesn't seem to be hampered because their stadium isn't next to power and lights...and, the fans still seem to find their way out there. Even those that aren't from the burbs. How can this work in KC, but not Omaha? Hmmmmm.

2. When was the last time you saw a professional sports facility built with the option to have its spectator size essentially doubled? And then, actually have it happen? I feel like this was a concept for 1980's AAA baseball stadiums, that not once actually came to fruition. Like something Buffalo had in mind for their AAA team way back when. When was the last time it happened in practice? Is there an MLS team that actually did this? Go from an 8-10K USL stadium to a 20k MLS stadium on a modular basis?

Again, I live in Bellevue. Wherever the stadium ends up, if it happens at all, will be a ways away from my house. I'd rather go downtown. But, if it's in Gretna, I'll still go. I'd like to hope others do too. People in actual big cities laugh at us when we say, "I'd go to the game, but it's wayyyy too far from my house." You can still be anywhere in this town in 30 minutes.

Locally CenturyLink was built with the possibility of expanding and it did. Remember when it initially opened, there wasn't a second level of seats above the Bud Bar.

Greg

I had that exact scenario in mind when I posted this. I worked at Qwest Center while that was happening. Keep in mind, that was a roughly 14k arena for basketball moving to about 17k. Or, 15k to 18k depending on the configuration. That is about a 20% increase in seats. People like to mention building a 10k soccer stadium with the ability to go to 20k for MLS. I believe that's really more of a fantasy scenario. I can't come up with a single facility in North America that was built on such a modular basis where it was expanded and nearly doubled its size. I'd like to know about one if it exists. Might make me feel that discussion has more merit.

In fact, the only league where we've really seen cities "move up" in the modern era is MLS. It hasn't happened in MLB since Denver went from AAA to MLB in 1993 and Phoenix in 1998. There is no feeder league from the NFL. In NBA and NHL, arenas typically are what they are. I can think of cities like Cincinnati and St. Louis making the leap from USL Championship to MLS, but all of them have built new stadiums that I can come up with.

[ryan311]

Maybe they should partner with the developer of the rumored amusement park and build in a close proximity while also finding an organization that would sponsor a youth complex around it. This could bring in soccer tournaments that would increase usage of the stadium for championship matches as well as help drive attendance at an amusement park.

[Greg S]

The best soccer stadiums are intimate with seats close to the field. Kansas City's MSL team did not draw well when they played in Arrowhead but fill their soccer stadium. I would like to see a 8,000 seat stadium that is designed to be expanded with an additional 10-12,000 seats in the future

It was a long journey for the Kansas City Wizards/Sporting KC. They did a great job rebranding. They started to push to ingratiate themselves to those on the Kansas side when they moved out to the Legends area and built a tight knit group, but they still weren't drawing well. Many forget, they spent several seasons playing at the KC T-Bones ballpark in a situation very similar to what Union Omaha has now. They almost lost the team, actually. But, they got the stadium built, and it's fantastic. And, they totally rebranded from Wizards to Sporting, in part to look more like a real soccer team, but also in part to get rid of the minor league feel they had as the Wizards playing in empty ballparks and football stadiums.

To stir the pot on multiple issues...

1. Sporting KC certainly isn't in downtown. They play essentially in a stadium next to an outlet mall that has a mousetrap similar to Oak View. It doesn't seem to hurt them too much. Their street credibility doesn't seem to be hampered because their stadium isn't next to power and lights...and, the fans still seem to find their way out there. Even those that aren't from the burbs. How can this work in KC, but not Omaha? Hmmmmm.

2. When was the last time you saw a professional sports facility built with the option to have its spectator size essentially doubled? And then, actually have it happen? I feel like this was a concept for 1980's AAA baseball stadiums, that not once actually came to fruition. Like something Buffalo had in mind for their AAA team way back when. When was the last time it happened in practice? Is there an MLS team that actually did this? Go from an 8-10K USL stadium to a 20k MLS stadium on a modular basis?

Again, I live in Bellevue. Wherever the stadium ends up, if it happens at all, will be a ways away from my house. I'd rather go downtown. But, if it's in Gretna, I'll still go. I'd like to hope others do too. People in actual big cities laugh at us when we say, "I'd go to the game, but it's wayyyy too far from my house." You can still be anywhere in this town in 30 minutes.

Locally CenturyLink was built with the possibility of expanding and it did. Remember when it initially opened, there wasn't a second level of seats above the Bud Bar.

Greg

I had that exact scenario in mind when I posted this. I worked at Qwest Center while that was happening. Keep in mind, that was a roughly 14k arena for basketball moving to about 17k. Or, 15k to 18k depending on the configuration. That is about a 20% increase in seats. People like to mention building a 10k soccer stadium with the ability to go to 20k for MLS. I believe that's really more of a fantasy scenario. I can't come up with a single facility in North America that was built on such a modular basis where it was expanded and nearly doubled its size. I'd like to know about one if it exists. Might make me feel that discussion has more merit.

In fact, the only league where we've really seen cities "move up" in the modern era is MLS. It hasn't happened in MLB since Denver went from AAA to MLB in 1993 and Phoenix in 1998. There is no feeder league from the NFL. In NBA and NHL, arenas typically are what they are. I can think of cities like Cincinnati and St. Louis making the leap from USL Championship to MLS, but all of them have built new stadiums that I can come up with.

I think it might be fairly easy to do with a soccer stadium. One way would be to build the sides with the possibility to enclose the ends. I know many football stadiums took this approach over the years. With an enlosed arena, like Centurylink you are much more confined on designing it for future expansion, but it worked great there. Much more flexibility available on an open air stadium, than an enclosed arena.

A friend of mine was an architect and was involved with TD park here. It was designed so that it could be expanded. Next time I run into him I will ask of other stadiums that he knows of that were specifically designed with that flexibility. I can't imagine it would be hard to do at all....


Greg

[strangerthings]

If you don't need the seats a few years in, then it quickly becomes a "just wait for the replacement stadium." Sporting KC was designed for something like 8,000-12,000 additional seats. Every season's average attendance is above the listed capacity yet they haven't pulled the trigger.

The new women's stadium has something similar planned.

[nebugeater]

If not DT wouldn't there be some logic to building near Warner Park?

[omaha79]

If you don't need the seats a few years in, then it quickly becomes a "just wait for the replacement stadium." Sporting KC was designed for something like 8,000-12,000 additional seats. Every season's average attendance is above the listed capacity yet they haven't pulled the trigger.

The new women's stadium has something similar planned.

Yes! This is exactly what I was thinking. The dynamic on stadium building isn't the same as it was 40 years ago. Now, if a professional team builds a stadium, it's always with an eye towards its replacement within 20-30 years. It used to be that the social contract between a city and a franchise was if the taxpayers help you build this, you're going to use this stadium for 40-50 years. Now, we are seeing stadiums replaced in 15-20 years far more regularly.

I believe it's a pie in the sky idea to say that we'll build something modular now with an eye towards adding on to double the capacity in 10 years. At the 15 year mark, you hear terms like "functionally obsolete" start getting bandied about way more often. The problem with building modular with the notion of adding on is you often end up with something chopped up that ends up looking like Frankenstein's monster from an architectural perspective if you do that. And, no one ends up getting something that really works for either the original product or what they intend it to become.

And, I keep saying professional teams, because I don't count college in this equation. Colleges tend to be slightly better stewards of their facilities as they simply do not have the leverage to build something new every 15 years. They also have their academic missions which are more important than new stadiums. So, you do see college facilities added on to, but rarely, if ever, in pro sports. Because, if a pro team thinks they've fallen behind, they'll just play another suburb or a completely new city against their municipality to get the stadium they want in the moment.

[omaha79]

If not DT wouldn't there be some logic to building near Warner Park?

Probably not. Not a ton of land left out there that isn't somewhat spoken for for other mixed use ideas. and, certainly not enough to build a 10-20k soccer facility and possibly have the infrastructure to have Minor League Baseball and a USL game going on the same night. That would be a nightmare. And, if they build out west, I agree it will likely be part of a bigger soccer development. If the goal is USL Championship, and not MLS, I could see something like where St. Louis FC used to play with a number of surrounding fields for tournaments, etc.

[Greg S]

If you don't need the seats a few years in, then it quickly becomes a "just wait for the replacement stadium." Sporting KC was designed for something like 8,000-12,000 additional seats. Every season's average attendance is above the listed capacity yet they haven't pulled the trigger.

The new women's stadium has something similar planned.

Sporting Park base capacity is 18,647, largest attendance was 21k. It was always planned to be that size. Where are you getting it was designed for 8-12k?


Greg

[Garrett]

If you don't need the seats a few years in, then it quickly becomes a "just wait for the replacement stadium." Sporting KC was designed for something like 8,000-12,000 additional seats. Every season's average attendance is above the listed capacity yet they haven't pulled the trigger.

The new women's stadium has something similar planned.

Sporting Park base capacity is 18,647, largest attendance was 21k. It was always planned to be that size. Where are you getting it was designed for 8-12k?


Greg

Designed for 8-12k ADDITIONAL seats.

[Greg S]

If you don't need the seats a few years in, then it quickly becomes a "just wait for the replacement stadium." Sporting KC was designed for something like 8,000-12,000 additional seats. Every season's average attendance is above the listed capacity yet they haven't pulled the trigger.

The new women's stadium has something similar planned.

Sporting Park base capacity is 18,647, largest attendance was 21k. It was always planned to be that size. Where are you getting it was designed for 8-12k?


Greg

Designed for 8-12k ADDITIONAL seats.

OK thanks. Would be interested to see where those are planned to go. That's significant.

[Omahomie]

To echo some others here I think more development would need to be associated with the downtown stadium (which I think is the best option) to be viable, whether it be youth tournament fields or an amusement park. MLS has said it will definitely expand to 30 teams and it looks to be either Las Vegas, Phoenix, Detroit, or Sacramento but I'm guessing they'll wait until World Cup 2026 to add again. Hope that whatever solution they decide wouldn't exclude us to at least attempt to be looked at the league. But I also wouldn't want taxpayers to be on the hook for a temporary option.

[strangerthings]

If you don't need the seats a few years in, then it quickly becomes a "just wait for the replacement stadium." Sporting KC was designed for something like 8,000-12,000 additional seats. Every season's average attendance is above the listed capacity yet they haven't pulled the trigger.

The new women's stadium has something similar planned.

Sporting Park base capacity is 18,647, largest attendance was 21k. It was always planned to be that size. Where are you getting it was designed for 8-12k?


Greg

Designed for 8-12k ADDITIONAL seats.

OK thanks. Would be interested to see where those are planned to go. That's significant.

Above the east stands. the foundations and columns are there

[Greg S]

If you don't need the seats a few years in, then it quickly becomes a "just wait for the replacement stadium." Sporting KC was designed for something like 8,000-12,000 additional seats. Every season's average attendance is above the listed capacity yet they haven't pulled the trigger.

The new women's stadium has something similar planned.

Sporting Park base capacity is 18,647, largest attendance was 21k. It was always planned to be that size. Where are you getting it was designed for 8-12k?


Greg

Designed for 8-12k ADDITIONAL seats.

OK thanks. Would be interested to see where those are planned to go. That's significant.

Above the east stands. the foundations and columns are there

Thanks, I have never noticed those. Next game I go to I will know where to look.

Greg

[Padre]

The streetcar plan goes up to the CHI Arena, with a possible extension to the baseball stadium. Would an extension make the soccer stadium more likely? Or would the stadium make the extension more likely?

[nebport5]

The streetcar plan goes up to the CHI Arena, with a possible extension to the baseball stadium. Would an extension make the soccer stadium more likely? Or would the stadium make the extension more likely?

Not necessarily, but maybe just going to CHI. And god forbid people might have to walk 3 blocks to a soccer stadium.

[Hey]

Union Omaha tweeted a cryptic tweet: “Tuesday”

Are we gonna get all of these announce within a week?!?!

[nebport5]

Union Omaha tweeted a cryptic tweet: “Tuesday”

Are we gonna get all of these announce within a week?!?!

Good things come in threes...Omaha hat trick!?

[ita]

Union Omaha tweeted a cryptic tweet: “Tuesday”

Are we gonna get all of these announce within a week?!?!

Good things come in threes...Omaha hat trick!?

That would be awesome! It would bring much needed off-CWS season energy to North Downtown. It would be in an extremely blighted area, so they would be able to utilize the same 20 year TIF the city is with the streetcar.

[Louie]

All this momentum is hard to keep up with!!

[ita]

Redditors are leaning towards new player announcements. Exciting but not as exciting as a stadium announcement.

[omahahawk]

Yep....turned out to be new player announcements, nothing about a new stadium.

[ItsAllAboutMe]

Maybe the Cryptic rumor dept will be able to provide a status update on this proposed soccer stadium.

[Omaha Cowboy]

Maybe the Cryptic rumor dept will be able to provide a status update on this proposed soccer stadium.

I’ll definitely ask about this and see if there’s any updated intel…

Ciao..LiO…Peace

[JayPak]

Also, can you serve beer at Morrison?

Yes, absolutely. For example, Socctoberfest.

[Omaha Cowboy]

The “Cryptic Rumor Department” has nothing new to report on this overall development (Soccer Stadium and 2000 employee office) other than it is a “rumor” at this point…

Ciao..LiO…Peace

[Brad]

Soccer Stadium rumor Confirmed by the Mayor. Watch the Grow Omaha Uncut during the bottom of the hour commercial break.

[Athomsfere]

Soccer Stadium rumor Confirmed by the Mayor. Watch the Grow Omaha Uncut during the bottom of the hour commercial break.

I can't find anything on this so far. On the open news at least.

On the Uncut: Starts around 9 minutes in...

She said something about "We all know, parking downtown is choking development" Does she mean we have too much? I'll give her the benefit of the doubt there... But on the potholes: As far as I can see they are about as bad as ever here in the core.

Digressions aside: All we get for the soccer stadium is that they are looking... Still, that's a huge release! Even if unofficial.

[ita]

Soccer Stadium rumor Confirmed by the Mayor. Watch the Grow Omaha Uncut during the bottom of the hour commercial break.

I can't find anything on this so far. On the open news at least.

On the Uncut: Starts around 9 minutes in...

She said something about "We all know, parking downtown is choking development" Does she mean we have too much? I'll give her the benefit of the doubt there... But on the potholes: As far as I can see they are about as bad as ever here in the core.

Digressions aside: All we get for the soccer stadium is that they are looking... Still, that's a huge release! Even if unofficial.

On the soccer stadium, the mayor she said she spoke with the team last Friday, so that was a fresh update! This is looking good so far. It would be a really nice pickup for Millwork Commons.

[Athomsfere]

Soccer Stadium rumor Confirmed by the Mayor. Watch the Grow Omaha Uncut during the bottom of the hour commercial break.

I can't find anything on this so far. On the open news at least.

On the Uncut: Starts around 9 minutes in...

She said something about "We all know, parking downtown is choking development" Does she mean we have too much? I'll give her the benefit of the doubt there... But on the potholes: As far as I can see they are about as bad as ever here in the core.

Digressions aside: All we get for the soccer stadium is that they are looking... Still, that's a huge release! Even if unofficial.

On the soccer stadium, the mayor she said she spoke with the team last Friday, so that was a fresh update! This is looking good so far. It would be a really nice pickup for Millwork Commons.

Agreed. And Millwork Commons is already a nice area there in North Downtown. I'm not the biggest sports guy, but a soccer game before Kros Strain before catching the bus / street car home would be a great day!

[omahahawk]

Anyone catch that Q and A the OWH did with the owner of the Omaha Union where they point blank asked him about a new stadium downtown. Said he couldn't comment on it now but did note that in each instance where a team got its own stadium attendance tripled to quadrupled. Interesting, wonder what exactly it would take to get this done downtown.

[Coyote]

Shatel: Q&A with Gary Green, the owner of the Storm Chasers and Union Omaha
Tom Shatel Apr 14, 2022

I am looking into finding this site…

[Greg S]

Shatel: Q&A with Gary Green, the owner of the Storm Chasers and Union Omaha
Tom Shatel Apr 14, 2022

I am looking into finding this site…

I don’t think this thing if built will be as large as some are hoping.

Greg

[buildomaha]

Shatel: Q&A with Gary Green, the owner of the Storm Chasers and Union Omaha
Tom Shatel Apr 14, 2022

I am looking into finding this site…

I don’t think this thing if built will be as large as some are hoping.

Greg

And I think that’s probably a good thing. We don’t need another stadium in north downtown only filling a small proportion of its seats most of the year. There are ways to add capacity to a stadium if Omaha experiences unlikely explosive growth to warrant being considered for our first professional sports team requiring such a stadium.

It would be an amazing asset to have downtown if it is built at the necessary capacity.

[thenewguy]

Shatel: Q&A with Gary Green, the owner of the Storm Chasers and Union Omaha
Tom Shatel Apr 14, 2022

I am looking into finding this site…

I don’t think this thing if built will be as large as some are hoping.

Greg

And I think that’s probably a good thing. We don’t need another stadium in north downtown only filling a small proportion of its seats most of the year. There are ways to add capacity to a stadium if Omaha experiences unlikely explosive growth to warrant being considered for our first professional sports team requiring such a stadium.

It would be an amazing asset to have downtown if it is built at the necessary capacity.

it would be even better if they could work out an agreement with Creighton to use their facility

[Louie]

Shatel: Q&A with Gary Green, the owner of the Storm Chasers and Union Omaha
Tom Shatel Apr 14, 2022

I am looking into finding this site…

I don’t think this thing if built will be as large as some are hoping.

Greg

And I think that’s probably a good thing. We don’t need another stadium in north downtown only filling a small proportion of its seats most of the year. There are ways to add capacity to a stadium if Omaha experiences unlikely explosive growth to warrant being considered for our first professional sports team requiring such a stadium.

It would be an amazing asset to have downtown if it is built at the necessary capacity.

it would be even better if they could work out an agreement with Creighton to use their facility

Would they need to expand it? I think Morrison is currently at 6k.

[Padre]

it would be even better if they could work out an agreement with Creighton to use their facility

Would they need to expand it? I think Morrison is currently at 6k.

I can't see Union Omaha doing this. They learned their lesson with the StormChasers. Don't be a secondary tenant where you have no control over anything, and have to balance when you can play based on whether or not somone else is already using the facility.

[Louie]

it would be even better if they could work out an agreement with Creighton to use their facility

Would they need to expand it? I think Morrison is currently at 6k.

I can't see Union Omaha doing this. They learned their lesson with the StormChasers. Don't be a secondary tenant where you have no control over anything, and have to balance when you can play based on whether or not somone else is already using the facility.

Good point, though I suppose they could play a season at Morrison during construction to build up the hype in the area.

[omaha79]

it would be even better if they could work out an agreement with Creighton to use their facility

Would they need to expand it? I think Morrison is currently at 6k.

I can't see Union Omaha doing this. They learned their lesson with the StormChasers. Don't be a secondary tenant where you have no control over anything, and have to balance when you can play based on whether or not somone else is already using the facility.

Yeah. Permanent play at Morrison would be a non-starter unless CU and the team did something out of the box like allowing Union to help renovate the place and making them part owners. But, I don't see that as palatable to either side, and Union would likely want a venue that is made up of public/private financing...as is the norm.

Playing at Creighton just means you have no control of concessions, parking, advertising on the walls, branding, etc. CU isn't going to tear out the seats that say "Creighton" in blue and white across the stadium. That alone would make it a no go for a pro team, I'd think.

They will always want their own facility. Trying to push them to share a venue with a college team is probably more counterproductive than anything.

[omahahawk]

Shatel: A new soccer stadium for Union Omaha would be a double down for downtown

I’m certainly no soccer guy, but Union Omaha is a brilliant idea for this city. There’s a growing demographic of young professionals here, and pro soccer is their passion.

https://omaha.com/sports/huskers/footba ... -top-story

Interesting article here that makes the above point very clear. I can attest to the fact that soccer must be really big in that demographic based on the number of 25-35 year olds I saw overflowing the bars in Benson and Dundee when the US women's team was winning world titles in past years. Also, an interesting idea of floating a stadium on the old Mutual site which would be very cool. However, I would ultimately prefer to see this downtown at Millwork Commons at the end of the streetcar line. Doesn't need to be a soccer Taj Mahal either, just something nice with the possibility of updating/expansion as business allows.

[omahahawk]

Tom Shatel got it right. With the new Bluestone development coming on line (with is incredible BTW) downtown is the definitely the place for a new Union soccer stadium. With a new anchor residential population plus the overall increasing population downtown the place seems ripe for something like this. Although baseball seems to work well out in the burbs, soccer on the other hand is a game that I feel belongs downtown. Apparently Union's on field product speaks for itself so to me it would make sense at this point to create a place that has atmosphere. This is ultimately what is going to bring back people over the long run possibly even more then the teams overall record. Creating a stadium at Millworks will attract new fans and make games a destination activity for the more casual spectator to become a full fledged Union fan, therefore becoming more sustainable over the long run, more of a city institution then just something that you might do out west if the idea occurs to you. I'm kind of thinking that the true soccer fans are probably going to find a way to make it down to the Millworks regardless. Case in point, just look at the number of Creighton fans that are coming from out west for their events downtown. Really, with the sucess of the team to date even creating a simple inviting stadium downtown would be great. For the sake of cost of being cost-effective they could start simple with just minimal seating. As long as the field and facilities are good something with grass berms and a simple rap around walking track ala Charles Schwab field for standing viewing would work fine. Make it a cool vibe and fun event and you got a great recipe for sucess downtown.