Capitol District (NWC 10th & Capitol)

RichLNK · Post by **RichLNK** » Tue Aug 20, 2013 4:03 am

Agreed. Does anyone know how much T.I.F. was allocated towards WST? $35,000,000 is a very large T.I.F. package, and I wouldn't be surprised if it is revised for a smaller amount. Noone argues the demand and need for this project. This could be a destination for OYPs which is growing at a rapid pace and I'm not sure what the base rate will be, but the office space will lease quickly in such a desirable area. This project will happen, I just agree that I'm waiting to celebrate until the gold shovels touch the loose dirt. I hope by this time tomorrow, I've been criticized for my error and the council vote is unanimous! Haha

iamjacobm · Post by **iamjacobm** » Tue Aug 20, 2013 11:53 am

RichLNK wrote:Agreed. Does anyone know how much T.I.F. was allocated towards WST? $35,000,000 is a very large T.I.F. package, and I wouldn't be surprised if it is revised for a smaller amount. Noone argues the demand and need for this project. This could be a destination for OYPs which is growing at a rapid pace and I'm not sure what the base rate will be, but the office space will lease quickly in such a desirable area. This project will happen, I just agree that I'm waiting to celebrate until the gold shovels touch the loose dirt. I hope by this time tomorrow, I've been criticized for my error and the council vote is unanimous! Haha

I don't know how much WST was approved for, but this one will pass unanimously with the full $35 million. I will be shocked if someone votes against it.

MadMartin8 · Post by **MadMartin8** » Tue Aug 20, 2013 12:33 pm

RichLNK wrote:Agreed. Does anyone know how much T.I.F. was allocated towards WST? $35,000,000 is a very large T.I.F. package, and I wouldn't be surprised if it is revised for a smaller amount.

I would be very surprised. This project has the backing of pretty much everyone and their pets at home.

iamjacobm · Post by **iamjacobm** » Tue Aug 20, 2013 9:30 pm

I think there was a news van for every station outside of City Hall today. I assume we will get plenty of coverage on this, I hope a few more details might trickle out in an interview.

MadMartin8 · Post by **MadMartin8** » Wed Aug 21, 2013 12:32 am

When will we know how the vote went?

iamjacobm · Post by **iamjacobm** » Wed Aug 21, 2013 3:00 am

I haven't been able to find a sliver of info yet.

iamjacobm · Post by **iamjacobm** » Wed Aug 21, 2013 8:40 pm

It will be a phased project, but there is a new law that allows you to stagger when the TIF dates kick in under one large umbrella. It also allows them to shift some of the funding toward the hotel, that was key to getting a hotel operator on board.

Said spring of 2014 construction start expected 2 year construction time frame, so it will hopefully be up and running for the Swim Trials. Construction would stagger, but most likely not wait until the hotel is done, it just wont start at the exact same day.

Said this is the very likely trend for future large scale developments, instead of what A/V had to do with requesting TIF for ever new building.

And it passed 7-0.

MadMartin8 · Post by **MadMartin8** » Wed Aug 21, 2013 8:57 pm

iamjacobm wrote:It will be a phased project, but there is a new law that allows you to stagger when the TIF dates kick in under one large umbrella. It also allows them to shift some of the funding toward the hotel, that was key to getting a hotel operator on board.

Said spring of 2014 construction start expected 2 year construction time frame, so it will hopefully be up and running for the Swim Trials. Construction would stagger, but most likely not wait until the hotel is done, it just wont start at the exact same day.

Said this is the very likely trend for future large scale developments, instead of what A/V had to do with requesting TIF for ever new building.

And it passed 7-0.

Awwwwwww yeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaah. :music:

RNcyanide · Post by **RNcyanide** » Wed Aug 21, 2013 9:02 pm

Yay!!!!!

MTO · Post by **MTO** » Wed Aug 21, 2013 9:03 pm

So which building will they start for the second phase?

iamjacobm · Post by **iamjacobm** » Wed Aug 21, 2013 9:06 pm

MTO wrote:So which building will they start for the second phase?

Didn't say. It also isn't going to be terribly spread out if they can do it the way they want, still nearly all of it u/c at the same time. They just wont all start and end at the same time.

MTO · Post by **MTO** » Wed Aug 21, 2013 9:09 pm

...it's going to be a long winter...

MadMartin8 · Post by **MadMartin8** » Wed Aug 21, 2013 9:13 pm

I just watched the video of the council meeting. The city planning department rep said they hoped the Multi family housing, apartments, hotel would all be cocurrent development with the possibility of phasing.

Apparently The head of Shamrock was in Maryland meeting with some "end users" of the development...

Here's to Spring!

guitarguy · Post by **guitarguy** » Wed Aug 21, 2013 10:26 pm

Whoooooooooooooooo'ssss readyyy to partayyyyyyyyyyy :mrgreen:

Turtle9160 · Post by **Turtle9160** » Wed Aug 21, 2013 10:37 pm

Great news on the project. I am assuming they start the hotel first and then the rest as they go along, cant wait to see equipment on site down there getting to it

iamjacobm · Post by **iamjacobm** » Wed Aug 21, 2013 10:45 pm

One thing and I don't know if she misspoke was that the woman from the department said the office portion would create 30 jobs when she went through the rundown of jobs that each aspect would create. I wonder if that is just support staff and maintenance, because 140K sq ft of office can probably hold as many as 500 employees.

Coyote · Post by **Coyote** » Wed Aug 21, 2013 11:00 pm

Earlier it was reported :

The project will create 735 FTE, with 1025 construction jobs.

iamjacobm · Post by **iamjacobm** » Wed Aug 21, 2013 11:05 pm

Coyote wrote:Earlier it was reported :
The project will create 735 FTE, with 1025 construction jobs.

Those are the numbers she said at the end. It doesn't look like they are factoring office tenants into that 735 number.

Coyote · Post by **Coyote** » Sat Aug 24, 2013 2:51 pm

OK, I'll say it again - did I miss the OWH article about this? Great articles about the Lerner building lately, but Shamrock?
Must have missed it.

iamjacobm · Post by **iamjacobm** » Sat Aug 24, 2013 9:28 pm

Coyote wrote:OK, I'll say it again - did I miss the OWH article about this? Great articles about the Lerner building lately, but Shamrock?
Must have missed it.

I didn't see anything on it on any of the news sources. Maybe OWH will do a Sunday spread on the project?

psl25201 · Post by **psl25201** » Sun Aug 25, 2013 3:02 pm

Just a thought, but is it possible that either the developer or the OWH have asked or decided against a lot of publicity given the public debacle WST became? This is an enormous project and I've talked to two people in the development community, one who works for an architecture & design firm and another who works for a private equity development company (think WST's other option) and neither one of them think this project is going to go to construction.

The lack of coverage may just be intentional.

Coyote · Post by **Coyote** » Sun Aug 25, 2013 3:05 pm

psl25201 wrote:Just a thought, but is it possible that either the developer or the OWH have asked or decided against a lot of publicity given the public debacle WST became? This is an enormous project and I've talked to two people in the development community, one who works for an architecture & design firm and another who works for a private equity development company (think WST's other option) and neither one of them think this project is going to go to construction.

The lack of coverage may just be intentional.

:unlike:

Post by **Brad** » Sun Aug 25, 2013 4:02 pm

I think they are covering just like any other project, I just think some people's expectations are just way too high... They wanted dirt work started yesterday and a daily update from the developer. I think people just need to kick back and relax.

guitarguy · Post by **guitarguy** » Sun Aug 25, 2013 7:38 pm

Honestly I think our team here at the forums are probably more in the know than various people in the community who don't follow city council meets.. Its still very much in the early stages so since they are still setting the legal framework of this project Im sure a lot of people don't think its happening. Since their is a true need and usually MECA gets everything that want I believe it will happen.

iamjacobm · Post by **iamjacobm** » Sun Aug 25, 2013 8:34 pm

I didn't need a full article, but it isn't everyday a project gets approved for $35 million in TIF. A snippet on their business blog would seem reasonable.

psl25201 · Post by **psl25201** » Sun Aug 25, 2013 10:44 pm

guitarguy wrote:Honestly I think our team here at the forums are probably more in the know than various people in the community who don't follow city council meets.. Its still very much in the early stages so since they are still setting the legal framework of this project Im sure a lot of people don't think its happening. Since their is a true need and usually MECA gets everything that want I believe it will happen.

City council meetings don't even begin to scratch the surface of what's really going on with these projects. And how in the world can you define this development as a "true need"? You could maybe say that about an anchor hotel, maybe, but you don't need to spend $200M to get a hotel. I want this project to be built just as much as the next guy, but it's already been two years since this project was first announced and we're still hearing "next Spring".

Finally, the two people I'm referencing are actively involved, either directly or indirectly, in Omaha downtown development. One of them designed probably the only large scale, successful condo development downtown and the other one's company just announced a new development downtown that y'all have a thread dedicated to. In fact, you've got a thread dedicated to more than one of their developments.

I'm sorry, but these guys aren't blowing smoke, and as much as I'd like to be an optimist with this development, it's got a long ways to go.

I hope I'm eating crow in six months.

RNcyanide · Post by **RNcyanide** » Sun Aug 25, 2013 10:51 pm

psl25201 wrote:
guitarguy wrote:Honestly I think our team here at the forums are probably more in the know than various people in the community who don't follow city council meets.. Its still very much in the early stages so since they are still setting the legal framework of this project Im sure a lot of people don't think its happening. Since their is a true need and usually MECA gets everything that want I believe it will happen.
City council meetings don't even begin to scratch the surface of what's really going on with these projects. And how in the world can you define this development as a "true need"? You could maybe say that about an anchor hotel, maybe, but you don't need to spend $200M to get a hotel. I want this project to be built just as much as the next guy, but it's already been two years since this project was first announced and we're still hearing "next Spring".

Finally, the two people I'm referencing are actively involved, either directly or indirectly, in Omaha downtown development. One of them designed probably the only large scale, successful condo development downtown and the other one's company just announced a new development downtown that y'all have a thread dedicated to. In fact, you've got a thread dedicated to more than one of their developments.

I'm sorry, but these guys aren't blowing smoke, and as much as I'd like to be an optimist with this development, it's got a long ways to go.

I hope I'm eating crow in six months.

I will be more than happy to serve you crow any way you like :mrgreen:

MTO · Post by **MTO** » Sun Aug 25, 2013 10:56 pm

I'll put it like this. if this city loses another major project it should be very ashamed.

RNcyanide · Post by **RNcyanide** » Sun Aug 25, 2013 11:01 pm

I will admit I had and to a certain extent, still have very low expectations for this project, but I already think it's in better standing than WST. At least they didn't try to cut the building down the middle yet.

S33 · Post by **S33** » Sun Aug 25, 2013 11:18 pm

MTO wrote:I'll put it like this. if this city loses another major project it should be very ashamed.

If they sell another prime piece of land for a dollar, then lose it when the project goes belly-up, then the city should be ashamed.

As far as Shamrock not panning out, there's only so much the city can do. Blame the market, the banks, the developer, but the city isn't to blame.

thenewguy · Post by **thenewguy** » Mon Aug 26, 2013 3:05 am

I agree with brad...just relax...200M projects are not simple and take time.

iamjacobm · Post by **iamjacobm** » Mon Aug 26, 2013 9:35 pm

psl25201 wrote:
guitarguy wrote:Honestly I think our team here at the forums are probably more in the know than various people in the community who don't follow city council meets.. Its still very much in the early stages so since they are still setting the legal framework of this project Im sure a lot of people don't think its happening. Since their is a true need and usually MECA gets everything that want I believe it will happen.
City council meetings don't even begin to scratch the surface of what's really going on with these projects. And how in the world can you define this development as a "true need"? You could maybe say that about an anchor hotel, maybe, but you don't need to spend $200M to get a hotel. I want this project to be built just as much as the next guy, but it's already been two years since this project was first announced and we're still hearing "next Spring".

Finally, the two people I'm referencing are actively involved, either directly or indirectly, in Omaha downtown development. One of them designed probably the only large scale, successful condo development downtown and the other one's company just announced a new development downtown that y'all have a thread dedicated to. In fact, you've got a thread dedicated to more than one of their developments.

I'm sorry, but these guys aren't blowing smoke, and as much as I'd like to be an optimist with this development, it's got a long ways to go.

I hope I'm eating crow in six months.

Good info, thanks for sharing it with us. From my talks with someone in the field, not connected to the project, he seems pretty optimistic for Omaha as a whole. The suburban housing market hasn't been this strong since the '08 boom, the office market hasn't seen this much demand for new construction in even longer than that, the multifamily market has near 3000 units in the planning stages right now with a 94% occupancy rate. We are even short on industrial space right now. The one market that is weak right now is retail, too much built too close together in West O.

I don't know the exact workings with this project, but if we can't get a project like this off in this market then we need to drastically change our expectations for the next decade. There will be plenty of 5 floor stick built apartments pop up in east Omaha, but we wont see much for the huge investment then. I think if this one does get built and fills up we will see the lending loosen a lot and will possibly see a mini midrise boom downtown. I see this project as the lynchpin, if they can show the ability to fill up that much space then there will be obvious other developers wanting to capitalize in the success.

If we assume for a second that this project gets finished in 2016. I think the apartments would fly, being in a premier development would allow the rentals to fly ala MTC. The office would move as well I think, it is well documented that we are short on office space. The hotel would be a little iffy, if we really do start landing bigger and more conventions than it will certainly see plenty of costumers. The retail is the most shaky of the development, that is a ton especially considering we have The Old Market and 16th Street on the upswing.

I am still optimistic that it gets done, but I wont be shocked if it doesn't come to fruition either. This is a huge project and we are still a small metro area.

thenewguy · Post by **thenewguy** » Tue Aug 27, 2013 2:44 am

Define small... 900k doesnt seem small to me. unless your basis for comparison is nyc or LA.... then everything is small.

MTO · Post by **MTO** » Tue Aug 27, 2013 3:26 am

Eh what the 60th out of about 400 metros. And only a hand full of them are getting projects this size or bigger so you do the math.

iamjacobm · Post by **iamjacobm** » Tue Aug 27, 2013 3:44 am

You can define small how ever you want, if midsize works for you that is fine. The point I am getting at is that metros our size almost never pull off projects this large and this quality.

RNcyanide · Post by **RNcyanide** » Tue Aug 27, 2013 2:03 pm

If this gets pulled off well, what's to say that it can't happen again?

MadMartin8 · Post by **MadMartin8** » Tue Aug 27, 2013 3:43 pm

My contacts within the City Council and MECA seem pretty confident this is a go ahead as of yesterday when I spoke to them. The Hotel was the key, as well as getting interest in the office space.....but I guess we'll see.

RNcyanide · Post by **RNcyanide** » Tue Aug 27, 2013 3:50 pm

Who has interest in the office space?

MadMartin8 · Post by **MadMartin8** » Tue Aug 27, 2013 3:57 pm

RNcyanide wrote:Who has interest in the office space?

No idea, they couldn't/wouldn't tell me.

RNcyanide · Post by **RNcyanide** » Tue Aug 27, 2013 4:04 pm

Is there any info upon which a guess could be made?