Omaha Beltway Discussion

[Uffda]

Need to get this thread back on track but look up stats for free and reduced lunch for those school districts and OPS.

Also glad to see you agree that that union doesn't have the school board in its back pocket. also it has been my experience over the past 35 years, that people give Ed unions a lot more power and influence than they in reality have.

As to a Beltway --- I don't feel there is a need for one. I live inside I-680 in the NW part and there isn't a lot of traffic using this route until you get past Maple. Also my feeling is if you build beltway you start bypassing the city where you want people to stop and spend money.

[RNcyanide]

Need to get this thread back on track but look up stats for free and reduced lunch for those school districts and OPS.

Also glad to see you agree that that union doesn't have the school board in its back pocket. also it has been my experience over the past 35 years, that people give Ed unions a lot more power and influence than they in reality have.

As to a Beltway --- I don't feel there is a need for one. I leave inside I-680 in the NW part and there isn't a lot of traffic using this route until you get past Maple. Also my feeling is if you build beltway you start bypassing the city where you want people to stop and spend money.

Good point. However, even if we did end up with a beltway, that doesn't mean businesses won't locate around it and have passers-by stop there.

[Uffda]

But isn't that pulling out from the core. Also expanding means more infrastructure and Omaha si having problems paying for what it has now.

[Busguy2010]

I still think the southern portion and the portion between I-680 and HWY 133 would be useful.

I could also see people using the portion from HWY 275 to I-80, though I think we would need A LOT more population north of Dodge before that would happen.

I don't see the portion west of HWY 133 and north of HWY 275 ever being built.

[mcarch]

I don't see how the beltway would spur sprawl? I do see how gas stations, and maybe some shops would locate out there for Semi's, that wouldn't be using I-80. Maybe some industrial. With most of the land west of 275 being flood plain not much can be built out there... with the exception of expensive lake developments. A different story in Sarpy county of course, which might increase in sprawl, but the Springfield-Platteview School district stops that development. You can see this example by how Papillion is growing, and where development stops in Shadow Lake. The SE portion is the Springfield-Platteview School District. The same goes for 84th & Schram where there was an article on paving a 1/2 mile of street.

[daveoma]

I don't see how the beltway would spur sprawl? I do see how gas stations, and maybe some shops would locate out there for Semi's, that wouldn't be using I-80. Maybe some industrial. With most of the land west of 275 being flood plain not much can be built out there... with the exception of expensive lake developments. A different story in Sarpy county of course, which might increase in sprawl, but the Springfield-Platteview School district stops that development. You can see this example by how Papillion is growing, and where development stops in Shadow Lake. The SE portion is the Springfield-Platteview School District. The same goes for 84th & Schram where there was an article on paving a 1/2 mile of street.

How is it that the Springfield-Platteview School district stops development?

[RNcyanide]

I don't see how the beltway would spur sprawl? I do see how gas stations, and maybe some shops would locate out there for Semi's, that wouldn't be using I-80. Maybe some industrial. With most of the land west of 275 being flood plain not much can be built out there... with the exception of expensive lake developments. A different story in Sarpy county of course, which might increase in sprawl, but the Springfield-Platteview School district stops that development. You can see this example by how Papillion is growing, and where development stops in Shadow Lake. The SE portion is the Springfield-Platteview School District. The same goes for 84th & Schram where there was an article on paving a 1/2 mile of street.

It'll pull growth and resources away from the other parts of the city that need them. It's not all about downtown, midtown et al. There are streets all over that are riddled with potholes, parks that need to be maintained better, and former strip malls built in the 70's and 80's that are decaying and either need to be demolished or refurbished. A beltway would keep those things from happening. We need to focus on keep what we already have in good shape.

I've mentioned it before, but there are major streets on the periphery that don't have a ton of development around them which could be repurposed into limited-access highways a la West Dodge or 370.

[riceweb]

I went for a run south on Skyline Dr, and there's a massive luxury-home development (with a name like "The Preserves at the Farm") at F Street that seems like it's filling in one of the few places where a beltway could cut across the Elkhorn River. Even though there was very little political capital for a western beltway, I think we're rapidly approaching a point where a western beltway can't feasibly be built.

At least in terms of the western beltway, this is probably approaching "Never Built" status.

[MTO]

Yeah at this point if there’s ever any belt it’ll have run on the other side of the Platte. I get this state doesn’t have any desires for infrastructure but at least think ahead and set aside some land.

[Garrett]

Beltways will only ever encourage more suburban growth and less of the infill most of us want. Transportation as a rule is "if you build it they will come"

[Athomsfere]

I went for a run south on Skyline Dr, and there's a massive luxury-home development (with a name like "The Preserves at the Farm") at F Street that seems like it's filling in one of the few places where a beltway could cut across the Elkhorn River. Even though there was very little political capital for a western beltway, I think we're rapidly approaching a point where a western beltway can't feasibly be built.

At least in terms of the western beltway, this is probably approaching "Never Built" status.

I guess that's GREAT NEWS then.

[Busguy2010]

I think the south portion is still in the plans, but they need to get on it and secure enough land, because development is fast approaching and they will miss on that plan too. I can see that portion as beneficial as a bypass. All of what was planned to be the western portion is far too developed to even consider now. They really needed to consider this in the 90's for to it to have gotten actually done. But, maybe for the better.

[Brad]

I think the south portion is still in the plans, but they need to get on it and secure enough land, because development is fast approaching and they will miss on that plan too. I can see that portion as beneficial as a bypass.

U.S. 75 to 108th Street is in the design phase. Completely changing the 84th and Platteview intersection. 108th to Highway 50 has a preliminary design with 3 alternate designs at Springfield. On would bypass Springfield to the north, one to the south, and one would keep the current alignment, but loose the freeway portion in Springfield itself. We haven't been able to get a hint which way it will go, but the rumors all say south.

Here is the first Pahse:
https://storymaps.arcgis.com/stories/54 ... 6626d836f4

84th Interchange:

platteview.PNG

[Busguy2010]

I like that they actually have a solid plan for going forward with that, thanks for sharing.

[GetUrban]

Beltways will only ever encourage more suburban growth and less of the infill most of us want. Transportation as a rule is "if you build it they will come"

Looks like the rest of Sarpy county south to the Platte River will become suburbanized sooner rather then later, with that beltway.

[Erik]

Omaha is growing in the suburbs regardless.

If we want this city to grow, you have to grow up and out.

[Brad]

Looks like the rest of Sarpy county south to the Platte River will become suburbanized sooner rather then later, with that beltway.

Not exactly, they still don't have sewer capacity.

[ita]

Looks like the rest of Sarpy county south to the Platte River will become suburbanized sooner rather then later, with that beltway.

Not exactly, they still don't have sewer capacity.

if I am not mistaken, the City of Omaha entered into an interlocal agreement with Sarpy County to allow Sarpy County sewage to feed into the City of Omaha's Papillion Creek wastewater facility last fall. This was done with very little public comment, but will open up development one the infrastructure is put in place.

[riceweb]

To be clear, I'm not advocating for the western beltway. I don't think there's a need for it, it would be massively expensive, and I think there are other transportation spending needs that are much higher up the list. Just pointing out that I think a western beltway will not happen at this point, and it's probably safe to assume that 204th St will also be allowed to fill in without worrying about maintaining highway speeds between Gretna and Elkhorn (they'll probably eventually lower the speed limit to <=45mph for the entire stretch between West Dodge Expressway and I-80).

I think the Southern Beltway will be more critically important; there's a large amount of truck traffic that will run thru Sarpy County with, for instance, all the fulfillment centers and light manufacturing that are moving that way. At some point, that beltway will be critical to ensuring continued growth of the metro.

One last thought on the Western Beltway: the Elkhorn and Platte have always been natural barriers to development, but now without a new highway running through the area, our city's westward expansion might come to a grinding halt in a few years. Will be really interesting to watch when we run out of developable land. We might quickly see housing prices increase and/or significant increases in density, even in new projects way out west. Could be the start of a fundamentally new era of city growth.

[Brad]

if I am not mistaken, the City of Omaha entered into an interlocal agreement with Sarpy County to allow Sarpy County sewage to feed into the City of Omaha's Papillion Creek wastewater facility last fall. This was done with very little public comment, but will open up development one the infrastructure is put in place.

Ture, but wasn't it a 2 decade long project?

[ita]

if I am not mistaken, the City of Omaha entered into an interlocal agreement with Sarpy County to allow Sarpy County sewage to feed into the City of Omaha's Papillion Creek wastewater facility last fall. This was done with very little public comment, but will open up development one the infrastructure is put in place.

Ture, but wasn't it a 2 decade long project?

Also true. Yeah, it is a mulitdecade hundreds of million dollar project.

[daveoma]

I went for a run south on Skyline Dr, and there's a massive luxury-home development (with a name like "The Preserves at the Farm") at F Street that seems like it's filling in one of the few places where a beltway could cut across the Elkhorn River. Even though there was very little political capital for a western beltway, I think we're rapidly approaching a point where a western beltway can't feasibly be built.

At least in terms of the western beltway, this is probably approaching "Never Built" status.

Thank goodness

[Brad]

I went for a run south on Skyline Dr, and there's a massive luxury-home development (with a name like "The Preserves at the Farm") at F Street that seems like it's filling in one of the few places where a beltway could cut across the Elkhorn River. Even though there was very little political capital for a western beltway, I think we're rapidly approaching a point where a western beltway can't feasibly be built.

At least in terms of the western beltway, this is probably approaching "Never Built" status.

Highway 275 is basically the start of a western beltway. I believe you could upgrade some of the existing roads and have a decent little beltway without too much trouble.

Extend Platteview Road all the way to highway 6.
Cross the Platte River at Linoma where highway 6 currently does.
Building a new bypass east of Ashland (by camp Ashland) to connect to existing Highway 66
Use existing Highway 66 until it turns west at county road 7
Upgrade county road 7 north to Yutan/Highway 92
Use existing 92 to connect back to 275.

Its not a perfect loop, but it would be a nice use of mostly existing right of way without blazing a new path through the countryside.

[mrsticka]

If the plan is to make Platteview Road an expressway, they may need to build a flyover ramp from US 75.

[Brad]

If the plan is to make Platteview Road an expressway, they may need to build a flyover ramp from US 75.

The built that several years ago.

platteview.PNG

[mrsticka]

If the plan is to make Platteview Road an expressway, they may need to build a flyover ramp from US 75.

The built that several years ago.

platteview.PNG

Where is it? I'm not being a smart @$$. I just don't see it anywhere on that map.

[Brad]

If the plan is to make Platteview Road an expressway, they may need to build a flyover ramp from US 75.

The built that several years ago.

platteview.PNG

Where is it? I'm not being a smart @$$. I just don't see it anywhere on that map.

Its south of the old platteview road intersection about 1/2 mile. Platteview/Highway 34 goes over highway 75.

[Busguy2010]

That's not really a freeway to highway exit, though, especially if HWY 75 south from Fairview to 34 is ever to become a "freeway". They under-built it. At the very least it should have/should be like the one at HWY 34 and I-29, and even that one is under-built for a "freeway". At least IMO, if Platteview is ever actually going to be a freeway, a lot of what has already been done is under-built for it.

[Brad]

That's not really a highway to highway exit, though. They under-built it. At the very least it should have/should be like the one at HWY 34 and I-29, and even that one is under-built.

I believe there is enough room to add the additional lanes for that later. I don't think there will be too much traffic on Platteview until its joined up with something major out west.

[mrsticka]

And there are no flyover ramps there. A flyover ramp is a ramp that goes over an interchange. Kind of like what's at the I-80/I-480/US 75 interchange and the I-480/US 75 (North Freeway) interchange downtown.

[Brad]

And there are no flyover ramps there. A flyover ramp is a ramp that goes over an interchange. Kind of like what's at the I-80/I-480/US 75 interchange and the I-480/US 75 (North Freeway) interchange downtown.

Ok, well I have never heard of a "flyover ramp", so I wasn't sure exactly what you were talking about. I have worked in the civil engineering field for almost 2 decades and never heard anyone use the term "flyover ramp", so I got curious. I pulled up the Nebraska Department of Transportation dictionary page for "Road Design and Construction Terms" and flyover ramp is not listed there. Then I looked through some plans on different projects and I it looks like the NDOT just calls them "bridges".

NDOT Road Design and Construction Terms:
https://dot.nebraska.gov/media/6744/ter ... ionary.pdf

Out if curiosity, I looked up the Iowa Department of Transportation "GLOSSARY TERMS" also, and they don't have a "Flyover Bridge" either.
https://iowadot.gov/glossary/#27998123-a

[Busguy2010]

I can't believe you never heard of that. A quick google search shows you exactly what it is, and it appears to be a fairly universal term.

[Busguy2010]

I believe there is enough room to add the additional lanes for that later.

I looked at the map and there is no additional room, at least to add cloverleafs, because the bridge over 75 is only wide enough for the 4 lanes that are currently on 75. Any upgrade to that exit looks like it would require it to be ripped out and rebuilt. I.e., take another 5 years like it did the first time.

[Brad]

I can't believe you never heard of that. A quick google search shows you exactly what it is, and it appears to be a fairly universal term.

It makes sense, just never heard it use.

I believe there is enough room to add the additional lanes for that later.

I looked at the map and there is no additional room, at least to add cloverleafs, because the bridge over 75 is only wide enough for the 4 lanes that are currently on 75. Any upgrade to that exit looks like it would require it to be ripped out and rebuilt. I.e., take another 5 years like it did the first time.

Whenever I drive down 75, It seems like there is a lot of extra room. That said, I am a little confused why it wasn't built differently in the first place. If they are going through all the trouble to make Platteview a freeway, why have intersections at 75.

[Busguy2010]

I am a little confused why it wasn't built differently in the first place. If they are going through all the trouble to make Platteview a freeway, why have intersections at 75.

Totally agreed. Honestly that underbuilding takes a bit of confidence from me that the South Beltway will actually become a freeway. Time will tell.

[riceweb]

I am a little confused why it wasn't built differently in the first place. If they are going through all the trouble to make Platteview a freeway, why have intersections at 75.

Totally agreed. Honestly that underbuilding takes a bit of confidence from me that the South Beltway will actually become a freeway. Time will tell.

I guess I'm not too worried, there's a ton of land available at the moment and probably will be for the next 10 years. Also, there are some freeway-to-freeway interchanges are not fully separated, like Summerlin Parkway and the 215 in Las Vegas. Compared to the Highway 75/34 interchange, there's already a large amount of traffic for that interchange in Vegas, and it'll only grow. Somehow they're ok with a stoplight there, so don't be surprised if it takes 20 years for this interchange to be upgraded.

[SunMan]

I am a little confused why it wasn't built differently in the first place. If they are going through all the trouble to make Platteview a freeway, why have intersections at 75.

Totally agreed. Honestly that underbuilding takes a bit of confidence from me that the South Beltway will actually become a freeway. Time will tell.

I guess I'm not too worried, there's a ton of land available at the moment and probably will be for the next 10 years. Also, there are some freeway-to-freeway interchanges are not fully separated, like Summerlin Parkway and the 215 in Las Vegas. Compared to the Highway 75/34 interchange, there's already a large amount of traffic for that interchange in Vegas, and it'll only grow. Somehow they're ok with a stoplight there, so don't be surprised if it takes 20 years for this interchange to be upgraded.

I agree. Another example is in Kansas City where the west end of Hwy 152 meets I-435.

[damonhynes]

I am a little confused why it wasn't built differently in the first place. If they are going through all the trouble to make Platteview a freeway, why have intersections at 75.

Totally agreed. Honestly that underbuilding takes a bit of confidence from me that the South Beltway will actually become a freeway. Time will tell.

if it takes less than five years for Platteview to be done betw. US-75 and 108th, I'll eat a bug. Therefore, I guess ten years for 108th to NE-50. By that time, the US-75/US-34/Platteview diamond will need to be rebuilt anyhow. Big issue will be if that intersection will be developed to the point that there's no space for a higher-volume interchange.

NDOT is backed into the same corner at I-80/NE-370 and I-80/NE-50, BTW.

[skinzfan23]

I think it will be a very long process for Platteview Rd. We live just north of it and they are currently doing a study to see which preferred route to have the new road take. Right now, it will go south where Hidden Valley Dr comes off of Hwy 75. There of course, has to be a lot of land acquisition before any construction can begin. I am thinking it will probably be 10-15 years before this section is done....hopefully I am wrong because it is needed very badly.

[riceweb]

From the Street Widening post (viewtopic.php?f=15&t=16484&start=80):

2023 TIP project requests were posted the other day. Some of the street widening ones include:

• Platteview Road Expressway – 72nd to 99th - expressway
• Platteview Road Expressway – US-75 to 57th - expressway

More details about each project[/list]

In the linked PDF, they even say that interchanges will be built at 27th and 36th Sts. So is this freeway really starting to happen?