What is art?!

Humor and off topic conversation
nebport5
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What is art?!

Post by nebport5 »

Brad wrote: Thu Dec 15, 2022 1:01 pm Art is a really broad term. Here is one definition I like:

"a visual object or experience consciously created through an expression of skill or imagination"
It's hard to argue with that. Certainly a more inclusive definition than what those who have a hard time appreciating abstract, obscure and modern/post-modern styles may care to include. I struggle with appreciating much of modern art yet still respect it as an art form.

I think the new Kaneko piece is indeed art. Kaneko has a distinct and recognizable style. It may not be something you care for but it does elicit an emotional response which I believe art should do.

In regard to "the bean", as a piece it works in the context of Millennium Park and creates some interesting reflections particularly in the evening. As a human photo selfie op, it's lost on me because I think it looks less like a bean and more like the worlds largest breast implant.
legato9
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Re: What is art?!

Post by legato9 »

nebport5 wrote: Fri Dec 16, 2022 11:12 am
Brad wrote: Thu Dec 15, 2022 1:01 pm Art is a really broad term. Here is one definition I like:

"a visual object or experience consciously created through an expression of skill or imagination"
It's hard to argue with that. Certainly a more inclusive definition than what those who have a hard time appreciating abstract, obscure and modern/post-modern styles may care to include. I struggle with appreciating much of modern art yet still respect it as an art form.

I think the new Kaneko piece is indeed art. Kaneko has a distinct and recognizable style. It may not be something you care for but it does elicit an emotional response which I believe art should do.

In regard to "the bean", as a piece it works in the context of Millennium Park and creates some interesting reflections particularly in the evening. As a human photo selfie op, it's lost on me because I think it looks less like a bean and more like the worlds largest breast implant.
I don’t think that’s a proper definition at all. If it was, any industrial design would count. A pencil would be art. A driveway. Anything you can see that isn’t found in nature. In fact, that definition is close to a definition of “industrial design” (though it omits the utilitarian aspect).

To say nothing of the fact that music isn’t visual. Neither is spoken-word poetry. Or spoken storytelling.

And what about literature? True you can technically see the words - unless they’re in braille - but the words are just ink on a page. It’s the concepts that they represent that matter.
Otherwise it’s like saying “War and Peace” is a completely new work when it’s translated into Swedish, because the ink on the page is arranged differently.

“Art” is a selective recreation of reality based on an artist’s value judgements in order to convey those values.

The artist decides what elements of reality to incorporate into a given medium in order to express a value judgement.
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S.O.Boy
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Re: What is art?!

Post by S.O.Boy »

I call art things that take more talent then what I have. In CB the 24th street has "art pieces" that are hard for me differentiate from scrap piles.

Image
legato9
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Re: What is art?!

Post by legato9 »

S.O.Boy wrote: Fri Dec 16, 2022 3:00 pm I call art things that take more talent then what I have. In CB the 24th street has "art pieces" that are hard for me differentiate from scrap piles.

Image
I know what you’re talking about. Yeah. Those aren’t “art.”

I call those “anti-art.” Which is far worse than and a completely different category than just “bad art.” They say nothing, but they try to impersonate a form that art might take.

Like if I pound random letters on a keyboard, print it out, bind it, and masquerade it as literature. It would be an insult to authors. “See? What I did is the same as what you do.”

It would be an insult to readers, too. “See? You aren’t a conceptual thinker. You’re purely perceptual - like a jellyfish.”

(I note that jellyfish do not create art.)
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S.O.Boy
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Re: What is art?!

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TitosBuritoBarn
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Re: What is art?!

Post by TitosBuritoBarn »

More importantly, what is love? And will it hurt me no more?
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GetUrban
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Re: What is art?!

Post by GetUrban »

It can be art whether or not the creator intended it to be. After that the question becomes how many other people think it’s’ art?
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legato9
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Re: What is art?!

Post by legato9 »

GetUrban wrote: Sat Dec 17, 2022 1:54 pm It can be art whether or not the creator intended it to be. After that the question becomes how many other people think it’s’ art?
Reality isn’t defined by a poll. That’s the “50 million Elvis fans can’t be wrong” fallacy.

If it’s a matter of opinion, then nothing is art. Or everything is art. Or some art is non-art. Or some non-art is art. The concept of “art” becomes meaningless.

Opinions can differ as to whether any given art is good or bad. But if someone says that some abstract heap of scrap metal is “art,” they’re just…wrong.

Art is intentional. The whole concept of art is value judgement expressed in a tangible way. Its purpose is to take conceptual abstractions (eg love, justice, fear, hope, beauty, truth, heroism, cowardice, etc.) and bring them to the perceptual level.
GetUrban
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Re: What is art?!

Post by GetUrban »

legato9 wrote: Sat Dec 17, 2022 2:05 pm
GetUrban wrote: Sat Dec 17, 2022 1:54 pm It can be art whether or not the creator intended it to be. After that the question becomes how many other people think it’s’ art?
Reality isn’t defined by a poll. That’s the “50 million Elvis fans can’t be wrong” fallacy.

If it’s a matter of opinion, then nothing is art. Or everything is art. Or some art is non-art. Or some non-art is art. The concept of “art” becomes meaningless.

Opinions can differ as to whether any given art is good or bad. But if someone says that some abstract heap of scrap metal is “art,” they’re just…wrong.

Art is intentional. The whole concept of art is value judgement expressed in a tangible way. Its purpose is to take conceptual abstractions (eg love, justice, fear, hope, beauty, truth, heroism, cowardice, etc.) and bring them to the perceptual level.
Actually, reality is absolutely defined by polls, in the form of elections, which have a huge effect on the course of events.

Value judgements are opinions based on a persons beliefs and culture. I don’t think art has to be intentional, but I do believe it should involve a degree of skill and creativity.
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Omaha Cowboy
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Re: What is art?!

Post by Omaha Cowboy »

GetUrban wrote: Sat Dec 17, 2022 10:47 pm
legato9 wrote: Sat Dec 17, 2022 2:05 pm
GetUrban wrote: Sat Dec 17, 2022 1:54 pm
Art is intentional.
I don’t think art has to be intentional, but I do believe it should involve a degree of skill and creativity.
I dont believe Art has to be intentional either.. And in addition, I believe “Art” should also stimulate a reaction and spark discussion..Which I believe the Kaneko piece is doing based on the many posts we’ve had on the forum since it’s unveiling..

One person could look at a form of “Art” and consider it a water color drawing by a 3rd grader. To someone else, it could be that persons Picasso- it’s beauty or lack thereof is in the eyes of the beholder..

And that does not mean a work is or isn’t’ “Art”…

Ciao..LiO…Peace
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Busguy2010
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Re: What is art?!

Post by Busguy2010 »

Let me chime in here before it gets lost: "Art" is not easy to define. Art can be food, a painting, photography, a piece of furniture, a sports performance, music, writing, directing, acting, driving, welding, masonry, concrete laying, roofing... There's so many things that can be done to a level of being art. And I'm sure that leaves out a whole lot of other forms I'm not thinking of in the moment.

But for me, in order to be considered art, it has to be executed exceptionally well, and widely regarded as done exceptionally well, as well as the person (or people) performing said art having spent a great many hours perfecting their art in such a manner that a small percentage of people in (or attempting) said art could match or exceed their craft.
legato9
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Re: What is art?!

Post by legato9 »

I feel like I have to say something…but at this point, I don’t know what or why.

This is really depressing. There. That’s something.
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We Don’t Coast
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Re: What is art?!

Post by We Don’t Coast »

What I find depressing, is I actually enjoyed our Burger King fast food discussion from last year more than some of what I’m reading here. Big King Bacon Cheeseburger anyone?
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guitarguy
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Re: What is art?!

Post by guitarguy »

Lol.. been ages since I posted but as someone who has lived most of my life studying art and creating a great many examples of art I think it is absolutely one of the hardest things to truly define. I would encourage anyone to check out the Netflix documentary the struggle featuring Stanisław Szukalski who’s art is stunning btw. But he has a quote in that documentary that blew my mind where he says art is simply two things. It has to say something.. and then you must heavily exaggerate it.

Me personally I find most excellent forms of art in things like horror movies, theatrical metal bands, excellent chef level food..etc. Because they accomplish the heavy exaggeration element and because of that there’s a magic to them that people find difficult to explain but that magic is the essence of art.

Cheers,
Adam
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Busguy2010
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Re: What is art?!

Post by Busguy2010 »

To add to my thought, to me, art also should instill feelings in the viewer that perhaps they didn't know they had. For instance Quentin Tarantino movies, very many of them are artful.

As for the CB 24th street bridge, maybe it is art... In a way because it instills feelings of hatred, disgust, mockery, etc...

Also, what thread did this start in?
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nebugeater
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Re: What is art?!

Post by nebugeater »

Art is something that makes you stop and think.
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Uffda
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Re: What is art?!

Post by Uffda »

nebugeater wrote: Mon Dec 19, 2022 2:15 pm Art is something that makes you stop and think.
Saw this interview this morning.

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