Downtown Recovery

[skinzfan23]

According to this study, downtown Omaha is doing quite well.

Death of Downtown? Pandemic Recovery Trajectories across 62 North American Cities

[ita]

According to this study, downtown Omaha is doing quite well.

Death of Downtown? Pandemic Recovery Trajectories across 62 North American Cities

Cool page. They are using visits to places of interest (POI), including restaurants, retail stores, grocery stores, as the metric to measure recovery. I am looking forward to updated statistics since the data is current up to May 2022. It won't show visits to the GLM, but I am confident its opening brought more visits to POI's in downtown. If anything, this is a good metric to show potential business or retail that downtown is almost back up to prepandemic levels.

We were downtown Friday night and it was really busy. On a whim, we picked up food at midtown crossing, had dinner at the GLM, walked around Old Market and had ice cream at T&W's. It was probably due to the beautiful weather but everywhere we went was bustling.

[ita]

Omaha ranks 11th in downtown pandemic recovery among North American cities

A new study from the University of Toronto ranks Omaha among the top cities in North America for bouncing back after the pandemic.

What did they use to measure? Foot traffic patterns using smartphone location data across 47 months and 62 cities.

“If you talk about foot traffic, you’re capturing everything,” said lead researcher and professor Karen Chapple from the University of Toronto School of Cities. “You’re capturing the workers. You’re capturing the residents. You’re capturing the shoppers and visitors.”

University of Nebraska at Omaha economist Professor Zhigang Feng explained the benefits.

“Higher foot traffic usually means more customers visiting the business, right?” he said. “So there is more business. And there is certainly going to be economic growth or economic activity.”

[Athomsfere]

The actual list:
http://downtownrecovery.com/dashboards/ ... nking.html

The one city that surprised me: El Paso is doing well. Ranked 5 with 105% recovery. Also the index that first is doing better than pre-pandemic.

[ita]

The actual list:
http://downtownrecovery.com/dashboards/ ... nking.html

The one city that surprised me: El Paso is doing well. Ranked 5 with 105% recovery. Also the index that first is doing better than pre-pandemic.

Just a point on data. It's an 11 week rolling average. Also, if you look at the home page, they have other graphs including one named Recovery Patterns. If you choose Omaha, you will see we were 90%+ from mid September to first week of January. I think we got a boost during that time frame from GLM.

[Duggers_Dad]

What do you guy’s make of Warren Buffet’s ominous foreboding about downtowns hollowing out ?

[Garrett]

Warren thought newspapers were a good investment 10 years ago. He’s made plenty of smart moves over the year but he is not omniscient. I think Omaha has positioned itself to move towards being a “City of Play” that the future urban areas will look like

[Athomsfere]

What do you guy’s make of Warren Buffet’s ominous foreboding about downtowns hollowing out ?

I don't have the context of when he said that. But I think much like his streetcar thoughts, this isn't his core area of competency and he's likely dead wrong.

Living, working, playing, and raising a family even in a downtown just has so many perks. A lesson north america is slowly re-learning.

I think with Covid we say the pendulum swing hard towards moving people out, but we will see it swing back with a vengeance. At the very least, towards urbanism even if the traditional NA CBD changes drastically. Especially when Millennials and younger are already making choice after choice to favor the actual city, like record low rates of owning cars or even having a driving license.

[Louie]

What do you guy’s make of Warren Buffet’s ominous foreboding about downtowns hollowing out ?

I don't have the context of when he said that. But I think much like his streetcar thoughts, this isn't his core area of competency and he's likely dead wrong.

Living, working, playing, and raising a family even in a downtown just has so many perks. A lesson north america is slowly re-learning.

I think with Covid we say the pendulum swing hard towards moving people out, but we will see it swing back with a vengeance. At the very least, towards urbanism even if the traditional NA CBD changes drastically. Especially when Millennials and younger are already making choice after choice to favor the actual city, like record low rates of owning cars or even having a driving license.

To be fair, this was Munger talking, not Buffett. And we all know Munger is absolutely idiotic when it comes to real estate: https://www.architectmagazine.com/desig ... -but-why_o

[Athomsfere]

What do you guy’s make of Warren Buffet’s ominous foreboding about downtowns hollowing out ?

I don't have the context of when he said that. But I think much like his streetcar thoughts, this isn't his core area of competency and he's likely dead wrong.

Living, working, playing, and raising a family even in a downtown just has so many perks. A lesson north america is slowly re-learning.

I think with Covid we say the pendulum swing hard towards moving people out, but we will see it swing back with a vengeance. At the very least, towards urbanism even if the traditional NA CBD changes drastically. Especially when Millennials and younger are already making choice after choice to favor the actual city, like record low rates of owning cars or even having a driving license.

To be fair, this was Munger talking, not Buffett. And we all know Munger is absolutely idiotic when it comes to real estate: https://www.architectmagazine.com/desig ... -but-why_o

Munger said that downtown would hollow out?

[Louie]

What do you guy’s make of Warren Buffet’s ominous foreboding about downtowns hollowing out ?

I don't have the context of when he said that. But I think much like his streetcar thoughts, this isn't his core area of competency and he's likely dead wrong.

Living, working, playing, and raising a family even in a downtown just has so many perks. A lesson north america is slowly re-learning.

I think with Covid we say the pendulum swing hard towards moving people out, but we will see it swing back with a vengeance. At the very least, towards urbanism even if the traditional NA CBD changes drastically. Especially when Millennials and younger are already making choice after choice to favor the actual city, like record low rates of owning cars or even having a driving license.

To be fair, this was Munger talking, not Buffett. And we all know Munger is absolutely idiotic when it comes to real estate: https://www.architectmagazine.com/desig ... -but-why_o

Munger said that downtown would hollow out?

Correct.

[Renovator2559]

The actual list:
http://downtownrecovery.com/dashboards/ ... nking.html

The one city that surprised me: El Paso is doing well. Ranked 5 with 105% recovery. Also the index that first is doing better than pre-pandemic.

What happened to Des Moines, it is not there. Usually Des Moines tends to be nearby stats to Omaha.

As for Kansas City, ehhh its a suburban city

[nativeomahan]

I’m guessing that Des Moines wasn’t a large enough city to be considered in the rankings. It appears that only the 63 largest cities seem to be included in the rankings.

[Renovator2559]

The Old Market is doing well and even doing better than before the pandemic, the amount of businesses have grown based on the business map.

https://www.wowt.com/2023/07/10/old-mar ... e-growing/

[legato9]

The Old Market is doing well and even doing better than before the pandemic, the amount of businesses have grown based on the business map.

https://www.wowt.com/2023/07/10/old-mar ... e-growing/

The Old Market utterly baffles me. It is hands-down the most vibey, cool area in town from an architecture and design point of view. And it’s super walkable.

Yet there are so many empty storefronts and stores that are…trying to think of a nice way to put this…uh…not…uh…I mean…kind of not in any way good.

I would think the OM would have a waitlist for space and have great stores and restaurants without exception.

What is the deal with that?!

[ricko]

The Old Market is doing well and even doing better than before the pandemic, the amount of businesses have grown based on the business map.

https://www.wowt.com/2023/07/10/old-mar ... e-growing/

The Old Market utterly baffles me. It is hands-down the most vibey, cool area in town from an architecture and design point of view. And it’s super walkable.

Yet there are so many empty storefronts and stores that are…trying to think of a nice way to put this…uh…not…uh…I mean…kind of not in any way good.

I would think the OM would have a waitlist for space and have great stores and restaurants without exception.

What is the deal with that?!

I don’t know if things have changed, but the Mercer Family wanted to keep the OM open to local businesses. I’m sure there are national chains that would love to locate there, but the OM is unique because it’s not just another shopping mall in turn of the century buildings. I saw this happen in Georgetown, D.C.. When I moved here in 1979, Georgetown was full of quirky one-off shops and great restaurants and bars. Now it’s a collection of high-end retail stores like Ralph Lauren, J.Crew and the like——totally ruined what was unique about the place; a high end outdoor mall in 200 year old buildings. The gentrification killed the club/music scene as well. I have no desire to go there anymore. At least Old Town Alexandria managed to keep the chains out, for the most part.

[legato9]

The Old Market is doing well and even doing better than before the pandemic, the amount of businesses have grown based on the business map.

https://www.wowt.com/2023/07/10/old-mar ... e-growing/

The Old Market utterly baffles me. It is hands-down the most vibey, cool area in town from an architecture and design point of view. And it’s super walkable.

Yet there are so many empty storefronts and stores that are…trying to think of a nice way to put this…uh…not…uh…I mean…kind of not in any way good.

I would think the OM would have a waitlist for space and have great stores and restaurants without exception.

What is the deal with that?!

I don’t know if things have changed, but the Mercer Family wanted to keep the OM open to local businesses. I’m sure there are national chains that would love to locate there, but the OM is unique because it’s not just another shopping mall in turn of the century buildings. I saw this happen in Georgetown, D.C.. When I moved here in 1979, Georgetown was full of quirky one-off shops and great restaurants and bars. Now it’s a collection of high-end retail stores like Ralph Lauren, J.Crew and the like——totally ruined what was unique about the place; a high end outdoor mall in 200 year old buildings. The gentrification killed the club/music scene as well. I have no desire to go there anymore. At least Old Town Alexandria managed to keep the chains out, for the most part.

I’m all about the boutique shops. I’d hate to see chains in the OM.

It’s just that some of the boutiques there are kind of…not so great for the area. (Some of them are nice and/or cool.)

But like, the Passageway is stunning. It’s so beautiful. I always show it to out-of-town visitors. But then I’m like, “yeah…let’s not go in. Top of the stairs is far enough.”

Not hating on the businesses there. I really hope they do well and that their customers love them. But they don’t seem right for the area. Areas like the OM need to have symbiosis. I just don’t see that between like, an incense store and a nice women’s clothing boutique.

[Garrett]

I think the collection of galleries and odd stores makes the passageway’s charm. Trini’s isn’t the best Mexican food but I love the ambiance.

[Renovator2559]

The Old Market is doing well and even doing better than before the pandemic, the amount of businesses have grown based on the business map.

https://www.wowt.com/2023/07/10/old-mar ... e-growing/

The Old Market utterly baffles me. It is hands-down the most vibey, cool area in town from an architecture and design point of view. And it’s super walkable.

Yet there are so many empty storefronts and stores that are…trying to think of a nice way to put this…uh…not…uh…I mean…kind of not in any way good.

I would think the OM would have a waitlist for space and have great stores and restaurants without exception.

What is the deal with that?!

Do you live in the area or do you live out in west omaha? When was the last time you went to the old market?

Tenants have to pay rent, if they were empty as you claim there would not be as many businesses flourishing better than pre-pandemic levels, also these are hard times for many metros; yet Omaha is doing well.

Here are some other metro examples:

New York City has plenty of blocks with vacant store fronts, 10,000 residents fled NY in April alone, plenty attribute to rising prices, rising crime and conflicts that sprout randomly in the subways

https://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/ny ... story.html



Or how about how a lot of stores in San Francisco are closing as seen with this walkby?

They attribute to ecommerce as the reason, though how come a sprawling Florida city is not affected by ecommerce and are doing just fine as in Omaha?



Portland is not doing so hot either, there's social instability, high crime, drug crisis, some stores adopting camera verify entry do to shoplifting

https://ktul.com/news/nation-world/port ... possession

While Florida cities receive a high influx of refugees from other states, prices, real estate and infrastructure are being streessed to the brim, residents complaining of issues do to a high influx of refugees.

Omaha has it well, since we have many filters in place to grow at a healthy rate (better than KC and Des Moines) while still ensuring stability and time for the city to better plan.

[Renovator2559]

I don’t know if things have changed, but the Mercer Family wanted to keep the OM open to local businesses. I’m sure there are national chains that would love to locate there, but the OM is unique because it’s not just another shopping mall in turn of the century buildings. I saw this happen in Georgetown, D.C.. When I moved here in 1979, Georgetown was full of quirky one-off shops and great restaurants and bars. Now it’s a collection of high-end retail stores like Ralph Lauren, J.Crew and the like——totally ruined what was unique about the place; a high end outdoor mall in 200 year old buildings. The gentrification killed the club/music scene as well. I have no desire to go there anymore. At least Old Town Alexandria managed to keep the chains out, for the most part.

Well put, I am glad they are approaching a local first approach, rather than having a national chain that will just pocket the money to a different state

[Big E]

[though how come a sprawling Florida city is not affected by ecommerce and are doing just fine as in Omaha?

So a sprawling suburban city built since 1970 that’s full of retirees and San Francisco aren’t the same thing snd don’t have the same demographics or infrastructure or approach to online shopping?

Knock me the |expletive| over.

[Renovator2559]

So a sprawling suburban city built since 1970 that’s full of retirees and San Francisco aren’t the same thing snd don’t have the same demographics or infrastructure or approach to online shopping?

Knock me the |expletive| over.

I'm not a fan of these sprawling Florida cities. They were too progressive in adopting the car centric infrastructure and leaving the tried and true of traditional urban design.

With the influx of refugees fleeing states and cities facing social and economic instability. Florida has been ballooning in population. Florida is no longer a place of retirees but a diverse demographic.

The ecommerce is an excuse to the real issue at hand. Policy, crime, governance, social instability, lack of common sense.

Not prosecuting shoplifters unless the value of the stolen items exceeds $1000, will only lead to a surge in crime.

[ita]

I just went through the business list from 2018 business map and the 2023 directory, and at best it's a wash. There are some businesses or venues listed in multiple categories on both lists. There's also some places like the Durham and CHI that is listed in the 2023 directory, but isn't actually in OM, but then That Dog Wash, a pet store next door to Mixins isn't on the list.

It doesn't seem like they have added as many as being reported, but at the same time, closed businesses have been replaced by new ones and there seems to be a steady churn. With the recent closings of larger/more visible businesses like Stokes and Roja, there's additional perception that OM is doing well, but they shouldn't stay vacant for long. Additionally, the Brickline, theoretically, extends OM once those retail spaces are up and running, as does the reopening of HOA. Moxy will finally be opening that adds another hotel to OM. Let's see how OM continues to recover and churn in the next year with those additional changes.

2018 Map and Directory

2023 Pamplet

PS. One of the lesser known closings from the 2018 list that I particularly miss is Spice C Noodles. It was a hand drawn Chinese noodle shop that was amazing, but only open for several months.

[legato9]

The Old Market is doing well and even doing better than before the pandemic, the amount of businesses have grown based on the business map.

https://www.wowt.com/2023/07/10/old-mar ... e-growing/

The Old Market utterly baffles me. It is hands-down the most vibey, cool area in town from an architecture and design point of view. And it’s super walkable.

Yet there are so many empty storefronts and stores that are…trying to think of a nice way to put this…uh…not…uh…I mean…kind of not in any way good.

I would think the OM would have a waitlist for space and have great stores and restaurants without exception.

What is the deal with that?!

Do you live in the area or do you live out in west omaha? When was the last time you went to the old market?

Tenants have to pay rent, if they were empty as you claim there would not be as many businesses flourishing better than pre-pandemic levels, also these are hard times for many metros; yet Omaha is doing well.

Here are some other metro examples:

New York City has plenty of blocks with vacant store fronts, 10,000 residents fleed NY in April alone, plenty attribute to rising prices, rising crime and conflicts that sprout randomly in the subways

https://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/ny ... story.html



Or how about how a lot of stores in San Francisco are closing as seen with this walkby?

They attribute to ecommerce as the reason, though how come a sprawling Florida city is not affected by ecommerce and are doing just fine as in Omaha?



Portland is not doing so hot either, there's social instability, high crime, drug crisis, some stores adopting camera verify entry do to shoplifting

https://ktul.com/news/nation-world/port ... possession

While Florida cities receive a high influx of refugees from other states, prices, real estate and infrastructure are being streessed to the brim, residents complaining of issues do to a high influx of refugees.

Omaha has it well, since we have many filters in place to grow at a healthy rate (better than KC and Des Moines) while still ensuring stability and time for the city to better plan.

How dare you accuse me of setting foot in West O, let alone living there!

I was in the OM like four times in the past 10 days.

I think you’re missing the point. I’m just saying that the OM should be crazy cool. Its aesthetic and layout already is. But a lot of the stores there are a little rough. I would think that some of them might do better in other locations. Like…are the OM crowd and the tourists really looking for crystals and tarot cards?

I’m not saying the OM has to be all upscale or anything. Imaginarium and Hollywood Candy aren’t “fancy” per se, but they’re absolute national treasures. That said - everyone loves candy and nostalgia.

I just think it’s a shame that the Passageway smells like Mega Saver.

And I don’t see why cool businesses from around town wouldn’t fill up those empty spots. If I had a vibey store, the OM would be my #1 spot to do it.

(On that note, if I decide to stay in Omaha, I’m almost obsessively tempted to bankrupt myself and everyone I know with a concept that I think Omaha desperately needs. And I’d do my level best to do it in the OM.)

[Louie]

And that concept is? Don't leave us hanging...

[Renovator2559]

I just went through the business list from 2018 business map and the 2023 directory, and at best it's a wash. There are some businesses or venues listed in multiple categories on both lists. There's also some places like the Durham and CHI that is listed in the 2023 directory, but isn't actually in OM, but then That Dog Wash, a pet store next door to Mixins isn't on the list.

It doesn't seem like they have added as many as being reported, but at the same time, closed businesses have been replaced by new ones and there seems to be a steady churn. With the recent closings of larger/more visible businesses like Stokes and Roja, there's additional perception that OM is doing well, but they shouldn't stay vacant for long. Additionally, the Brickline, theoretically, extends OM once those retail spaces are up and running, as does the reopening of HOA. Moxy will finally be opening that adds another hotel to OM. Let's see how OM continues to recover and churn in the next year with those additional changes.

2018 Map and Directory

2023 Pamplet

PS. One of the lesser known closings from the 2018 list that I particularly miss is Spice C Noodles. It was a hand drawn Chinese noodle shop that was amazing, but only open for several months.

As the report says, some churn is to be expected and normal and a few vacancies is essential to allow other businesses to open up shop.

This economic climate and inflation is testing the viability of business.

Our trivial churn is peanuts compared to what's going on in other metros facing up to entire blocks of vacant storefronts, as well as facing an exodus of people

[Renovator2559]

San Francisco vacancy keeps increasing.

https://www.sfgate.com/realestate/artic ... 179454.php



Its surreal and dystopian of how empty Market street is these days, most businesses and store fronts closed. Market street is a main artery for foot traffic, yet businesses are closing.



I sure am glad mayor Jean Stothert has vowed to pay police better wages, compared to San Francisco making it harder for the police to prosecute crime, while simultaneously officials denying that crime is rampant.

By ensuring a poop free sidewalks, needle free, safe downtown, we can ensure our downtown continues to be vibrant.

[OmahaRedWing]

San Francisco vacancy keeps increasing.

https://www.sfgate.com/realestate/artic ... 179454.php



Its surreal and dystopian of how empty Market street is these days, most businesses and store fronts closed. Market street is a main artery for foot traffic, yet businesses are closing.



I sure am glad mayor Jean Stothert has vowed to pay police better wages, compared to San Francisco making it harder for the police to prosecute crime, while simultaneously officials denying that crime is rampant.

By ensuring a poop free sidewalks, needle free, safe downtown, we can ensure our downtown continues to be vibrant.

Yeah I agree on making OPD's wages tops in the state. Not only filling the jobs but getting the best candidates as well. It's critical not to be short staffed on OPD.

[almighty_tuna]

I don't know how highest wages in Nebraska would be a flex. We're the biggest city with the biggest tax base providing the largest municipal budget in the state. Yeah, so take that...*checks notes*...Scottsbluff!

[OmahaRedWing]

I don't know how highest wages in Nebraska would be a flex. We're the biggest city with the biggest tax base providing the largest municipal budget in the state. Yeah, so take that...*checks notes*...Scottsbluff!

I don't see it as a flex. It's just the way it should be, including County officers and State Patrol.

[skinzfan23]

Saw that Target is closing 3 stores near San Francisco due to retail theft. This isn't the first store in the area to do that and won't be the last. Sounds like San Fran is really falling apart.

[NEDodger]

Saw that Target is closing 3 stores near San Francisco due to retail theft. This isn't the first store in the area to do that and won't be the last. Sounds like San Fran is really falling apart.

9 stores total. Harlem, San Fran, and a few other spots.

[Bob from Omaha]

Chicago is a complete crime scene. So far downtown Detroit hasn't experienced such mayhem. And yes, downtown Detroit has a lot of retail, residential & commercial activity. I am down there both daytime & night & have had no problem. Also, all four pro sports teams are downtown.

[djc311]

Saw that Target is closing 3 stores near San Francisco due to retail theft. This isn't the first store in the area to do that and won't be the last. Sounds like San Fran is really falling apart.

9 stores total. Harlem, San Fran, and a few other spots.

As a business owner I would hate to deal with all of the theft as well. But as a previous Target PT employee I'm still simply shocked that they don't hire armed security. These idiots know Target's policy is "don't touch shop lifters"... you can barely look at them. You can literally walk into a Target store, fill a cart full of |expletive| and roll it out the front door. The most their security would do is come up to you and say "stop". But if you want to keep on rolling, you can. They won't do anything about it - NOTHING (aside from call the cops). If you're in a hurry and know where to go and what you want, it'd be easy as pie to steal whatever you wanted.

We ended up locking ALL Apple products up in a backroom, which was a total pain in the |expletive| for everyone. But they had some smash and grabs so they chose to address it that way.

Hire off duty uniformed cops - if HyVee will place them in their grocery stores, then Target should be able to do it. Better than closing down stores. Plus, as a shopper of HyVee I feel like I need the armed guard because I'm being robbed every time I buy something there!

Seriously though - I've brought this up before and someone said it's too uncomfortable for shoppers to see armed guards. Really? Is it? You'd expect them at a bank, Borsheims has them... who cares? Don't steal and they won't come after you. It's straight up common sense. And it's quite sad people act like they do. I recall a carload of idiots parking by the fire exit at the Target I worked at, some of them ran inside, jacked some Dyson vacuums and busted out through the fire exit. Hopped in the car and gone. Oh, and no plates because they're smart idiots. You think they caught them? No. But they know employees will do NOTHING about it.

[nativeomahan]

Armed guards would get a thumbs up from me if the conditions dictated it, I certainly wouldn’t want to see them all of the time.

[Garrett]

Target is opening a new location in Harlem about a mile away in a couple months. Citing crime seems… odd.

[legato9]

Target is opening a new location in Harlem about a mile away in a couple months. Citing crime seems… odd.

New York City is in a blue state. Thus, it must be Mad Max.

Red states, as you ought know, are bastions of culture and sophistication. They are civilized perhaps to a fault.

[Garrett]

Target is opening a new location in Harlem about a mile away in a couple months. Citing crime seems… odd.

New York City is in a blue state. Thus, it must be Mad Max.

Red states, as you ought know, are bastions of culture and sophistication. They are civilized perhaps to a fault.

Frankly, it’s a lot easier to blame crime and not spook investors than it is to just say the stores were underperforming. I can only directly speak for the Harlem location, but it’s super far from any subway line, in a massive car centric development next to a highway, collocated with an Aldi and a Costco. From what I’ve read on twitter it sounds like a lot of these stores are simply in bad, underperforming locations where even locals didn’t know they were there. There’s still gonna be a target in downtown SF, they’re simply closing a small city target that’s, again, far from transit next to a highway.

[NEDodger]

Target is opening a new location in Harlem about a mile away in a couple months. Citing crime seems… odd.

New York City is in a blue state. Thus, it must be Mad Max.

Red states, as you ought know, are bastions of culture and sophistication. They are civilized perhaps to a fault.

Frankly, it’s a lot easier to blame crime and not spook investors than it is to just say the stores were underperforming. I can only directly speak for the Harlem location, but it’s super far from any subway line, in a massive car centric development next to a highway, collocated with an Aldi and a Costco. From what I’ve read on twitter it sounds like a lot of these stores are simply in bad, underperforming locations where even locals didn’t know they were there. There’s still gonna be a target in downtown SF, they’re simply closing a small city target that’s, again, far from transit next to a highway.

Is this a cause-and-effect, though? If I knew a store was going to be a consistent target, have situations of flash mob burglaries, etc……..I’m not going to that store. Are they underperforming because of the crime that’s occurring is keeping customers away?

[Garrett]

Target is opening a new location in Harlem about a mile away in a couple months. Citing crime seems… odd.

New York City is in a blue state. Thus, it must be Mad Max.

Red states, as you ought know, are bastions of culture and sophistication. They are civilized perhaps to a fault.

Frankly, it’s a lot easier to blame crime and not spook investors than it is to just say the stores were underperforming. I can only directly speak for the Harlem location, but it’s super far from any subway line, in a massive car centric development next to a highway, collocated with an Aldi and a Costco. From what I’ve read on twitter it sounds like a lot of these stores are simply in bad, underperforming locations where even locals didn’t know they were there. There’s still gonna be a target in downtown SF, they’re simply closing a small city target that’s, again, far from transit next to a highway.

Is this a cause-and-effect, though? If I knew a store was going to be a consistent target, have situations of flash mob burglaries, etc……..I’m not going to that store. Are they underperforming because of the crime that’s occurring is keeping customers away?

Yeah it’s certainly a little of both, but I think just saying crime is the sole issue is easier. One of the “SF” locations is in Pittsburg, a suburb 40 miles away from SF, in a standard suburban strip mall. I think it’s a partial truth with a heavy dose of spin because $$$