Omaha Eppley Airfield - DISCUSSION

[joleo]

Question for the airline stats crew though. When we arrived last night (~8p) on Southwest the pilot's "welcome to Omaha" announcement also included a line for passengers connecting to another flight; I didn't think we actually hosted layovers.

More than likely this was a flight crew at the end of long day that forgot where they were at. In your specific case here, at 8ish on a Saturday night, your plane and every other plane was going to spend the night in Omaha so there literally were no flights to connect to.

Now the connecting traffic question is a little more difficult to answer and I think something might have potentially changed recently...

When BuildOMA is complete 1) will we have connecting flights, 2) are they lumped in the general passenger PDEW numbers, 3) are passengers with Omaha origin/destination tracked separately from those just passing through to a different final destination, and 4) if we do become a mid-continent layover spot, is there an significant bump expected in PDEW numbers?

1) Probably, and I think we actually might now. Fellow board user joleo had always contended that Southwest would allow actual connections at an airport that had a full service sit down restaurant. This is something Eppley obviously lacks, but will get in the terminal upgrade.

There are likely some connecting passengers already. How many? No clue... For years Southwest has allowed through connections at Eppley if it is the same plane i.e. if the plane is going to do DEN-->OMA-->MDW someone in DEN wanting go to MDW could book the flight through OMA as a 1 stop with no plane change. In Southwest's case on flights like this the passenger doesn't even have to get off the plane in OMA.

I hadn't looked for awhile before today, but I almost instantly found an actual plane change connecting flight on Southwest. So i'm not sure what if anything changed regarding joleo's restaurant policy with them or when it might have changed.

This was from a dummy booking for a ticket from Las Vegas to St. Louis.
United will also allow connections through OMA on their website, but they're priced in a way to make them look really unattractive.

A dummy booking from SFO to ORD

How meaningful are these connections right now and going forward? I'm honestly not sure. I would be curious to know how many are happening now for starters. I doubt it is all that significant. Like I said United is basically begging you not to do it, and on Southwest even where it is offered it probably isn't going to be typically anywhere near your best option i.e. on that LAS-STL there are 5 non-stop flights plenty of other options for connecting too, etc. Lastly the other factor is our spot geographically. For SW specifically, we're in the middle of two very big operations for them in DEN and MDW, one pretty big one in STL, and one growing but still way bigger than us in MCI. You are going to be much more likely to go through one of those airports just based on the number of flights and destinations they see versus OMA.

2) An actual connecting passenger i.e. got off a plane and went to another gate would look like a regular passenger on Eppley's monthly stats. I'm honestly not sure how the through passengers on the same plane for SW are handled.

3) Yes. PDEW is the measure for Origin and Destination travel. No connecting passengers would show up here, because all it is tracking is how many people are coming or going out of Eppley as their starting or final destination, hence Passengers Daily Each Way (PDEW).

4) So no here because it doesn't impact PDEW at all. It would be a bump in overall passengers for the airport. Like I said though there are other factors at play that I think make this scenario unlikely in general too for the operational reasons mentioned above.

The one thing where connecting passengers come into play in relation to PDEW is the following. OMA's PDEW with SAN was 77 in one of the quarters last year. Theoretically if you were starting to get connecting passengers, you would be more likely to potentially see some of these borderline routes served as you could back-fill with connecting traffic if timed right.

Wow, this is new! Southwest didn't allow connections in OMA because they didn't have a full service restaurant! They must have changed their policy within the last year! I wonder if this was on purpose or just changed with part of their software changes. Very interesting, good catch!

[FishFighter92]

Wow, this is new! Southwest didn't allow connections in OMA because they didn't have a full service restaurant! They must have changed their policy within the last year! I wonder if this was on purpose or just changed with part of their software changes. Very interesting, good catch!

Maybe they changed their standards and North Hangar qualifies?

[almighty_tuna]

Wow, this is new! Southwest didn't allow connections in OMA because they didn't have a full service restaurant! They must have changed their policy within the last year! I wonder if this was on purpose or just changed with part of their software changes. Very interesting, good catch!

Maybe they changed their standards and North Hangar qualifies?

Oof, that's like RyanAir low standards

[Mr.Nuke]

Wow, this is new! Southwest didn't allow connections in OMA because they didn't have a full service restaurant! They must have changed their policy within the last year! I wonder if this was on purpose or just changed with part of their software changes. Very interesting, good catch!

I was surprised when I looked. I still don't think it is likely to have a significant impact in the near to medium term given that on almost every (potentially every) conceivable route pairing on Southwest that would connect at Eppley, you have multiple direct flights already i.e. LAS-STL etc. And if for some reason you didn't want to take a direct flight on one of those routes, stopping in Omaha is likely to be one of many one-stop options.

[Bearcat06]

Apparently it's been 5 years since AA's last Mad Dog flight out of OMA.

[joleo]

Wow, this is new! Southwest didn't allow connections in OMA because they didn't have a full service restaurant! They must have changed their policy within the last year! I wonder if this was on purpose or just changed with part of their software changes. Very interesting, good catch!

I was surprised when I looked. I still don't think it is likely to have a significant impact in the near to medium term given that on almost every (potentially every) conceivable route pairing on Southwest that would connect at Eppley, you have multiple direct flights already i.e. LAS-STL etc. And if for some reason you didn't want to take a direct flight on one of those routes, stopping in Omaha is likely to be one of many one-stop options.

It helps in 3 situations get additional passengers to eppley.
1-Irregular opps in other cities when all nonstop flights are full. ie...bad weather in Denver.
2-DEN to DCA. Southwest doesn't fly this route and passengers can connect in OMA. Southwest does fly the DEN-OMA-DCA as a same plane service sometimes though, not all the time.
3-When something crazy is going on...for example the Cardinals playing the Rockies and all nonstop flights are full, people are willing to connect via OMA.

It would also help if Southwest flew a thin route, like OMA-SAN or OMA-LAX. Could potentially pick up a few connecting passengers if times work from MDW, DCA, STL, BNA and even if just 10 per flight, that can make a significant difference if the flight works or not.

[SkyWarrior55]

https://thepointsguy.com/news/american- ... 5-network/

PHL is back!

[joleo]

https://thepointsguy.com/news/american- ... 5-network/

PHL is back!

Wow! Didn't expect this...great news!

[Mr.Nuke]

https://thepointsguy.com/news/american- ... 5-network/

PHL is back!

Wow! Didn't expect this...great news!

With the NEA with JetBlue being blocked it had been speculated that AA may want to put more back into PHL. They had already announced the return of XNA so with with DSM and OMA now they're getting fairly close to their pre-pandemic and pre NEA routes out of PHL.

[joleo]

https://thepointsguy.com/news/american- ... 5-network/

PHL is back!

Wow! Didn't expect this...great news!

With the NEA with JetBlue being blocked it had been speculated that AA may want to put more back into PHL. They had already announced the return of XNA so with with DSM and OMA now they're getting fairly close to their pre-pandemic and pre NEA routes out of PHL.

Any rumors of OMA-EWR returning on United ever? Anybody have any insight info from airport administration?

[Bob from Omaha]

Quick question. What's the PDEW to PHL?

[joleo]

Quick question. What's the PDEW to PHL?

63 passengers each way in April-June, 2023.

EWR is only 49 passengers but would go way up because many of those passengers are using LGA right now. A friend of mine goes to Jersey for work and he flies to LGA right now to get a nonstop on AA instead of flying United pre-covid.

[SkyWarrior55]

If I am not mistaken United and Delta have yet to announce their summer 2025 schedules. EWR and others may return or new destinations may be added.

[Bob from Omaha]

Quick question. What's the PDEW to PHL?

63 passengers each way in April-June, 2023.

EWR is only 49 passengers but would go way up because many of those passengers are using LGA right now. A friend of mine goes to Jersey for work and he flies to LGA right now to get a nonstop on AA instead of flying United pre-covid.

The 49 PDEW are non connecting pax getting off the plane and enjoying the beauty of Newark. The ones connecting, possibly overseas, aren't part of the 49. Same with the 63 to PHL. They are getting off the plane & going to Pat's King of Steaks.

[joleo]

Quick question. What's the PDEW to PHL?

63 passengers each way in April-June, 2023.

EWR is only 49 passengers but would go way up because many of those passengers are using LGA right now. A friend of mine goes to Jersey for work and he flies to LGA right now to get a nonstop on AA instead of flying United pre-covid.

The 49 PDEW are non connecting pax getting off the plane and enjoying the beauty of Newark. The ones connecting, possibly overseas, aren't part of the 49. Same with the 63 to PHL. They are getting off the plane & going to Pat's King of Steaks.

Correct. Same with Philly.

[Bob from Omaha]

Quick question. What's the PDEW to PHL?

63 passengers each way in April-June, 2023.

EWR is only 49 passengers but would go way up because many of those passengers are using LGA right now. A friend of mine goes to Jersey for work and he flies to LGA right now to get a nonstop on AA instead of flying United pre-covid.

The 49 PDEW are non connecting pax getting off the plane and enjoying the beauty of Newark. The ones connecting, possibly overseas, aren't part of the 49. Same with the 63 to PHL. They are getting off the plane & going to Pat's King of Steaks.

Correct. Same with Philly.

My point before was that I would think PDEW is fluid not fixed. Non stop to PHL? Could possibly create demand. Non stop to BOS? Could create demand. OMA has been on a roll the past few years, absent covid, and destinations and frequency grew as well.

[joleo]

Quick question. What's the PDEW to PHL?

63 passengers each way in April-June, 2023.

EWR is only 49 passengers but would go way up because many of those passengers are using LGA right now. A friend of mine goes to Jersey for work and he flies to LGA right now to get a nonstop on AA instead of flying United pre-covid.

The 49 PDEW are non connecting pax getting off the plane and enjoying the beauty of Newark. The ones connecting, possibly overseas, aren't part of the 49. Same with the 63 to PHL. They are getting off the plane & going to Pat's King of Steaks.

Correct. Same with Philly.

My point before was that I would think PDEW is fluid not fixed. Non stop to PHL? Could possibly create demand. Non stop to BOS? Could create demand. OMA has been on a roll the past few years, absent covid, and destinations and frequency grew as well.

Nonstop flights added in new city pairs typically generate a big bump 50%-100% in PDEW for lots of reasons. Less blead to KC, generates trips from passengers that otherwise would not have flown are the big two reasons.

[Bob from Omaha]

Item 3 on the Board agenda is Terminal Concession Agreements.

I'm curious what will be coming & who will be the overall concessionaire.

[Mr.Nuke]

Item 3 on the Board agenda is Terminal Concession Agreements.

I'm curious what will be coming & who will be the overall concessionaire.

I'm like a week and a half behind on responding to stuff pdew east coast hubs, etc. and I will go back and do it, I promise, but you should seriously send them a message and ask who got it after the meeting. I think we'll eventually know, but the vagueness in the agenda item versus other contracts makes me think we probably won't know "all that soon" otherwise.

[Greg S]

Item 3 on the Board agenda is Terminal Concession Agreements.

I'm curious what will be coming & who will be the overall concessionaire.

I'm like a week and a half behind on responding to stuff pdew east coast hubs, etc. and I will go back and do it, I promise, but you should seriously send them a message and ask who got it after the meeting. I think we'll eventually know, but the vagueness in the agenda item versus other contracts makes me think we probably won't know "all that soon" otherwise.

Yeah this will be interesting to see. Really looking forward to Eppley upgrading on concessions. That's an area where they are at or near the bottom.

[Bob from Omaha]

Item 3 on the Board agenda is Terminal Concession Agreements.

I'm curious what will be coming & who will be the overall concessionaire.

I'm like a week and a half behind on responding to stuff pdew east coast hubs, etc. and I will go back and do it, I promise, but you should seriously send them a message and ask who got it after the meeting. I think we'll eventually know, but the vagueness in the agenda item versus other contracts makes me think we probably won't know "all that soon" otherwise.

Yeah this will be interesting to see. Really looking forward to Eppley upgrading on concessions. That's an area where they are at or near the bottom.

It is a weak point but OMA is definitely not alone at the bottom. Of the many airports I fly through in a year I can count on one hand with fingers left over the number of airports that actually have even just good food. From the RFQ for OMA it seemed like they were making at least an effort to up their game.

[FishFighter92]

Landside is actually not horrible though, when everything is open.

[joleo]

Item 3 on the Board agenda is Terminal Concession Agreements.

I'm curious what will be coming & who will be the overall concessionaire.

I'm like a week and a half behind on responding to stuff pdew east coast hubs, etc. and I will go back and do it, I promise, but you should seriously send them a message and ask who got it after the meeting. I think we'll eventually know, but the vagueness in the agenda item versus other contracts makes me think we probably won't know "all that soon" otherwise.

Yeah this will be interesting to see. Really looking forward to Eppley upgrading on concessions. That's an area where they are at or near the bottom.

It is a weak point but OMA is definitely not alone at the bottom. Of the many airports I fly through in a year I can count on one hand with fingers left over the number of airports that actually have even just good food. From the RFQ for OMA it seemed like they were making at least an effort to up their game.

I'm curious what Airports the size of Omaha or larger are worse when it comes to food selection? I've been to at least 50 different airports in the US and I can't think of a worse one. Even super small airports are great sometimes with local sandwiches that are homemade right in front of you. Living in Des Moines, the food at the airport is good here beyond security. Salads and flatbreads at one restaurant. The other is sit down made to order food...think bar and grill food but good. You can also drink a beer anywhere in the terminal here in DSM just like you can at many airports around the nation. Love grabbing a beer and a flatbread/ salad and then heading to my gate to eat and drink it. Hope Eppley fixes this as well. ORD and MDW let you do this too. They just need to update the liquor license to include the whole airport terminal.

[Greg S]

Item 3 on the Board agenda is Terminal Concession Agreements.

I'm curious what will be coming & who will be the overall concessionaire.

I'm like a week and a half behind on responding to stuff pdew east coast hubs, etc. and I will go back and do it, I promise, but you should seriously send them a message and ask who got it after the meeting. I think we'll eventually know, but the vagueness in the agenda item versus other contracts makes me think we probably won't know "all that soon" otherwise.

Yeah this will be interesting to see. Really looking forward to Eppley upgrading on concessions. That's an area where they are at or near the bottom.

It is a weak point but OMA is definitely not alone at the bottom. Of the many airports I fly through in a year I can count on one hand with fingers left over the number of airports that actually have even just good food. From the RFQ for OMA it seemed like they were making at least an effort to up their game.

I'm curious what Airports the size of Omaha or larger are worse when it comes to food selection? I've been to at least 50 different airports in the US and I can't think of a worse one. Even super small airports are great sometimes with local sandwiches that are homemade right in front of you. Living in Des Moines, the food at the airport is good here beyond security. Salads and flatbreads at one restaurant. The other is sit down made to order food...think bar and grill food but good. You can also drink a beer anywhere in the terminal here in DSM just like you can at many airports around the nation. Love grabbing a beer and a flatbread/ salad and then heading to my gate to eat and drink it. Hope Eppley fixes this as well. ORD and MDW let you do this too. They just need to update the liquor license to include the whole airport terminal.

Yeah for the size they are at the bottom for me. Not just options either. Hours are rough, both for opening and closing. Selection not good. When they do open they get overwhelmed. No real positives.

[FishFighter92]

Hours are indeed rough, but I bet it is due to lack of demand. A vending machine could work some small wonders. I have definitely ordered coffee from a robot arm at an airport before.

[skinzfan23]

[GenX]

That’s the mini tower crane I mentioned previously.

[Bob from Omaha]

A few more...

[Brad]

A few more...

These are at least a month old. Someone posted them in this thread a couple pages back.

[Bob from Omaha]

The airport board meeting is tomorrow. I'll give them a day or so to post the stats & also message them about the concessions contract. They're actually very nice & accommodating about questions. They usually respond within a day or so.

[SkyWarrior55]

https://simpleflying.com/nebraska-airpo ... s-lincoln/

Article comparing OMA and LNK. Thoughts?

[NEDodger]

https://simpleflying.com/nebraska-airpo ... s-lincoln/

Article comparing OMA and LNK. Thoughts?

Consider me dubious on their statement that OMA operates 15,700 Southwest flights per month.

[riceweb]

https://www.facebook.com/share/p/1xaTDRzqkNBCv8eW/

Dining and retail announced for Eppley. Fantastic update.

[Garrett]

That’s a pretty incredible mix of local spots. Thrilled to finally have Runza at the airport, but also surprising to see the likes of Block 16 and Pitch!

[skinzfan23]

Couldn't love this more....this is exactly what I was hoping to see!!! Getting the NE and local flair for fast food with Runza. But adding Block 16, Pitch and Fernando's are all solid Omaha eateries as well.

Also noticed that Hollywood Candy has a spot as well.

[TitosBuritoBarn]

This is an excellent lineup! Hollywood Candy is a nice touch.

[skinzfan23]

Just bringing the image over here:

[skinzfan23]

Also, another solid month for airport: up 6.9% for August and 6.8% YTD

[almighty_tuna]

This really checks every box; top notch local representation and recognizable national chains for those who just want something familiar. Chicken Guy was not expected at all. Big win all around.

[skinzfan23]

When is the expected opening date for these restaurants? 2026? 2027? Hopefully before the terminal is completely done.